Media Rant

Striiker

Earthquake Survivor
Jun 2, 2013
89,705
155,794
Pennsylvania
OK, so before I start this I want to make it clear that this isn't aimed at Tony Androckitis. He made the tweet that I disagree with, the one that made me think about this, but he's not part of the problem that I'm about to complain about. You'll see what I mean.

So, I'm following the Flyers preseason game on Twitter, since it wasn't on TV or streamed anywhere, and I stumble across these tweets in response to all the fans complaining about lack of a stream or broadcast.




I disagree. I really, really disagree.

Of course my first reaction is "So what's wrong with wanting first hand knowledge? Obviously Flyers fans want to watch the Flyers games for ourselves...".

But what I really had a problem with was that the blame was being directed at fans for media jobs dying out, as if we're being ungrateful or unreasonable. No, that's not what's going on at all. What's killing media jobs? The majority of the media being obsolete and awful at their jobs is what's killing media jobs.

Look at the perfect examples, Sam Carchidi and Tim Pannacio. They have more access to the team than most of the writers/bloggers/reporters that actually do a good job, and yet they are two of the most unreliable, and least valuable, sources out there.

They aren't any more knowledgeable than the fans, so what's their purpose? What do they provide? Well you could say that they provide access to the players, coaches, and management, that the fans don't have, in the form of direct quotes that we wouldn't get otherwise. But do they do a good job there? No, not at all. They ask questions that beg for (and receive) cookie cutter cliche answers, they ask questions that they know won't/can't be answered, and they ask questions that have ridiculously obvious answers.

Q- "What went wrong tonight?"
A- "Well Manning made a terrible pinch and then Mason let in a soft goal at the end there, which really screwed us"

Is that what they expect? Do they hope that the players will throw each other under the bus so they have drama to write about? Of course that's not going to happen.
Unless they're interviewing a lunatic like Tortorella, the answer they'll realistically get is along the lines of:
"Well we just didn't play our game tonight and we have to be better."

Wow, super insightful.

So what are we really gaining from them? What incentives do we have to come back to them for information? These days anything that we could possibly want to know is online. Schedules, highlights, raw statistics, contract details, team salary cap situations, and anything else we might search for is available to us through many different websites. This isn't like a few decades ago when the only way you could find things out is through the media by reading the newspaper, watching the news, or listening to the radio.

Since that's no longer the case, the media members who warrant our support and attention are ones that provide us with unique and valuable insight. People like Tony Androckitis (AHL news that we might not see otherwise since the AHL isn't nearly as visible as the NHL), Bob MacKenzie (information gathered from scouts about prospects and one of the most reliable sources of NHL rumors), Bill Meltzer (an intelligent/informed viewpoint and source of information), and even non-professional media sources like Appleyard (updates on European prospects and in depth articles/posts about all Flyers players/prospects showing statistics that are a result of more research than most of us are willing to do). Those are the types of people who deserve to have jobs, not the lazy beats I mentioned above who provide nothing of real value. Unfortunately, those media members heavily outnumber the good ones, which is a shame.

What's really killing media jobs is the media members. Lazy, uninformed, arrogant media members who don't take their jobs seriously and don't care enough to work at being a truly informative source. They'll just keep tossing out their short articles that provide nothing of value because they're somehow able to get away with that. If the non-trash media want to be annoyed at anyone then be annoyed at the people hiring these trash media members, wasting the jobs that the good ones deserve. Maybe we'll start to see a change in the media since many of the bad ones were around before the internet became what it is today, and were actually useful at one point, but refused to evolve with the times. Hopefully as they retire and get replaced by fresh blood we'll see an improvement, but I guess we'll have to see.

TLDR: My jimmies are rustled.
 

FatTugboatFlahr

Registered User
Apr 6, 2012
13,980
14,958
Philadelphia
They know less about the Flyers and Hockey than 75% of this board.

FLYguy breaks more news than the Beats do, only a few of them deserve to be in the position they are.
 

Hurricane28

Angry Flyers STH/Weather Guy
Aug 22, 2012
9,217
9,189
South Jersey
Very well written and I thought the same thing reading Tony's tweet (and like you said nothing against him, I like him and I follow him as he provides very in-depth and good content on the minor leagues). I also follow Charlie from BSH who provides good insight and theres a few others who aren't main stream that are really good.

Non main stream if where I get my news now a days, and it seems to be trending that way. Possibly a new age.
 

Magua

Entirely Palatable Product
Apr 25, 2016
37,546
155,683
Huron of the Lakes
Everyone and their mother has a phone or computer to check box scores concurrently with the game. The lazy beat writer is a dying (expensive) breed because they're a glorified box score with some words and filler quotes thrown in. What draws readers in is analysis and insight and hard work. People like Bill Meltzer or Charlie O'Connor or whoever, I trust and want their opinions after and between every game. I generally trust their eye, their analysis, for particular writers their use of stats, and I trust that they will never gyp me with superficial drivel. In a single article, they will spend more time, do more research, conduct more in-depth interviews than people like Panotch will spend on half a season's worth of his Mad Libs articles.

It's not that the beat writers in general are dying, so much as there are far better, smarter, hardworking ones out there than the Old Boys Club that gets ragged on. It's called survival of the media fittest. Box score summaries just don't do it in the year 2016.
 

Random Forest

Registered User
May 12, 2010
14,452
994
Pretty much, but remember, sports journalism is pretty much bottom of the barrel when it comes to media talent. These guys are, by and large, third-rate hacks for the most part. Very few are truly talented journalists. And frankly, no one who covers the Flyers is what I would consider a talented journalist. A few people are worth reading, but I don't think there's anybody that I consider a must read. As mentioned above, Charlie from BSH is a solid one to follow. Otherwise, it's pretty much all crap as far as I'm concerned.

There's a reason the best sources of information are often amateurs like Appleyard. Those are intelligent people whose expertise is more valuable applied elsewhere. What skills does Timmy P have? He's not even a decent writer. He's a schmuck with friends who got him a job covering the Flyers. That's the extent of that clown's professional skill set.

And with new forms of media, there's a gross oversaturation of pretend journalists who find a blog that will publish their uninformed garbage. Lots of them populate this site and spend their time pushing their own garbage writing because they think they have futures in journalism. But sports journalism, as I said above, is more about having friends at decent publications than being truly talented anyway.


I agree with you. But I also don't really follow anyone in particular for hockey news anymore. They pretty much all suck, and there's only a small handful of journalists whose eye for the game is worth following. I've come to the conclusion that sports journalism (and sports in general, for that matter) will always be run by self-important dolts, so it's best to just not take things too seriously. It's a cynical take, but it is what it is.
 

Rebels57

Former Flyers fan
Sponsor
Sep 28, 2014
76,697
123,242
100% agree with this rant. Its really frustrating. The Flyers and their fans deserve better than hack beat writers.

As for the Tweet from Tony, that was a really off base comment that he hopefully regrets. Its 2016, not 1906. Telling fans they should be satisfied with the beat writers takes on games instead of being able to watch it ourselves is downright asinine.
 

Striiker

Earthquake Survivor
Jun 2, 2013
89,705
155,794
Pennsylvania
They know less about the Flyers and Hockey than 75% of this board.

FLYguy breaks more news than the Beats do, only a few of them deserve to be in the position they are.

Absolutely.

I mean, we dump on Eklund constantly (and for good reason) but even that goof has been more reliable than Carchidi or Pannacio when it comes to rumors.

Very well written and I thought the same thing reading Tony's tweet (and like you said nothing against him, I like him and I follow him as he provides very in-depth and good content on the minor leagues). I also follow Charlie from BSH who provides good insight and theres a few others who aren't main stream that are really good.

Non main stream if where I get my news now a days, and it seems to be trending that way. Possibly a new age.

I'd trust 90% of the people on this board before I trust something those hacks write. My mentality towards them is something they've earned. I didn't start hating them after seeing one bad article, it's repeatedly producing trash that gave them their reputation.

Everyone and their mother has a phone or computer to check box scores concurrently with the game. The lazy beat writer is a dying (expensive) breed because they're a glorified box score with some words and filler quotes thrown in. What draws readers in is analysis and insight and hard work. People like Bill Meltzer or Charlie O'Connor or whoever, I trust and want their opinions after and between every game. I generally trust their eye, their analysis, for particular writers their use of stats, and I trust that they will never gyp me with superficial drivel. In a single article, they will spend more time, do more research, conduct more in-depth interviews than people like Panotch will spend on half a season's worth of his Mad Libs articles.

It's not that the beat writers in general are dying, so much as there are far better, smarter, hardworking ones out there than the Old Boys Club that gets ragged on. It's called survival of the media fittest. Box score summaries just don't do it in the year 2016.

I'll admit I'm lazy when it comes to advanced statistics, I don't discount them but I'm not terribly interested in researching them, so when I see an article where someone has clearly taken the time to go through the numbers and draw conclusions from them, I'm likely to read that article, even if I disagree with their conclusions at times.
 

sabremike

Friend To All Giraffes And Lindy Ruff
Aug 30, 2010
22,880
34,491
Brewster, NY
100% agree with this rant. Its really frustrating. The Flyers and their fans deserve better than hack beat writers.

As for the Tweet from Tony, that was a really off base comment that he hopefully regrets. Its 2016, not 1906. Telling fans they should be satisfied with the beat writers takes on games instead of being able to watch it ourselves is downright asinine.
In fairness to him I thought he was being tounge in cheek with that tweet.
From my own experience you could pretty much take the rant that began this thread and replaced the team and city like a template and it would pretty much be spot on. The Sabres beat writers make me want to bang my head against the wall.
 

Hurricane28

Angry Flyers STH/Weather Guy
Aug 22, 2012
9,217
9,189
South Jersey
Everyone and their mother has a phone or computer to check box scores concurrently with the game. The lazy beat writer is a dying (expensive) breed because they're a glorified box score with some words and filler quotes thrown in. What draws readers in is analysis and insight and hard work. People like Bill Meltzer or Charlie O'Connor or whoever, I trust and want their opinions after and between every game. I generally trust their eye, their analysis, for particular writers their use of stats, and I trust that they will never gyp me with superficial drivel. In a single article, they will spend more time, do more research, conduct more in-depth interviews than people like Panotch will spend on half a season's worth of his Mad Libs articles.

It's not that the beat writers in general are dying, so much as there are far better, smarter, hardworking ones out there than the Old Boys Club that gets ragged on. It's called survival of the media fittest. Box score summaries just don't do it in the year 2016.

Agreed with this, and I stopped reading Panaccio and Carchidi and others because it is the same repetitive nonsense garbage that really provides little to no insight whatsoever. They just repeat each other
 

Striiker

Earthquake Survivor
Jun 2, 2013
89,705
155,794
Pennsylvania
In fairness to him I thought he was being tounge in cheek with that tweet.
From my own experience you could pretty much take the rant that began this thread and replaced the team and city like a template and it would pretty much be spot on. The Sabres beat writers make me want to bang my head against the wall.

Oh absolutely, this problem isn't exclusive to Philly, it's everywhere.

****ing Steve Simmons has a job.... :laugh:

You would think that Toronto of all places would have enough talented and hockey crazy people that the media could be a bit picky with who they hire.

Agreed with this, and I stopped reading Panaccio and Carchidi and others because it is the same repetitive nonsense garbage that really provides little to no insight whatsoever. They just repeat each other

I had to stop following both of them because they would make me legitimately angry when reading their tweets...
 

Hurricane28

Angry Flyers STH/Weather Guy
Aug 22, 2012
9,217
9,189
South Jersey
And it could be in part that most of the readers are complete idiots which is why it is frustrating to us. Someone just asked Carchidi if Weal would make the opening night lineup up? Like what? Have they watched any of the preseason at all. Other than tonight he has been atrocious. With having a lot of readers not really paying attention fully like us, they kind of have to appeal the broader fan base or the lowest common denominator, because they write for a major newspaper
 

JojoTheWhale

CORN BOY
May 22, 2008
33,772
105,338
Completely agree with all of this.

As soon as I stopped reading Panaccio etc, bought a surround sound system for the bedroom so I never have to listen to an announcer again (while still having in-game sounds), and forgot pre/post games existed, I became a much happier sports fan.
 

BillDineen

Former Flyer / Extinct Dinosaur Advisor
Aug 9, 2009
9,375
8,101
Good OP. Couldn't agree more. When I got up this am, my first stop was on here to see a fan's write-up of what actually happened. The beat writers add zero insight, so I don't even bother with their write-ups or tweets. Next stop is Bill's blog.
 

cali101

Registered User
Nov 23, 2014
830
0
And it could be in part that most of the readers are complete idiots which is why it is frustrating to us. Someone just asked Carchidi if Weal would make the opening night lineup up? Like what? Have they watched any of the preseason at all. Other than tonight he has been atrocious. With having a lot of readers not really paying attention fully like us, they kind of have to appeal the broader fan base or the lowest common denominator, because they write for a major newspaper

really? weal may've been uneven but hardly atrocious; he got an assist and dominated in the face-off circle the game before tonight's game.
 

BillDineen

Former Flyer / Extinct Dinosaur Advisor
Aug 9, 2009
9,375
8,101
Flyers TV has "Brayden Schenn Center" on his latest interview. :facepalm:
 

Ryker

Registered User
Oct 3, 2008
4,981
2
Triangle, NC, USA
I didn't know anything about who Tony Androckitis is and what he does. Well, now I know one thing. He's an idiot.
And it could be in part that most of the readers are complete idiots which is why it is frustrating to us. Someone just asked Carchidi if Weal would make the opening night lineup up? Like what? Have they watched any of the preseason at all. Other than tonight he has been atrocious. With having a lot of readers not really paying attention fully like us, they kind of have to appeal the broader fan base or the lowest common denominator, because they write for a major newspaper
I guess they just didn't have first hand knowledge due to a lack of streams.
 

boxcar65

Registered User
Sep 24, 2007
1,545
1,643
Richmond, VA
I agree with Striiker. In today's advent of technology, not to have live game for fans to view is insanity. I've never been impressed with the mentioned beat reporters(other than when they rightfully praise Manning). Sometimes I would love to watch the games in total silence. I think that would almost make for a more enjoyable experience.
 

Hiesenberg

Registered User
Jul 2, 2013
15,576
1,875
In addition to Hextall's Fort Knox like information leaks on the Flyers they lost any "source" made them a little less useful.
 

Striiker

Earthquake Survivor
Jun 2, 2013
89,705
155,794
Pennsylvania
Completely agree with all of this.

As soon as I stopped reading Panaccio etc, bought a surround sound system for the bedroom so I never have to listen to an announcer again (while still having in-game sounds), and forgot pre/post games existed, I became a much happier sports fan.

You telling me that surround sound trick to get rid of the commentary is making me seeeeeeriously consider getting it just for that purpose. :laugh: Not even kidding.
 

Captain Dave Poulin

Imaginary Cat
Apr 30, 2015
68,259
200,342
Tokyo, JP
You telling me that surround sound trick to get rid of the commentary is making me seeeeeeriously consider getting it just for that purpose. :laugh: Not even kidding.

You're not the only one - it's the first thing I thought of :laugh: Unfortunately, I'm too stupid to put something like that together.

Excellent rant, and correct in every particular. As I've said before, I've sat and worked side-by-side repeatedly with sports journalists (outside of Philadelphia) and they couldn't give two ****s about the sport - to a man, they CLEARLY thought it was beneath them. But even more telling is when we would go to the locker rooms or interview areas to ask questions. They have so much trouble coming up with things to ask, especially anything outside the extremely obvious (because they both don't know and don't care), so they end up asking the same thing over and over. It's a joke.

Sometimes I would stand there after I was finished with my questions and there would be these long pauses where they couldn't think of anything to say, but the coach or player would have to indulge them because they were with the big paper in town. Thousands of people like me, who actually do care, were left without jobs when the industry fell apart and these blockheads remain. And you know what? The people coming up through the ranks are going to end up just like them - they are going to think this is all beneath them.
 

Striiker

Earthquake Survivor
Jun 2, 2013
89,705
155,794
Pennsylvania
You're not the only one - it's the first thing I thought of :laugh: Unfortunately, I'm too stupid to put something like that together.

Excellent rant, and correct in every particular. As I've said before, I've sat and worked side-by-side repeatedly with sports journalists (outside of Philadelphia) and they couldn't give two ****s about the sport - to a man, they CLEARLY thought it was beneath them. But even more telling is when we would go to the locker rooms or interview areas to ask questions. They have so much trouble coming up with things to ask, especially anything outside the extremely obvious (because they both don't know and don't care), so they end up asking the same thing over and over. It's a joke.

Sometimes I would stand there after I was finished with my questions and there would be these long pauses where they couldn't think of anything to say, but the coach or player would have to indulge them because they were with the big paper in town. Thousands of people like me, who actually do care, were left without jobs when the industry fell apart and these blockheads remain. And you know what? The people coming up through the ranks are going to end up just like them - they are going to think this is all beneath them.

Yeah, this is the most insane part to me. They seem to have such an odd sense of entitlement and arrogance. As if the players owe them anything. It's honestly infuriating to listen to.

Remember how they threw a tantrum when the Flyers Twitter started announcing the starting goalie? I couldn't believe how upset that made them. There was also a game that the Flyers lost (within the last few seasons, can't remember exactly when) where Giroux left without talking to the media. Again they lose their minds about it. The dude was pissed off that he lost and didn't feel like answering their stupid questions, but to them it's like he killed their dog. They wrote articles condemning him and his leadership skills.

Dude, you have no idea how much I hate them. :laugh:
It's one thing to be bad at their jobs, but they legitmately seem like bad human beings.
 

JojoTheWhale

CORN BOY
May 22, 2008
33,772
105,338
You're not the only one - it's the first thing I thought of :laugh: Unfortunately, I'm too stupid to put something like that together.

You telling me that surround sound trick to get rid of the commentary is making me seeeeeeriously consider getting it just for that purpose. :laugh: Not even kidding.

Do a little research online about it before you make that decision. I don't want you guys to run out and buy it and expect it to work flawlessly. The audio levels can spike because of the mixing in of the announcers and it only works on games broadcast in surround sound, which is most but not all HD games. But I don't hear Phil Simms, and to me, that makes it worthwhile.

Sometimes I would stand there after I was finished with my questions and there would be these long pauses where they couldn't think of anything to say, but the coach or player would have to indulge them because they were with the big paper in town. Thousands of people like me, who actually do care, were left without jobs when the industry fell apart and these blockheads remain. And you know what? The people coming up through the ranks are going to end up just like them - they are going to think this is all beneath them.

Same thing happened on the Flyers beat recently. Jeff Neiburg was a younger guy they hired who at least seemed to understand the game and put in the effort to get better. When the Inquirer cuts came, it was guys like that who were laid off instead of Marcus Hayes or John Smallwood. The problem is that the people reading those newspaper sports sections want to hear from close-minded ogres and the rest of us have moved on, likely never to return.

Now that Kapadia is in Seattle,the closest I get to reading a sports section (other than Derek Bodner) is guys like Rich Hofmann Jr (there's a guy going national eventually) or Jimmy Kempski at the Philly Voice. The Eagles have embraced this by employing Tom Lawlor and Fran Duffy. Look at how much power and influence the early Rotoworld crew has now! At least we live in a time where we can filter out the noise.

Side note: There is still little funnier than John McClain going grumpy grandpa on the Texans' ineptitude.
 

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