Rumor: Mikhail Grigorenko Arbitration Numbers

[Foppa]

I don't think Greg (at least the Avs version) fits with this derogatory "Russian" stereotype. Saw nothing to indicate that he is not a hard-worker - in fact he's developed a reputation for being a really hard worker in practice and supremely modest, his two-way game is actually more advanced than we could have hoped, he's a really smart player and a poised playmaker with nice vision.

If anything is overrated about him, it's that he's not as supremely physically skilled as he may have been hyped up as when he was a draft prospect. His vision is superb but everything else he really gets by on with just being a good decision maker. His future is probably a "support" piece on a scoring line.

Avs fans have certainly seen enough to be, at the very least, very intrigued by his potential and he is nowhere near a bust.

 

[Foppa]

http://flamesnation.ca/2012/6/20/mikhail-grigorenko-why-is-he-falling

There is something off about the kid. His talent relative to peers keeps going backwards. I think he could play at the NHL as a third or four line to-way player but that would mean revamping his game. I don't see it. Sabres knew it. Gamble for Avs was minor -- he was least important part of deal for O'Reilly in my opinion. If they can turn the kid into 3rd line player, deal will look much better for them.

You really don't see it.

 

[Dubi Doo]

Grigorenko can become a good player in this league if he can learn to use his size to buy some time for his playmaking to shine. Unfortunately a lot of players can never adjust to the physicality of the NHL.

His faceoff percentage is putrid, but his skills favor that of a center ( Creative, good size, playmaker, decent defensively). I don't know how his skill will translate to a winger because he's not very fast, which you hope to have on your wings for a well-oiled transition game. I doubt he'll reach his full potential as a winger. He'd be best suited working on his game at the dot, and centering a secondary scoring line, imo.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

I don't think Greg (at least the Avs version) fits with this derogatory "Russian" stereotype. Saw nothing to indicate that he is not a hard-worker - in fact he's developed a reputation for being a really hard worker in practice and supremely modest, his two-way game is actually more advanced than we could have hoped, he's a really smart player and a poised playmaker with nice vision.

If anything is overrated about him, it's that he's not as supremely physically skilled as he may have been hyped up as when he was a draft prospect. His vision is superb but everything else he really gets by on with just being a good decision maker. His future is probably a "support" piece on a scoring line.

Avs fans have certainly seen enough to be, at the very least, very intrigued by his potential and he is nowhere near a bust.

The Avs really need to develop or acquire a sniper. If they managed to pair Grigorenko with a Toffoli or someone of that ilk I think both players would benefit greatly.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Yakupov has shown he can produce at the NHL level (31 pts in 48 games in his rookie year)..whereas Grigerenko really hasn't. Not sure how Grigerenko could use him as a comp

And in the three seasons since his rookie year, Yakupov has been scoring at a 30-35pt pace over 82 games.

And, during that shortened season, there were numerous anomalies. Guys like Kadri, Kunitz and Parenteau were PPG (or near PPG) players. Who's to say that Yakupov's numbers that season weren't in that group of outliers?

 

[The Kingslayer]

As a Sabres fan, yes, he's talented, but the Russian curse (having the tools but not producing/even trying) is catching up onto him

Thats ridiculous. He played 90% of the time on the 4th line relearning how to hockey since your Sabres rushed him and nearly killed all his confidence. His effort was not the issue whatsoever his linemates were 4th line plugs you cant expect much production in that situation. As soon as he got elevated to the top 6 he looked very good. Alot of work to still be done but I think most Av fans are very happy we have him.

 

[AvsGuy]

The Avs really need to develop or acquire a sniper. If they managed to pair Grigorenko with a Toffoli or someone of that ilk I think both players would benefit greatly.

Thanks, I was hungry, now I'm drooling

 

[JarvisFunk]

And in the three seasons since his rookie year, Yakupov has been scoring at a 30-35pt pace over 82 games.

And, during that shortened season, there were numerous anomalies. Guys like Kadri, Kunitz and Parenteau were PPG (or near PPG) players. Who's to say that Yakupov's numbers that season weren't in that group of outliers?

To play Devil's advocate, the following season is when Eakins was bestowed upon the Oilers. And of all the players to have overall performance drop off because of him, Yakupov seemed to be hit the hardest, and still hasn't come close to regaining his play.

 

[Foppa]

In February after coming back from a short-erm illness, Grigorenko's role and ice time went way up and for the final couple months of the season, he scored 15 points in 33 games whiles averaging about 16 minutes of ice per night. There's some advanced statage somewhere in the Avs forum that looked at his impact on other players like Duchene when he was on their line and it was very positive - due to his playmaking ability and IQ (even when not on the scoresheet).

Nobody is looking at Grigorenko like the best thing since sliced bread or trying to hype him up into a star. But he was a very pleasant surprise, especially when given a larger role and all signs have pointed to very promising development with the Avs. He is intriguing and versatile and some of these evaluations by Sabres fans are either just out-dated or flat-out reek of BS.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

To play Devil's advocate, the following season is when Eakins was bestowed upon the Oilers. And of all the players to have overall performance drop off because of him, Yakupov seemed to be hit the hardest, and still hasn't come close to regaining his play.

And Grigorenko spent his first 3 NHL seasons being mishandled by Buffalo.

Regardless of the reasons why, they were both about 30 pt players last season.

 

[WeDislikeEich]

Most likely yes, it would have been a 2-way QO. Grigorenko didn't hit the thresholds to have a mandatory 1-way QO.

Grigorenko was unwilling to accept a 2 way deal in Buffalo the offseason before he was traded. Tim Murray even brought it up to the press (I believe because he was pretty frustrated by trying to deal with Grigo). He said something like "I don't know why Grigorenko's scared of a 2 way deal because if he's what he says he is, he'd never make it through wavers anyway".

He was traded shortly after that and the Avs gave him the 1 way deal he was looking for.
I wonder if they are trying to give him a 2 way deal now? I know Grigo's had a big concern in buffalo about his pay level in Juniors/AHL. He even initially refused his assignment to juniors because of it. He said he had to take care of his mom/family back home.

Starting to look like Grigorenko could possibly be a tough player to negotiate with. But it's still too early to actually say he is.

 

[sabresEH]

He got rushed in Buffalo and that killed his confidence. At the end of last year, he showed glimpses of why he was drafted so high. If he can keep his head on straight, there's no reason he can't be a very solid top 6 winger.

On topic, I don't think Grigorenko's ask is really that far off from what he's worth. If Yakupov is worth $2.5m, Grigorenko is easily worth $1.65m.

The kid rushed himself, he wouldn't report back to junior and we didn't want to send him to Russia. Unfortunately that was a lost year of development for him but he seems to be back on track.

Edit: Darcy definitely rushed him. Pretty sure he played 20 something games in the lockout shortened season when he should have just stayed in junior. The next year is when he rushed himself as we wanted him to go back to junior but he wouldn't report. Either way both parties were in the wrong and now he seems to be back on track with Colorrado. Glad to see as I always liked him. I remember watching pre draft interviews and I always thought if one of those 2 russians(Yaks and Grigs) leaves for the KHL it will be Yakupov even thought the general consensus thought Grigs would bolt first chance he got.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

The kid rushed himself, he wouldn't report back to junior and we didn't want to send him to Russia. Unfortunately that was a lost year of development for him but he seems to be back on track.

His first two years were lost years of development. Playing 10 minutes a game for 25 games his rookie year wasn't doing anything but burning a year of his ELC. Playing 11 minutes a game for 18 games before being sent back to juniors didn't do anything to help his development either.

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

You really don't see it.

Enjoy him and we in Buffalo will enjoy Ryan O'Reilly. Nikita Zadorov was the guy we hated losing.

 

[Muffin]

Enjoy him and we in Buffalo will enjoy Ryan O'Reilly. Nikita Zadorov was the guy we hated losing.

Look out for Compher this season...

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Would honestly pay him 1.65M for next year easily. Guy will be worth every penny of it if he can play Top 6 minutes all year with Duchene.


He's extremely underrated, this thread proves that.

 

[is the answer jesus]

Look out for Compher this season...

Compher is the real prize of that deal for Colorado. Zadorov will be a good physical 2nd pairing d-man it definitely stung to lose him. I don't think Grigorenko ever amounts to much. He's got the talent, but in his time in Buffalo he seemed disinterested in engaging in puck battles or consistently putting forth high-effort. People can blame the Sabres all they want for their mishandling of Grigorenko. He was definitely rushed and wasn't given enough minutes to develop properly which are valid points. On the other hand, Grigorenko looked lost/disinterested the majority of his time with the big club. He didn't show enough to warrant increased ice time and that's on him.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Compher is the real prize of that deal for Colorado. Zadorov will be a good physical 2nd pairing d-man it definitely stung to lose him. I don't think Grigorenko ever amounts to much. He's got the talent, but in his time in Buffalo he seemed disinterested in engaging in puck battles or consistently putting forth high-effort. People can blame the Sabres all they want for their mishandling of Grigorenko. He was definitely rushed and wasn't given enough minutes to develop properly which are valid points. On the other hand, Grigorenko looked lost/disinterested the majority of his time with the big club. He didn't show enough to warrant increased ice time and that's on him.

Grigorenko also only played a grand total of 63 games over 3 seasons with the Sabres. As a comparison, Tyson Barrie also looked pretty bad in his first 60 NHL games. He had a few games where he looked OK, but mostly looked out of his depth and ended up back in the AHL as a result.

In 74 games with the Avs, there was no evidence that Grigorenko wasn't putting in effort or was lost. In fact, he worked his way up to a top 6 position by the end of the year. If he continues his play from the end of the season, he'll probably start the year in the top 6, and we'll see what he can do.

 

[Bfreezy40]

He still is...

He's not at all he's at best a 3rd line player won't ever touch what "He coulda been" with the Sabres messing up his development..

 

[Bfreezy40]

Look out for Compher this season...

Yeah Compher is gonna be a beast i hate that we traded him more then the other 2..

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

He's not at all he's at best a 3rd line player won't ever touch what "He coulda been" with the Sabres messing up his development..

He had 12 points in his last 27 games this last season, after getting moved up to the top 6.

 

[Rebuilt]

If the Avs dont think hes worth 1.65mil the Oilers will take him. What do you want for your supposed 'scrub' ?

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

If the Avs dont think hes worth 1.65mil the Oilers will take him. What do you want for your supposed 'scrub' ?

The only people knocking him in this thread are Sabres fans.

I think most Avs fans would happily give him $1.65m, based on how he played once he earned top 6 minutes. I think the Avs offered less to ensure they had wiggle room to keep Barrie and MacKinnon.

 

[Beerz]

I think Grigs will be fine.

 

[Sens]

He had 12 points in his last 27 games this last season, after getting moved up to the top 6.

The advanced stats also show everyone he played with had their production go up... He's going to break out 40-50Pts this season