Marc-Andre Fleury

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

It's no coincidence that MAF magically went to shit the moment Bylsma implemented his system and he Magically got better the moment DB was fired.

 

[Empoleon8771]

But I think at this point we can just watch and appreciate the goaltender he has developed into. What most people don't realise is that while he was the scapegoat for the Penguins teams from 2010-2014, it was almost always the team defense's fault rather than his but he was an easy whipping boy.

Holy hell, if this isn't a case of hindsight, I don't know what is.

Fleury can be doing amazing in the playoffs right now (and in the last few years for the Penguins, he's been good since 2014) while it also being true that he was absolutely terrible from 2010-2013. I'm super glad he's doing well and he played a huge role in the Penguins winning in 2017, but let's not rewrite history here.

It's no coincidence that MAF magically went to **** the moment Bylsma implemented his system and he Magically got better the moment DB was fired.

I guess it was Bylsma's fault that Fleury was letting up goals from behind the net or something

And this conveniently ignores that Fleury was good in 2014, which was when Bylsma was still the coach.

 

[Old Gregg]

Holy hell, if this isn't a case of hindsight, I don't know what is.

Fleury can be doing amazing in the playoffs right now (and in the last few years for the Penguins, he's been good since 2014) while it also being true that he was absolutely terrible from 2010-2013. I'm super glad he's doing well and he played a huge role in the Penguins winning in 2017, but let's not rewrite history here.

Having a goalie coach seemed to help MAF improve his game...who would've thought?!? Too bad the Penguins didn't get him one until 2013-14

 

[Empoleon8771]

Having a goalie coach seemed to help MAF improve his game...who would've thought?!? Too bad the Penguins didn't get him one until 2013-14

This is certainly true, Fleury alone isn't responsible for his failures from 2010-2013. I just find it incredibly dumb to blame the team for his struggles then because he's good now. No, he was legitimately bad from 2010-2013 in the playoffs, him doing well now doesn't change that.

Could you imagine what kind of career he would have had if he would have had good coaching his entire career? I think he'd have at least a Vezina or 2 by now, his natural talent is absurd.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

If he manages to hold it out, he will be in his fifth Stanley Cup Final, and third as a starter. No other active goalie has been in more than two Finals.


If he actually wins this year, he's an absolute lock. He'd be the first goalie to win four Stanley Cups since Patrick Roy. He'd be the first goalie ever to win four Stanley Cups in the 30 team era, only Hasek, Crawford and Quick have even two.

If he wins this year, it would be like if Glenn Hall managed to defeat the Canadiens in the inaugural expansion season. Glenn Hall is a legend already, but if he did that he'd be a myth. We'd talk about him like Gilgamesh with a trapper.

Delete

 

[Old Gregg]

This is certainly true, Fleury alone isn't responsible for his failures from 2010-2013. I just find it incredibly dumb to blame the team for his struggles then because he's good now. No, he was legitimately bad from 2010-2013 in the playoffs, him doing well now doesn't change that.

Could you imagine what kind of career he would have had if he would have had good coaching his entire career? I think he'd have at least a Vezina or 2 by now, his natural talent is absurd.

Totally agree.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Seriously though, IF he were to win a Cup and Smythe this season... how close is he to the HHOF?

He’s going to be in at least the Belfour range of goalie wins, where the only guys not in the Hall are the ones missing rings. And he’ll be the only post-80s goalie era to win 4 Cups, so the rings will actually be the stronger part of his argument. And he’ll have done this by winning with an expansion team.

Multiple Vezinas seems like a requirement for admission, but Fleury is potentially in a position to really test the committee’s resolve on that point.

 

[Bleedred]

Seriously though, IF he were to win a Cup and Smythe this season... how close is he to the HHOF?

He’s going to be in at least the Belfour range of goalie wins, where the only guys not in the Hall are the ones missing rings. And he’ll be the only post-80s goalie era to win 4 Cups, so the rings will actually be the stronger part of his argument. And he’ll have done this by winning with an expansion team.

Multiple Vezinas seems like a requirement for admission, but Fleury is potentially in a position to really test the committee’s resolve on that point.

He's probably a first ballad HOF inductee if he wins the cup and Conn Smythe this season.

If he doesn't and never wins another cup or the Vezina? He might get in, but it may be after a few years of eligibility. I'm not saying like 35-40 years later like Rogie Vachon, but maybe like after 5-10 years of retirement.

 

[heysmilinstrange]

One of the greatest playoff goalies of all time.

In my mind's eye, I'll always remember Fleury from the Islanders series in 2013, trying to stop pucks while facing backwards in the net for no reason.

 

[Laineux]

Giving up Fleury cost Pens a guaranteed threepeat... too bad...

 

[MoeManthaMustache]

In my mind's eye, I'll always remember Fleury from the Islanders series in 2013, trying to stop pucks while facing backwards in the net for no reason.

And I remember Sid and Geno scoring nothing during the Canadians series, but a series or two doesn't define a career unless you hold a grudge. MAF's had plenty of playoff success - and when you start comparing him to other goalies around the league in that area, he's got quite a few more highs than a lot of guys who have vezina trophies, and some of those guys have enjoyed teams that pack the net in front of them, not playing behind offensive attacking teams like the penguins.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Draft goalie 1st overall

Wait 14 years for payoff


Profit

 

[Rossi Rat]

Giving up Fleury cost Pens a guaranteed threepeat... too bad...

Much as we all love Fleury, not sure he would’ve handled the millions of odd man breaks the Pens gave up these playoffs all that well. Better than Murray probably, but still.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Much as we all love Fleury, not sure he would’ve handled the millions of odd man breaks the Pens gave up these playoffs all that well. Better than Murray probably, but still.

Pens would be looking at a 4 peat with Fleury. He would have gotten in Holtbys head just like hes doing to Helly.

 

[gopens66]

So now HF Boards users are capable of not only seeing the future, but alternate realities' futures.....

 

[Vancouver Canucks]

Draft goalie 1st overall

Wait 14 years for payoff


Profit

You forgot the 2009 playoff victory.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

You forgot the 2009 playoff victory.

And the 2008 run which was CS worthy. We lost be Fleury was brillant all playoffs in 08.

 

[Frank Drebin]

And the 2008 run which was CS worthy. We lost be Fleury was brillant all playoffs in 08.

You forgot the 2009 playoff victory.

I know, I know. But this is the best hockey he's played in his career, and really the type of goaltending you would expect from a 1OA goalie pick.

 

[heysmilinstrange]

And I remember Sid and Geno scoring nothing during the Canadians series, but a series or two doesn't define a career unless you hold a grudge. MAF's had plenty of playoff success - and when you start comparing him to other goalies around the league in that area, he's got quite a few more highs than a lot of guys who have vezina trophies, and some of those guys have enjoyed teams that pack the net in front of them, not playing behind offensive attacking teams like the penguins.

I have no problem admitting I have an enormous grudge against Marc-Andre Fleury. It's balanced out by the vast hordes of people who act like he's Jesus.

 

[Old Gregg]

Draft goalie 1st overall

Wait 14 years for payoff


Profit

Draft goalie 1st overall

Don't give him a goalie coach or develop him for 10+ yrs

Finally get him a goalie coach

Start getting payoff

Trade to expansion team

Expansion team profits

 

[Empoleon8771]

And I remember Sid and Geno scoring nothing during the Canadians series, but a series or two doesn't define a career unless you hold a grudge. MAF's had plenty of playoff success - and when you start comparing him to other goalies around the league in that area, he's got quite a few more highs than a lot of guys who have vezina trophies, and some of those guys have enjoyed teams that pack the net in front of them, not playing behind offensive attacking teams like the penguins.

There's no way you can possibly equate Crosby's and Malkin's bad series with Fleury's bad series. That's absolutely asinine. A "bad series" for Sid and Geno is like 3 points in 7 games or 2 points in 5 games. Fleury's bad series are historically bad and filled with hilariously bad goals against. Fleury deserved every ounce of criticism he got for his play in the playoffs from 2010-2013, and in all honesty, he probably deserved more than he got. But he was a sports icon in Pittsburgh and most yinzers liked him too much to throw him under the bus.

This wasn't 1 bad series or something like that. Fleury was genuinely terrible in the playoffs over those 4 years. In all honesty, he wasn't even that good in the 2009 cup run either. Fleury's save% in the cup run was only a .908 and his quality start% was only 43.5%. People today are saying Murray struggled in the playoffs this year while having the same save% and a better quality start%, just because the Penguins lost in the 2nd round while not being able to score.

I really don't see why people are trying to rewrite history in here. Fleury has been great in the playoffs since 2014, he has had a .928 save% in his last 49 playoff games. But from 2009 to 2013, he was terrible in the playoffs. He had a .893 save% from 2009 to 2013 through 55 games. That is genuinely terrible over a long stretch of time.

 

[Dolemite]

The threetimes Fleury has won a cup he didn’t play a full season for whatever reason. This season he was injured for a stretch and is one game away from the Final.


Just wanted to put that out there.

 

[BladeRunner66]

So now HF Boards users are capable of not only seeing the future, but alternate realities' futures.....

 

[Sentinel]

He's probably a first ballad HOF inductee if he wins the cup and Conn Smythe this season.

If he doesn't and never wins another cup or the Vezina? He might get in, but it may be after a few years of eligibility. I'm not saying like 35-40 years later like Rogie Vachon, but maybe like after 5-10 years of retirement.

"First Ballad"

Exhibit A. Tom Barrasso. Two Cups as a starter, one Vezina. Not in the HOF.

Exhibit B: Mike Vernon. Two Cups as a starter, one Conn Smythe. Not in the HOF.

 

[Empoleon8771]

"First Ballad"

Exhibit A. Tom Barrasso. Two Cups as a starter, one Vezina. Not in the HOF.

Exhibit B: Mike Vernon. Two Cups as a starter, one Conn Smythe. Not in the HOF.

To be fair, Barrasso should be in the HOF, but he's a colossal piece of **** from all I've heard and that's why he hasn't been inducted. I think he's a fringe HOFer who just happens to be a piece of crap, so no one wants to vote for him to put him in the HOF. Fleury also already has more career wins than Vernon and will most likely finish 3rd all time in wins. It's even possible for him to hit 2nd all time in wins if he stays healthy, he's about 150 behind Roy right now and he's only 33.