Speculation: Mathew Barzal Contract Discussion
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CREW99AW
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I am not getting into another rehash of Tavares. I think we all agree he screwed the organization over by leading the owners & GM to think he would spurn UFA offers and come back to LI.
PK Cronin
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I'm not comparing their situations?
Your point is simply that players say the same type of thing all the time and then do something else. Don't believe everything you hear a player say when they're talking to the media.
CREW99AW
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Correct me if I am wrong,but you are basically saying that because Tavares lied to the organization about his extension,that we can toss out anything Barzal says about his extension.I'm not comparing their situations?
CREW99AW
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Mr Misunderstood
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I see both points going on here, but tend to lean towards your argument. Inventing a conversation that happened between two players is much more of a stretch of "players speak" than if he had just said "I want to win here."
But the point of not trusting what players say to the media is still true, so I'll choose to believe that convo between Barzy and Pulock is 60/40 - real/fake.
CREW99AW
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I could understand the handwringing over Barzal if he was 1-2 yrs from unrestricted free agency, if the isles were struggling to ice a competitive team and repeatedly missing the playoffs.
I am having a tough time understanding why it is difficult to see why Barzal,coming off an ECF appearance, would want to remain a key part of this group.
ScaredStreit
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I was pointing out how 99% of professional hockey players say what they're supposed to say in PR (aka-what the fans want to hear) rather than how they actually feel. That doesn't mean they don't genuinely feel that way, but it means unless you have a Patrick Roy or somebody like that, there's no way of knowing how genuine they're being regardless of their current contract situation. Therefore I take it worth a grain of salt.
CREW99AW
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I get it. After the Tavares fiasco,I don't ever want to see the isles have a star player going into his final yr,saying he is just gonna " test the ufa market". Either the impending ufa is willing to accept the isles offer or I want him moved for the best offer. Isles cannot afford to see 20 something yr old star players walk and be left empty handed.
However, Barzal's current situation is different in a couple of ways and that was my point.
He is a UFA in 4 yrs,not 1.
He is not saying he wants to retire an isles. He is not giving up UFA yrs.
Tavares had 3 playoff appearances in 9 seasons,compared to Barzal's 2 appearances in 3 seasons. Tavares' frustration was understandable. I don't see why Barzal would be frustrated.
Uncle Duke
Heads up, fellas!
I don't want to rehash any of that either, and won't, but we do not "all agree".
CREW99AW
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I also don't want to rehash the Tavares exit. It will be enough for me if Toronto continues to fall short and more of their fans and fanboys in the press, continue to publicly express disappointment with his signing.
Uncle Duke
Heads up, fellas!
Really? I'm not saying he is frustrated because I don't know what's in Barzal's head, but if I'm him I'd feel pretty frustrated playing with Lee and Eberle, particularly with the specific talents Barzal possesses. Further adding to any possible frustration is the fact that the long sought after wing help that could elevate his game isn't anywhere on the horizon right now.
CREW99AW
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So, when Barzal's on a long playoff run and telling the media he and his teammates are having a blast, that this as a lie?
When Pulock tells the press after signing for $5m per, that he had a discussion with Barzal and both agreed that they want to help the team keep this group together,so they are willing to take reasonable extensions that make sense for both sides, it's a lie? Curious,is it Pulock who is the liar or Barzal?
Uncle Duke
Heads up, fellas!
That's quite a leap. WTF is the matter with peoples ability to read and interpret words around here? Where did I suggest or imply that anyone is lying? A player can be having a blast while enjoying a long playoff run, he can tell a teammate/friend that he'd like to stay with the team, he can say and do all kinds of things of a positive nature and be 100% sincere in his words and deeds and still be frustrated with other aspects of a particular situation without ever having uttered a single syllable that is a lie. And as I made clear, I have no idea if he is frustrated. All I said is that it would not surprise me if he is to one degree or another. So is that me calling him a liar in your view of the world?
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CREW99AW
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My view is that Barzal in an interview,described what a drag it was in his first season,when they were out of the playoff picture and playing meaningless games down the stretch.
He would later say during the ECF playoff run that he and his teammates were having a blast.
In 2 of his 3 seasons, he and the isles have made the playoffs. With a new arena about to open,I am having a tough time seeing where the frustration comes in. You do,so go with that.
EXTRAS
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Barzal probably annoyed pulock went public with that conversation after pulock signed. Even if barzal wanted to give a team friendly deal, pulock saying it publicly handcuffs his negotiating a bit. Now even if he signs for 8, which is still pretty good, he kinda looks like he is taking too much. Good one, pu bear!
First thing I thought of after I read his quote. Barzal's agent probably less happy.
13th Floor
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How far along are we on the jump to conclusions mat in this thread?
BrockLobster
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LeapOnOver
Mackenzie is a hack!
We keep revisiting the Tavares thing from time to time and I think (hopefully) we can all agree with the following statements:
1. Players often make general statements when asked about contract negotiations such as "I'm just focused on winning here" "I let my agent worry about that""If it works out I'd like to stay" and general open ended canned statements.
2. Tavares, went above and beyond the canned statements, to the point of almost being adamant that he was staying. It wasn't the typical speech in section 1, and that's what people have a problem with. Not that Tavares left. It's the way he left after saying what he did.
3. In scenario 1 I don't think anyone would call it lying to the press. Those statements can often still come out true, even if they don't resign. They could have still "wanted to win" with team A, but now want to win with team B.
The only reason I'm trying to summarize is because this stuff about Barzal and what he said really shouldn't be compared to Tavares. He's following the stuff that happens in point 1 and he's barely said anything about it to the actual press, if anything at all. He's in a position where he doesn't have many recourses anyway. Let's see what happens when he actually gets closer to UFA status. My guess is he'll still sound like the stuff in point 1, and if he leaves we'll be angry, annoyed, sad or whatever, but it won't be like it was with JT. I'm not sure any player has handled that worse (UFA, not a trade like Muller) or will ever handle it that badly again.
1. Players often make general statements when asked about contract negotiations such as "I'm just focused on winning here" "I let my agent worry about that""If it works out I'd like to stay" and general open ended canned statements.
2. Tavares, went above and beyond the canned statements, to the point of almost being adamant that he was staying. It wasn't the typical speech in section 1, and that's what people have a problem with. Not that Tavares left. It's the way he left after saying what he did.
3. In scenario 1 I don't think anyone would call it lying to the press. Those statements can often still come out true, even if they don't resign. They could have still "wanted to win" with team A, but now want to win with team B.
The only reason I'm trying to summarize is because this stuff about Barzal and what he said really shouldn't be compared to Tavares. He's following the stuff that happens in point 1 and he's barely said anything about it to the actual press, if anything at all. He's in a position where he doesn't have many recourses anyway. Let's see what happens when he actually gets closer to UFA status. My guess is he'll still sound like the stuff in point 1, and if he leaves we'll be angry, annoyed, sad or whatever, but it won't be like it was with JT. I'm not sure any player has handled that worse (UFA, not a trade like Muller) or will ever handle it that badly again.
ScaredStreit
Registered User
So barzal wants to leave? Is that the latest?
Nobody is saying Barzal wants to leave. We're saying to take professional athletes words to the fans with a grain salt because they're saying what they've been trained to say. It's why they all say "I want to be a piece of the puzzle".
Costigan77
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Barzal just posted something on social media. Now it is deleted. Anyone have any insight into what he posted?
PWJunior
Stay safe!
He's frustrated and unhappy so he requested a trade...
SI
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