Proposal: Mason Raymond Update: Attending Toronto Camp on PTO

[thepuckmonster]

4 seasons ago.

Last year he had points in 18 out of 46 games.

THe year before he had points in 17 out of 55 games.

He's pretty consistent at picking up points every 3 or 4 games. So in that respect he's consistent.

Raymond is now 4 seasons removed from his 25 goal season.


Raymond this past year: 10 goals 12 assists in 46 games +2 (not a fan of this stat but you asked for it).

Hansen: 10 goals 17 assists in 47 games +12.

PP time: Raymond 2:07/game Hansen: 1:40/game, also the first year Jannik had any decent amount of PP time period. Year before Hansen had 0:08 to Raymond's 1:00+.

PK time per game 2012/2013: Hansen 2:10 Raymond 1:05.

Jansen is a better defensive player, more dependable, more physical, outscores him, plays tougher matchups, produces more 5 v 5, is a better PKer, doesn't fall down on tight turns, and is a more direct player.

Hansen outperforms a guy who is hand fed offensive situations (big time PP TOI discrepancy between them over the last 5 years) while being a better all around player.

Higgins falls into the same group as Hansen, not to mention he outweighs both by 20 pounds so he brings a "heavier" game to the table.

Thank you for your brains, you explain thing much better than myself.

 

[ddawg1950]

Consistently one of our best and most talented players. A guy who gave his all every night. I don't think we have anyone ready to step into his shoes........including Jensen or Booth. A massive blunder by MG as far as I'm concerned.
I wish him all the best no matter who he ends up with.

In Bizarro world maybe.

Otherwise this is a complete fail.

Bertie, even Ernie is not going to agree with you.

 

[vanuck]

In Bizarro world maybe.

Otherwise this is a complete fail.

Bertie, even Ernie is not going to agree with you.

Hey, are you implying something about him? Rather presumptuous of you.

 

[ddawg1950]

Hey, are you implying something about him? Rather presumptuous of you.

No, I am all for civil rights.

It's civility I have a problem with.

 

[Bertie]

4 seasons ago.

Last year he had points in 18 out of 46 games.

THe year before he had points in 17 out of 55 games.

He's pretty consistent at picking up points every 3 or 4 games. So in that respect he's consistent.

Raymond is now 4 seasons removed from his 25 goal season.


Raymond this past year: 10 goals 12 assists in 46 games +2 (not a fan of this stat but you asked for it).

Hansen: 10 goals 17 assists in 47 games +12.

PP time: Raymond 2:07/game Hansen: 1:40/game, also the first year Jannik had any decent amount of PP time period. Year before Hansen had 0:08 to Raymond's 1:00+.

PK time per game 2012/2013: Hansen 2:10 Raymond 1:05.

Jansen is a better defensive player, more dependable, more physical, outscores him, plays tougher matchups, produces more 5 v 5, is a better PKer, doesn't fall down on tight turns, and is a more direct player.

Hansen outperforms a guy who is hand fed offensive situations (big time PP TOI discrepancy between them over the last 5 years) while being a better all around player.

Higgins falls into the same group as Hansen, not to mention he outweighs both by 20 pounds so he brings a "heavier" game to the table.

I missed the bit where Hansen/Higgins crushed their vertebrae.
On the basis of Raymond having one hell of an injury to overcome and the facts you have produced I would still say we should have stuck by Raymond for another year at least.

 

[arsmaster*]

I missed the bit where Hansen/Higgins crushed their vertebrae.
On the basis of Raymond having one hell of an injury to overcome and the facts you have produced I would still say we should have stuck by Raymond for another year at least.

For how much money?

We're all fans, we get attached to players and it's tough to see them leave, but this club had NO room to keep Raymond and they want to move on from that type of player, and frankly I don't blame them.

By the way, before Raymond "crushed his spine" he had 17 goals and 30 assists in 94 games. That is a 15 goal pace. Not great. Consistent with the following two seasons.

I don't know how you can continue wanting to keep a player who brings very little to the table outside of his skating speed. He doesn't bump anyone from this current lineup and is incredibly easy to play against.

I'm glad we let him look for a place that will give him a better opportunity, because he wasn't getting it here (rightfully so IMO). I don't hate Mason Raymond, I hate having a team full of timid, easily bullied players and I'm glad we've moved on and it seems he's getting a PTO in a place that appreiciates what he can do, good on him.

 

[LeftCoast]

I wouldn't be surprised at all of Raymond had a good season. He's going to get a 1 year deal in the $1M - $1.5M range, so he will be playing for a contract. He could be a good fit on some teams, maybe even Toronto and very conceivably bounce back to 20 - 25 goals.

I like Raymond, but I think his time here has run its course. We need a more physical presence on the wings, and in Vancouver, success will always be defined by how you perform in the playoffs. MayRay has not been a playoff performer.

 

[King of the ES*]

I wouldn't be surprised at all of Raymond had a good season. He's going to get a 1 year deal in the $1M - $1.5M range, so he will be playing for a contract. He could be a good fit on some teams, maybe even Toronto and very conceivably bounce back to 20 - 25 goals.

I like Raymond, but I think his time here has run its course. We need a more physical presence on the wings, and in Vancouver, success will always be defined by how you perform in the playoffs. MayRay has not been a playoff performer.

Me neither. If he makes Toronto, he'll find a way to perform, especially with some of their guys' susceptibility to injury, like Lupul & JVR. Great pickup by Nonis.

With respect to your second paragraph, if we need a more physical presence on the wings, where is it going to come from? Raymond's out, who's in? The answer is nobody. So that is a need that you have correctly identified, and which has gone unfulfilled to-date.

And if success is defined by how you perform in the playoffs, how do you explain Chris Higgins' 4-year deal with an LNTC?

 

[Proto]

Not sure who gets Raymond the puck in Toronto, or where he gets his shots from. They have a lot of volume shooters (Clarkson, Kessel in particular), and not a lot of creative offensive players. It seems like another team where Raymond's penchant for holding on to the puck too long and his lack of creative vision would be a hindrance.

Kadri might be a guy I could see him working with.

 

[dave babych returns]

With respect to your second paragraph, if we need a more physical presence on the wings, where is it going to come from? Raymond's out, who's in? The answer is nobody. So that is a need that you have correctly identified, and which has gone unfulfilled to-date.

Unless the Canucks choose to ice a line with only two skaters in Mason Raymond's absence, replacing him in the lineup with nearly anyone the team has under contract (except Jordan Schroeder.. can't think of anyone else) constitutes addressing the need for more physical presence. In part anyway.

I'm not saying that letting Raymond go in exchange for "whoever" makes us a more skilled or more effective hockey team, just pointing out the latest in your long string of logical fallacies.

Unless of course you think Mason Raymond is a more physical player than Brad Richardson or Tom Sestito or Darren Archibald or.. "whoever."

 

[shortshorts]

Remind me again how many more points Hansen or Higgins scored over Raymond? Or can you give us a +/- comparison.

I really hope Torts brings something extra to this team because we have been running on empty and MG's brain farts for a few years now. Raymond is just one more weight round Gillis's neck imo

I'm one of Raymonds biggest fans and this is the most rediculous post I've ever seen.

 

[MrShift4]

Best of luck to MayRay

 

[Bertie]

I wouldn't be surprised at all of Raymond had a good season. He's going to get a 1 year deal in the $1M - $1.5M range, so he will be playing for a contract. He could be a good fit on some teams, maybe even Toronto and very conceivably bounce back to 20 - 25 goals.

I like Raymond, but I think his time here has run its course. We need a more physical presence on the wings, and in Vancouver, success will always be defined by how you perform in the playoffs. MayRay has not been a playoff performer.

Sadly that can be more than said about many of the players we have kept.....Higgins and Hansen spring to mind but there are more.

 

[King of the ES*]

Unless the Canucks choose to ice a line with only two skaters in Mason Raymond's absence, replacing him in the lineup with nearly anyone the team has under contract (except Jordan Schroeder.. can't think of anyone else) constitutes addressing the need for more physical presence. In part anyway.

I'm not saying that letting Raymond go in exchange for "whoever" makes us a more skilled or more effective hockey team, just pointing out the latest in your long string of logical fallacies.

Provocative point, indeed. Kinda like saying that we're getting bigger by inserting Shinkaruk over Schroeder.

But do what you've got to do to try and convince yourself of Gillis' wizardry, I guess.

 

[dave babych returns]

Provocative point, indeed. Kinda like saying that we're getting bigger by inserting Shinkaruk over Schroeder.

But do what you've got to do to try and convince yourself of Gillis' wizardry, I guess.

Provocative? Sorry buddy, didn't mean to provoke you with basic reasoning.

Swapping Schroeder out for Shinkaruk would be getting bigger. It might not be anything else and it might not make us the biggest team in the league, but it would be that.

You can dispute the importance of it but saying it is not true is just... fundamentally inaccurate. And going around saying "the sky is blue" or "Jordan Schroeder is bigger than Hunter Shinkaruk" or that Mason Raymond has more physical presence than the average NHLer debases the value of discussion here. I won't stand for it.

As for convincing myself of his wizardry, that is obviously what I was doing when I said that losing Raymond does not make us "a more skilled or more effective hockey team."

Nice try, King of the _S.

 

[ddawg1950]

Provocative point, indeed. Kinda like saying that we're getting bigger by inserting Shinkaruk over Schroeder.

But do what you've got to do to try and convince yourself of Gillis' wizardry, I guess.

And you do what you do, which is just so one sided, they lack credibility.

DBR's opinions reflect a grounded, well researched opinion.

Yours reflect a knee jerk attempt to criticize absolutely every move the Canucks make. Your opinions are not well formed or even honest.

 

[Goon42]

I wonder what it would be like between raymond and bolland being team mates now hehe

 

[Drop the Sopel]

Me neither. If he makes Toronto, he'll find a way to perform, especially with some of their guys' susceptibility to injury, like Lupul & JVR. Great pickup by Nonis.

Yeah, so great that Nonis isn't even willing to give him a contract.

 

[Pip]

With respect to your second paragraph, if we need a more physical presence on the wings, where is it going to come from? Raymond's out, who's in? The answer is nobody. So that is a need that you have correctly identified, and which has gone unfulfilled to-date.

Mason Raymond was by far our softest winger, I liked him and am glad to see that he'll have a good shot in Toronto, but any of our other guys stepping in will bring a bigger physical presence.

Our wingers could possibly go like this

D Sedin-Kassian
Burrows-Hansen
Booth-Higgins

All of these players bring a bigger physical presence than Raymond

 

[nameless1]

Yeah, so great that Nonis isn't even willing to give him a contract.

No cap room.
The Leafs still has Franson to sign...
And he will probably eat most...
If not all...
Of the cap room.

Nonis probably wants him...
But Franson is the higher priority.

 

[leftwinglockdown]

Looks like he's really trying to impress the Leafs. Already has an assist and a SH breakaway goal against the Flyers right now.

A little early but a return to form in the East would be pretty good for him.

 

[jigsaw99]

Raymond always dominates in exhibition games. Would not surprise to see him win a spot.

 

[thepuckmonster]

Looks like he's really trying to impress the Leafs. Already has an assist and a SH breakaway goal against the Flyers right now.

A little early but a return to form in the East would be pretty good for him.

It's Steve ****ing Mason and the Flyers' D.

 

[leftwinglockdown]

It's Steve ****ing Mason and the Flyers' D.

And he's taking advantage. Your point?

 

[Tanevian*]

Looks like he's really trying to impress the Leafs. Already has an assist and a SH breakaway goal against the Flyers right now.

A little early but a return to form in the East would be pretty good for him.

A little early? If there is an understatement of the day award it's already yours.