Speculation: MacArthur Contract Swap

[Riptide]

You'd need an owner willing to spend $20 million (if uninsured) to free up cap space by going into LTIR. That money would be spending over the cap. Owners aren't going to be happy about that.

For similar or less in most cases they could just buyout their players and not deal with the LTIR.

18.75m. I'd think that a top tier team would probably be happy to spend 19m if it allowed them to trade someone who's making similar money and tying up a roster spot and cap space, but was under performing.

I mean do you think that Minny is happy with how Pomi has been performing for them? He's owed 16.5m and has a 5.6m cap hit and his stats have been declining the last couple of seasons. Perhaps he turns it around. But if he's not and MacA is going to spend a good chunk of his career on LTIR, then I could see them going down this road.

There's a couple other options on here, but I don't see OTT going after someone like Gaborik or Brown. Simply too much actual cash out the door. The same likely applies to Callahan.

 

[Riptide]

I now i'd pack it in if i'd made a lifetime supply of money and my longterm health would be in jeopardy.
But that's just me.

To date he's made about 21.5m in salary (not counting whatever he lost to escrow - probably at least 10%). Ottawa owes him another 18.75m. But that's only if he "attempts" to return. He can't "LTIRetire" (like Savard, Dupuis, Pronger, etc) if he's good to go and could play. He'd actually have to retire - which means he's forfeiting the remaining money on his contract. Honestly, it's kind of a ****** situation. I mean maybe he just keeps complaining of "symptoms" and no one challenges it, and he gets his 19m. But then how honest is that? I think there's a pretty fine line between deciding you have enough bank to walk away and putting your long term health first vs declaring yourself "injured" to collect the remaining money on your contract while putting your health first. If you're able to play, you should be playing. If you're not because your worried about your health, then you should be retiring and walking away - but that means not getting paid.

Now I'm not sure how much he loses in taxes and deductions and whatnot, but I'd be surprised if he had more than 5-8m stashed away. If he's smart that's probably just enough to live off of while maintaining the life style he's grown accustom to - however it may not be. We don't know how much money he has in the bank, or what sort of lifestyle he lives. To many, we could probably retire if we had 5-8m in the bank. I mean the interest payments alone would be pretty similar (at min) to what I earn yearly. But if you're used to having 3-600k to live off of yearly... that might come up short (all depends on his returns and what he's working with). At which point... he'd need to decide how he'd want to go about it. Long term health, vs trying to finish out his contract, vs what he'd want to do in the "real world". All balanced against his love for the game. I mean lets not kid ourselves. Go read Dupuis pieces in the players tribune about ones love for the game and what players do to stay there and play at this level. This almost certainly applies to most of the players in the league, and I'd be shocked if it didn't apply to MacA as well.

 

[Clamshells]

What's Ott adding? Kings don't need the cap space right now.

Nothing. It's all hinging on the idea that LA can find a more effective player at 3 mill than Brown is at 5.8 mill, which wouldn't be hard at all. LA gets cap space from this deal so they can become a better team. If I've assumed wrong on that, or if LA doesn't have the money to buy cap space, then that's fine. There are plenty of other teams in the league who have bad contracts who might be more open to the idea.

 

[Xspyrit]

Assuming that MacArthur is forced to retire and that the contract is not insured (both are looking unlikely right now), I think the top-8 best deals for the Sens would be :


1) Marian Hossa : former Ottawa star player, can still play, low salary the last 4 years which is great for Ottawa
2) Marian Gaborik : offensive depth, salary decreasing too
3) Valtteri Filppula : 10.0 and only 2 years, would be great on Ottawa's 3rd RW
4) Luca Sbisa : only 7.6 owed for 2 years, could use him on 3rd pairing LD
5) Alexei Emelin : same as Sbisa, only 2 years and 8.6 owed. Could use him on 3rd pairing LD
6) Brooks Orpik : owed a bit more money but is better and would give great defensive depth to the Sens. They only save 3.1 in salary though, but 1 year less.
7) Jason Pominville : same as Filppula but more pricy. He is owed basically as much as MacArthur but 1 year less. Sens save only 2.35
8) Jonathan Ericsson : same number of years, Sens save 1.6 and have a serviceable D-man for the 3rd pairing LD

Not interested in the rest. Are all those teams looking to get some cap space cleared?

MacArthur is owed about $18M over the next four years. If he isn't playing and that contract isn't insured, TOR would want a very nice piece in return for that.

Think of it as essentially us buying your best prospect for $18M

Ottawa absolutely has NO NEED to do that. If they needed cap space, they would be the one putting MacArthur on LTIR and benefit the cap space. But they are a budget and have to spend more carefully than bigger markets. But absolutely no need and reason to give up Brown, Chabot or White. Please, give me 1 reason.

 

[Reaper45]

Nothing. It's all hinging on the idea that LA can find a more effective player at 3 mill than Brown is at 5.8 mill, which wouldn't be hard at all. LA gets cap space from this deal so they can become a better team. If I've assumed wrong on that, or if LA doesn't have the money to buy cap space, then that's fine. There are plenty of other teams in the league who have bad contracts who might be more open to the idea.

Brown is still plenty effective even if he's not scoring.
I don't think you'd find someone better than him at 3 million.

 

[RoyIsALegend]

I think the better question is how the hell did Clarke MacArthur get $23,500,000 over 5 years?

Jesus, I totally forgot how overpaid that guy was.

 

[Hale The Villain]

I think the better question is how the hell did Clarke MacArthur get $23,500,000 over 5 years?

Jesus, I totally forgot how overpaid that guy was.

Been a 50 point winger with a great effort level with a good two-way game for the Sens

That's worth 4.65M a season.

 

[Sureves]

I think the better question is how the hell did Clarke MacArthur get $23,500,000 over 5 years?

Jesus, I totally forgot how overpaid that guy was.

Oh absolutely not: he's been great in Ottawa since he's been here.

The only forwards on the Sens better than him are Stone, Hoffman, Turris, and Brassard, with the last 2 being pretty comparable in skill.

I really do hope he stays on LTIR though, I'm honestly concerned about his livelihood. The first time he got hit in the last ~11 months resulted in a major scare and reportedly a mild concussion.

It's a matter of time before he ruins his life.

 

[Clamshells]

Brown is still plenty effective even if he's not scoring.
I don't think you'd find someone better than him at 3 million.

Well alright then. I'd read differently on here a few times, so apologies for misunderstanding the situation.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

I might not be thinking this through completely but if the OP situation is true, I wouldn't mind the Ericsson deal. We need a decent guy on the left side for a couple years and we'll likely lose Methot at the end of the season.

Isn't big E injured too though?

Yup. Hips have been bothering him.

LTIR is his future, maybe even this year.

 

[ottawa]

It's going to be hard to trade a guy with 4 concussions in 2 years.

 

[Boud]

MacArthur is owed about $18M over the next four years. If he isn't playing and that contract isn't insured, TOR would want a very nice piece in return for that.

Think of it as essentially us buying your best prospect for $18M

That all makes sense until you realize that this best prospect you're talking about will save us money in playing like a 5M/year player when he's on his ELC and bridge contract after that.

 

[Pyrophorus]

It's going to be hard to trade a guy with 4 concussions in 2 years.

For sure. What will Ottawa do to sweeten the pot?

 

[Xspyrit]

I think the better question is how the hell did Clarke MacArthur get $23,500,000 over 5 years?

Jesus, I totally forgot how overpaid that guy was.

lol the HF ignorance... Why do people talk like if they knew something?

MacArthur has actually been underpaid in Ottawa...

https://www.capfriendly.com/players/clarke-macarthur

2013-14 : 24 goals, 32 assists, 56 points in 79 games. SALARY : $3,250,000
2014-15 : 16 goals, 20 assists, 36 points in 62 games (21 goals, 48 pts pro-rated on 82 games) SALARY : $3,250,000
2015-16 : barely played, concussed. SALARY : $4,500,000

Produce offense, tenacious and hard on the puck, great back checking and pursuit of the puck, solid defensively. Really hard to dislike that player. Actually, NO ONE did on the Sens board before his injury troubles.

This is just a case of extreme bad luck for Ottawa. His contract was signed August 19, 2014, where he got 5 years at $4,650,000 on average per season. This contract was kicking in for the 2015-16 season but his concussion problems began the year before in 2014-15 (after the extension was signed)

It's going to be hard to trade a guy with 4 concussions in 2 years.

Ottawa only want to trade him if he is forced on the LTIR. A team acquiring him can put him there and have cap space relief. So, it wouldn't be too hard for them to trade one of the big contracts that they want to get rid of. They get cap relief, Sens get a player that can contribute, albeit being overpaid, but save money in the same process (if they take a contract with less money owed). If not, they would want a guy that is worth it (ex : Hossa)

There's plenty examples of contracts switches that would work. But anyway, his contract is probably insured OR he might come back so it's a moot point

But based on some comments here, it doesn't seem like everyone understand the situation correctly and how the NHL market works too...

 

[ottawa]

For sure. What will Ottawa do to sweeten the pot?

Chabot + MacArthur + 1st for JVR + Zaitsev

 

[TOGuy14]

Chabot + MacArthur + 1st for JVR + Zaitsev

LOL that's cute.

I think I'd rather just watch Melnyk struggle with $18.5M being paid out to a guy not on the ice, and watch it hamstring the Sens for the next few years.

 

[Xspyrit]

LOL that's cute.

I think I'd rather just watch Melnyk struggle with $18.5M being paid out to a guy not on the ice, and watch it hamstring the Sens for the next few years.

Sorry but that won't happen. Reality will be :

- Contract is insured and MacArthur retires

or

- MacArthur comes back and contribute

or

- Contract (18.75 owed) is traded to a team that will put him on LTIR and need cap space. In return, the Sens could get all kind of return, like an overpaid player but still contributing (Sens aren't a cap team) but with less term and money attached.

or

- Buy out?

 

[TOGuy14]

Sorry but that won't happen. Reality will be :

- Contract is insured and MacArthur retires

or

- MacArthur comes back and contribute

or

- Contract (18.75 owed) is traded to a team that will put him on LTIR and need cap space. In return, the Sens could get all kind of return, like an overpaid player but still contributing (Sens aren't a cap team) but with less term and money attached.

or

- Buy out?

The prevailing sentiment seems to be that his contract is not insured which means:

1. You cannot buy out injured players
2. He provides LTIR cap relief to a team, but they have to pay his salary meaning that's just a big negative to them unless they send you back a terrible contract in return (see: Clarkson vs Horton)

 

[Xspyrit]

The prevailing sentiment seems to be that his contract is not insured which means:

1. You cannot buy out injured players
2. He provides LTIR cap relief to a team, but they have to pay his salary meaning that's just a big negative to them unless they send you back a terrible contract in return (see: Clarkson vs Horton)

A sentiment is just a sentiment, it's not a fact. The fact is that nobody (except the people concerned) knows if the contract is insured or not. Chances are that it is because he didn't really have injury troubles before signing his extension.

Of course I was talking about a team that is comfortable financially. And if you read carefully this thread, you'd see several examples of "contract for contract". It's very simple : a team gets out of a contract they don't want anymore but accept to pay MacArthur's salary just to enjoy that free cap space, which is VERY valuable for many teams.

 

[LondonKendrick]

Cobourn and Drouin for Trouba?

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

MacArthur is owed about $18M over the next four years. If he isn't playing and that contract isn't insured, TOR would want a very nice piece in return for that.

Think of it as essentially us buying your best prospect for $18M

It's best not to think of it that way considering the premise of this thread is to avoid thinking of it in this way by sending dead money the other way.

 

[Seanaconda]

It's best not to think of it that way considering the premise of this thread is to avoid thinking of it in this way by sending dead money the other way.

Do the leafs even need cap space right now? They would want a prospect I'm pretty sure. They would probably use their asset of having cash to get a good one or two tho that time up well with their rebuild.

What's a rich team that needs cap space. Montreal? New York? Maybe they would work better. Los Angeles Chicago? Detroit?

Too bad the ducks aren't rich they would of been perfect.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

For those thinking the Leafs might get into play on this, remember that they currently have a lot of money on LTIR that isn't even being used and probably won't be.

I don't think I fully understand the details, but my picture on it is that while LTIR can help the in-season per-game contract situation (which isn't being maxed out, so no value), it won't help if you go over the cap due to performance bonii, which is more likely to the the Leafs situation.

I'm not sure how such a cap penalty will be calculated (does it take LTIR into consideration?), but it's possible that taking on more LTIR will only make that situation worse, therefore taking on someone like MacArthur can potentially increase a cap penalty for the following season even if he just sits on LTIR all year.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Do the leafs even need cap space right now? They would want a prospect I'm pretty sure. They would probably use their asset of having cash to get a good one or two tho that time up well with their rebuild.

What's a rich team that needs cap space. Montreal? New York? Maybe they would work better. Los Angeles Chicago? Detroit?

Too bad the ducks aren't rich they would of been perfect.

I agree they'd prefer a prospect, so that more or less disqualifies them from this discussion, assuming Leafs see no value in just sending dead money the other way. There's probably a better fit w/ one of the teams you mention.

 

[Seanaconda]

I agree they'd prefer a prospect, so that more or less disqualifies them from this discussion, assuming Leafs see no value in just sending dead money the other way. There's probably a better fit w/ one of the teams you mention.

Oh I don't know if Tampa is rich really but if he actually goes full ltir they could use the cap space if some of their guys would waive some nmcs