Mark Hunter - Might as well have his own thread

[FreeBird]

So if Lou becomes President of the Islanders would it be any surprise that Hunter will be his GM.

 

[djdev]

i like hunter and i want him to stay but i would be more upset losing the key members of our european scouting staff, since in reality the best signings and drafts picks have come from the other side of the pond in the past few years. at least imo

 

[PromisedLand]

Oh man! Did hunter threaten to quit his job if he didn't get his own thread?

hunter has refused interviews in light of recent events; given how dubas and shanny handled hunter questions; my guess is hunter is going to try his luck with another organization

 

[PromisedLand]

Just so you know, they tried trading the 4th OA for Columbus' 8th OA. But Columbus wasn't down to trade their 2nd round pick with it.

We were targetting Marner/Rantanen at 8th

its because CBJ understands the value of 2nd round pick; unlike the leafs that have twice now thrown it away for to years in a row for a handful of games from Boyle and Plek; meanwhile not turning their pending UFAs like jvr/bozak/komarov etc... into picks.

Bad foresight and bad team/asset management IMO

 

[diceman934]

Yeah, sure. The thing is, if Hunter is worth all the praise he gets as a scout, he should have more to show than a pick that more than half of us here on these boards would have done. So far his resume as an NHL Head Scout is nothing special.

More then half is wrong most wanted the big center and then Hanifin was running second most said Marner was too small not a great skater etc. It was a fantastic pick that only Hunter in the Leafs organization wanted.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Oh man! Did hunter threaten to quit his job if he didn't get his own thread?

He'll take his ball and go home

 

[saltming]

hunter has refused interviews in light of recent events; given how dubas and shanny handled hunter questions; my guess is hunter is going to try his luck with another organization

Perhaps but what position is he going to get?

 

[saltming]

He'll take his ball and go home

I hated that kid! Ruined the fun for everyone.

 

[Kiwi]

Perhaps but what position is he going to get?

Not much quite honestly

Are there any GM jobs available? I can't really think of any

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Is there any reason to worry about Hunter? maybe he likes being a scout. and doesnt care to be a GM. and if so whatever it will suck to lose him but it is what it is.

 

[saltming]

Not much quite honestly

Are there any GM jobs available? I can't really think of any

That's my thought too.
So he's going to pack up to do the same job elsewhere?
If that's true I would think it's best he goes.

 

[diceman934]

Is there any reason to worry about Hunter? maybe he likes being a scout. and doesnt care to be a GM. and if so whatever it will suck to lose him but it is what it is.

He wanted the GM job what is so hard to grasp about that?

Why people think he did not want to be a GM is crazy.

Then the others making him out to be a baby etc. He can go back and run the London Knights team until another offer comes about or maybe this was his only shot. Making like he did not draft well or giving others credit for picks etc

If good scouts are easy to find why did we do so poorly in the draft before he got here. Percy, Biggs, the Goat etc all first picks and all garbage. This goes way back as well..

So far he has hit with all of his first round picks , and a second round pick with another first pick looking like a lock. Never mind all the other picks he drafted still in our system.

He will be missed let’s hope that Shanny offered him something big enough to stay that he is considering right now.

 

[Daisy Jane]

I honestly dont know why people feel Hanifin was ever our target.
that was who Babcock wanted (and I personally feel people are slagging on this kid who could still easily turn out to be a really good pick, defensemen take time to cook. Though for argument's sake I guess we can all agree there is usually 1 dud in the top ten, and it could be him. )

from what I can recall the target was always
Mitch
Provorv/Werenski
that Finnish kid Ratanaen (however you spell his name).

all of whom would be really good Leafs. We have Mitch. I would give credit to hunter for that short list of all who would fit in our organization. He gets a thanks for not picking the dud, but he shouldn't get his butt kissed for picking a stud at 4. It's top 4. that's a given. Butt kissing comes in the later rounds, to which I'm not sure are generating fruit (yet).

I like Hunter. I think regardless of what people feel about what he did in London (I still don't get it, and I don't even think it's bad but i can't argue what I don't really get so that's moot), he has a great eye for talent. I think London has produced more quality NHLers (and out of that group tonnes of captains, cup winners, award winners than anyone else, under his influence).

but if he goes, it's not doooom, dooooom.
you go entice people to take his place. offer them Director of Whatever Name You Make Up and Assistant to the GM, and tonnes of money and access to the private jet.

if he wants to go be GM, let him suck up to the Liewekes in the seattle bid. if he wants to go back to London, let him go to London. But let's also remember from Hunter's own mouth, no NHL team has ever come to him for a job. Ever. And I don't know what he's done in Toronto that everyone is all of a sudden thinking "yeah, he's aces for the job now." It's not a slight on him again, it's just looking at all cards on the table.

 

[Daisy Jane]

If good scouts are easy to find why did we do so poorly in the draft before he got here. Percy, Biggs, the Goat etc all first picks and all garbage. This goes way back as well..
.

let me stop you right here.

you may or may not remember, but Shanahan had an independent auditor review our drafting from the past 10 years. (from when he got hired, obviously). The Leafs are actually tied (at the time) with Detroit for having the most players playing in the NHL drafted by that organization.

The problem wasn't the drafting.
the problem was identifying who was good to keep and who was not.

There was a reason why Morrison (out of the entire drafting department) kept his job. he can find good nuggets out there. but I think we can also agree on that GM's tend to want to have a focus. (to which I have been on the record saying that the scout should be able to get that type - but still focus on skill). But Burke insisted on having those two players - and Gauthier is not garbage. You try having your leg exploded and see how well you develop.

Drafting well in the 1st and 2nd round should be expected. we don't know what his later round picks will be. the Leafs have generally benefited greatly from having the later round picks step up in this organization (Thanks Thommie Bergman, a credit to JFJ as well and again Morrison). If those picks (even 1/3rd pan out, then yah YAY Hunter. but from what I've been told by people here (i mean ones who really follow post draft, like SprDave and 93Leafs, they aren't really sparkling. I could be wrong though)

 

[Guy Boucher]

Dubas has shown an ability to manage an elite AHL franchise. Hunter is an exceptional scout but there's far more to the GM role than scouting alone.

Just ask Jim Benning.

 

[Nithoniniel]

More then half is wrong most wanted the big center and then Hanifin was running second most said Marner was too small not a great skater etc. It was a fantastic pick that only Hunter in the Leafs organization wanted.

Strome was no longer an option.

And if you consider picking a consensus top 5 pick at #4 with almost all guys ranked above him already off the board as fantastic just because not everybody agreed with it, then we clearly have two different definitions of the word.

 

[SprDaVE]

More then half is wrong most wanted the big center and then Hanifin was running second most said Marner was too small not a great skater etc. It was a fantastic pick that only Hunter in the Leafs organization wanted.

You're completely exaggeration the idea that Hunter was alone in wanting Marner. The only report we have here is that Babcock really liked Hanifin.

I'm not sure why you're growing this story that Hunter had to fight off a 100 executives and coaches with one arm tied behind his back to draft Marner. The decision was his own because that was literally his job, one where he debated with Babcock about the selection and he prefered a defenseman. Wow. Let's calm down here.

Our OHL/Ontario scout, the one that originally pushed for Marner as a 15/16 year old with the Knights, probably should be given even more credit. Lindsay Hofford is his name.

Marner was a fantastic pick and one of the favourites to go at #4 and he did. Hunter did very well and deserves full credit.

 

[diceman934]

let me stop you right here.

you may or may not remember, but Shanahan had an independent auditor review our drafting from the past 10 years. (from when he got hired, obviously). The Leafs are actually tied (at the time) with Detroit for having the most players playing in the NHL drafted by that organization.

The problem wasn't the drafting.
the problem was identifying who was good to keep and who was not.

There was a reason why Morrison (out of the entire drafting department) kept his job. he can find good nuggets out there. but I think we can also agree on that GM's tend to want to have a focus. (to which I have been on the record saying that the scout should be able to get that type - but still focus on skill). But Burke insisted on having those two players - and Gauthier is not garbage. You try having your leg exploded and see how well you develop.

Drafting well in the 1st and 2nd round should be expected. we don't know what his later round picks will be. the Leafs have generally benefited greatly from having the later round picks step up in this organization (Thanks Thommie Bergman, a credit to JFJ as well and again Morrison). If those picks (even 1/3rd pan out, then yah YAY Hunter. but from what I've been told by people here (i mean ones who really follow post draft, like SprDave and 93Leafs, they aren't really sparkling. I could be wrong though)

Biggs, Percy, Finn the Goat and the list is long. Morrison is our pro scout by the way and was moved out of amateur scouting as he has been bad.

The goat was a horrible pick... he was bad before his injury.

Jfj who gets ripped on in here was a very good judge of talent.

Our draft record has been beyond bad under Burke and Nonis and it is not sure thing to get a good player in the first round and count your self lucky if you get a NHL player never mind a Dermot type player.

 

[diceman934]

You're completely exaggeration the idea that Hunter was alone in wanting Marner. The only report we have here is that Babcock really liked Hanifin.

I'm not sure why you're growing this story that Hunter had to fight off a 100 executives and coaches to draft Marner. The decision was his own because that was literally his job, one where he debated with Babcock about the selection and he prefered a defenseman. Wow.

Go back and read we were high on the big center as well and it was Hunter who was the one who insisted we take Marner.

You are the one exaggerating....wow

 

[Leafs at Knight]

I still believe Hunter is a great scout but I think you always have to factor what the GM wants as a target. For example, the 2015 draft vs the 2016 draft. 2015 had a very different approach when it was Dubas and Hunter leading the way compared to the 2016 draft under Lou.

If I had to guess, this draft with or without Hunter would be a lot closer to the 2015 draft.

I am personally excited to see this draft. I think that Dubas would likely have a list closer to what us "arm chair GMs" would make, which may sound bad but its been proven that literally just drafting off scoring in junior has better results than drafts done by actual NHL scouts.

Interesting stuff. The last 2 drafts didn't feel like a Hunter draft. Skilled but raw no matter the size is more his stuff like the 2015 draft.

 

[SprDaVE]

Go back and read we were high on the big center as well and it was Hunter who was the one who insisted we take Marner.

You are the one exaggerating....wow

But Hunter didn't have to do anything. It was always his final say no matter who liked who. That's part of his title and that's why he always makes the selections at the podium.

I'm not exaggerating anything. I'm sure everyone of the scouts really liked a bunch of players and Marner was likely at the top of most lists, as he was with every scouting agency out there.

You think every executive and scout in every organisation agrees with every selection? Discussion is good... I'm not sure of the problem.

Hunter did very well with Marner and plenty of players picked behind him are doing very well as well.

An average to good scout shouldn't screw up selections very often in the top 60. Morrison was awful. A great scout makes it count past the top 60 or so.

 

[diceman934]

Strome was no longer an option.

And if you consider picking a consensus top 5 pick at #4 with almost all guys ranked above him already off the board as fantastic just because not everybody agreed with it, then we clearly have two different definitions of the word.

Strome was an option that was more then considered by our management group as they wanted a center.
We moved off of Hanifin as well as his hockey iq was an issue.
Marner was only wanted by Hunter and he told everyone that Marner could be a center or are you conveniently forgetting all of that?

So I do give credit to Hunter selecting a player who has been our best player this year and a player who controls the game as he was far from a consensus pick that you would like everyone to believe.

Go back and refresh your memory as most on here were pissed as well.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Biggs, Percy, Finn the Goat and the list is long. Morrison is our pro scout by the way and was moved out of amateur scouting as he has been bad.

The goat was a horrible pick... he was bad before his injury.

Jfj who gets ripped on in here was a very good judge of talent.

Our draft record has been beyond bad under Burke and Nonis and it is not sure thing to get a good player in the first round and count your self lucky if you get a NHL player never mind a Dermot type player.

if Morrison is bad, then why is Shanahan still paying him. he's not bad. scouting is scouting is scouting. he's still around and has been for ages.

again. the independent auditor disagrees with you. I don't see how the Leafs can have the most drafted players active in the NHL, and also suck at drafting.

the Leafs have had a major issue keeping quality talent. they never had an issue identifying it.
if you want to say that Hunter is a quality NHL scout - I don't think we've see enough to say that he is. he has, to his name right now. two players on the team. Mitch Marner and Travis Dermott. Drafting well in the first and second round should be expected. You don't get a gold star for that.

Everything after Dermott under the Hunter banner is a complete mystery. They are doing well in the minors, so did a heck of a lot of other players. a good chunk of them (as i stated) aren't really making noise in their +1 dev. year. I respect Hunter's talent. Im not going to don sackcloth and ashes should he go, and neither should anyone else.

 

[Kiwi]

That's my thought too.
So he's going to pack up to do the same job elsewhere?
If that's true I would think it's best he goes.

I'm like you if Hunter feels that way he should go

Dubas is the GM and I'd prefer it if everybody was pulling in the same direction while he's getting his feet wet, I don't care who the executive is if there unable to do that they should walk

 

[Boutette]

its because CBJ understands the value of 2nd round pick; unlike the leafs that have twice now thrown it away for to years in a row for a handful of games from Boyle and Plek; meanwhile not turning their pending UFAs like jvr/bozak/komarov etc... into picks.

Bad foresight and bad team/asset management IMO

Sure, they just traded a 3rd round pick, a 4th round pick and 2 former 4th rounders and got punted from the playoffs faster than Toronto did this year. Is a 3rd and 4th worth a 2nd? Maybe. And they also didn't turn any of their pending UFAs into picks either I guess they also thought it was more important to be a playoff team.