Lupul's Value to the Team

[thewave]

He's a 3rd Liner - that isn't strong on the puck - undersized - and can't play defence - that makes a tremendous amount of money and is injury prone.


I have no idea how anyone see's a future with players like this. I could literally say this about 80% of our roster.

Small - Overpaid - Weak players that can't/won't play defence. Your Toronto Maple Leafs

He isn't 75% of what you just said and the only reason anyone could say he is overpaid is because he generally only plays 2/3s of a season.

 

[Byron Bitz]

i say keep him unless there is a very good trade available for him. Hes still got several good years left and hes played some of his best hockey with us. Hes also had chemistry with our top 2 centers.

 

[TheScruffington]

In all honesty, if Lupul were making JVR money or less, I'd be a much bigger fan.

That said despite the injuries and the overpayment I'd still be okay with keeping him on the roster.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

I'd like to see him back with Kessel and Bozak.

I think that JVR will still be effective without being on that top line.

I'd try:

Lupul - Bozak - Kessel
JVR - Holland - Clarkson
Leivo - Kadri - _______
D'Amigo - _______ - Bodie

I suppose we could fill those spots with Kulemin and McClement... but my guess is that it will be a couple of new players. If we can fill those last two spots cheaply, then we'll have some extra money to spend on defense.

Without Lupul, then we would probably be two wingers short. With those centers... and without Lupul, it's hard to say that we've got awesome wingers to make up for our lack of centers.

I think Lupul will find him self back on the right side again. When he played in Anaheim he was put on the 3rd line even do he could play in the top six if I remember it right but he would not play ahead of Selanne or Perry and Carlyle did not think he was good enough for a right hander to play on the left side and his defensive game would suffer on the left side. When he came to Toronto things like his defensive short comings was a non issue since he scored goals and who can criticize a guy who score goals?

But now with Carlyle being resigned and Shanahan wanting a new system in place I reckon some players will have to accept team balance before what they want. So Lupul to the right side, Clarkson down to the 3rd line rw.

JVR - Bozak - Kessel
Ashton - Kadri - Lupul
D´Amigo - olland - Clarkson

 

[tacoburrito]

Does Lupul stay with the leafs? I dont feel he really fits in on the team but if someone tells me a good reason as to why he is valuable im open to changing my mind on him.

i think hes as good as gone if they can get some kind of decent value for him

 

[DoubleDouble*]

Took a big step back last year.

 

[thewave]

Took a big step back last year.

This is a great example of all that most fans see. He was moved positionally left to right wing with different wings on the other side all season. I suppose that has nothing to do with performance though.

Grabo took a step back getting the jerk around too, went to WSH and was in typical 50-60 pt form.

I tell ya if we listened to our GM or most fans all the time we would have a bunch of 1 time off offensive dynamos that completely suck the season after and be a bottom feeder team which btw, we are without Bernier.

 

[Ari91]

This is a great example of all that most fans see. He was moved positionally left to right wing with different wings on the other side all season. I suppose that has nothing to do with performance though.

Grabo took a step back getting the jerk around too, went to WSH and was in typical 50-60 pt form.

I tell ya if we listened to our GM or most fans all the time we would have a bunch of 1 time off offensive dynamos that completely suck the season after and be a bottom feeder team which btw, we are without Bernier.

So how many more excuses do you have packed in your arsenal here? Still waiting to hear a good one.

Grabo was put in a very different role and had a much shorter leash than Lupul. Grabo was effective in the defensive side of things but struggled offensively because of the change which hurt his confidence and it was a dominoe effect. Lupul didn't play on his off wing all season long. Lupul is not the only player that has to do make adjustments because of injuries and/or trying something different in an effort to get something going. Lupul is one of the guys that got a long leash all because he's already had a public rivalry with Carlyle and to avoid pissing fans off, he's probably gotten that longer leash. If you don't think Lupul didn't deserve some demotion or press box time at points in this season (as did others), then I'm not sure what you were watching all season long.

Grabo is a better player than Lupul. That's all there is to it and as pointed out, Lupul didn't have to deal with nearly as much adjustment as Grabo did so don't compare the two...that's insulting to Grabo.

 

[thewave]

So how many more excuses do you have packed in your arsenal here? Still waiting to hear a good one.

Grabo was put in a very different role and had a much shorter leash than Lupul. Grabo was effective in the defensive side of things but struggled offensively because of the change which hurt his confidence and it was a dominoe effect. Lupul didn't play on his off wing all season long. Lupul is not the only player that has to do make adjustments because of injuries and/or trying something different in an effort to get something going. Lupul is one of the guys that got a long leash all because he's already had a public rivalry with Carlyle and to avoid pissing fans off, he's probably gotten that longer leash. If you don't think Lupul didn't deserve some demotion or press box time at points in this season (as did others), then I'm not sure what you were watching all season long.

Grabo is a better player than Lupul. That's all there is to it and as pointed out, Lupul didn't have to deal with nearly as much adjustment as Grabo did so don't compare the two...that's insulting to Grabo.

Lupul was near PPG 2 years, his main problems are health and occasional lapses defensively. Nowhere near as bad as Clarkson, Franson, Raymond, (typical Bozak) heck JVR and Kessel are pretty Damn bad defensively too. The whole team is bad that way but if they were all exactlu as proficient defensively as Lupul we would be a better team because, we got us some real bad stinkers out there. (Orrrr maybe it's the terrible system that's about to get changed and we should see how he looks next year.)

He played about half the season on the wing he hates, heck he was switched to it mid game in several occasions.

I could care less what they do but if they are going to get crap value in trade for him I would rather keep him.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

This is a great example of all that most fans see. He was moved positionally left to right wing with different wings on the other side all season. I suppose that has nothing to do with performance though.

Grabo took a step back getting the jerk around too, went to WSH and was in typical 50-60 pt form.

I tell ya if we listened to our GM or most fans all the time we would have a bunch of 1 time off offensive dynamos that completely suck the season after and be a bottom feeder team which btw, we are without Bernier.

Actually, a 35 point season in 58 games on a team that did not make the playoffs again. Also Grabovski has also never been a 60 point player. Let's be accurate here.

 

[Ari91]

Lupul was near PPG 2 years, his main problems are health and occasional lapses defensively. Nowhere near as bad as Clarkson, Franson, Raymond, (typical Bozak) heck JVR and Kessel are pretty Damn bad defensively too. The whole team is bad that way but if they were all exactlu as proficient defensively as Lupul we would be a better team because, we got us some real bad stinkers out there. (Orrrr maybe it's the terrible system that's about to get changed and we should see how he looks next year.)

He played about half the season on the wing he hates, heck he was switched to it mid game in several occasions.

I could care less what they do but if they are going to get crap value in trade for him I would rather keep him.

Lupul has more than just the occasional lapse defensively. I don't think anyone is advocating that he be traded for the sake of being traded. I think the reason why people are so on board with trading him is because there is a belief that he does in fact have some decent value and overall, there are more pros to trading him than keeping him if there is a decent value there to have via trade.

 

[Mansfield]

Lupul has more than just the occasional lapse defensively. I don't think anyone is advocating that he be traded for the sake of being traded. I think the reason why people are so on board with trading him is because there is a belief that he does in fact have some decent value and overall, there are more pros to trading him than keeping him if there is a decent value there to have via trade.

lupul is a constant lapse defensively. also, he was a mediocre offensive player for most of his career before two good seasons with us. I don't expect him to reach that level again

 

[thewave]

lupul is a constant lapse defensively. also, he was a mediocre offensive player for most of his career before two good seasons with us. I don't expect him to reach that level again

Pull out your statistics to back this up. If you can back it you can have it.

 

[Trapper]

Lupul's value to the team is through trade to improve the defense and supply 5.25 million in cap space for that D help.
That's huge.

 

[Smif]

Lupul's value to the team is through trade to improve the defense and supply 5.25 million in cap space for that D help.
That's huge.

Agreed. To add to that, at some point you have to trust your scouting and development system. The Marlies have had a few good seasons now and we could really use a cheap player that exceeds expectations. You can't have that unless there's room for them. I'm a fan of Lupul and I think he will have a bounce back year but I think his salary needs to go to our blue line and his roster spot to a youngin. If the youngin doesn't work out then atleast wingers are the easiest positional players to attain.

 

[KuleminFan41]

He has a limited NTC so even if the Leafs want to trade him, I hope he doesn't veto that

 

[KuleminFan41]

Pull out your statistics to back this up. If you can back it you can have it.

To be fair, he was a guy who could put up 50 points on a consistent basis which is essentially what he's done with Toronto but his great season where he got a substantial raise hurt the Leafs. He is not a 5m player for what he provides. Not saying he sucks, he just isn't worth that money

 

[Ari91]

lupul is a constant lapse defensively. also, he was a mediocre offensive player for most of his career before two good seasons with us. I don't expect him to reach that level again

He has been injured far too much in his career to suggest that he was mediocre offensively before coming to Toronto. He had two good offensive seasons in Philly but that was some time ago. In 11 seasons of playing in the NHL, Lupul has never played a fulll 82 game season and in those 11 years, he's only had 4 years where he's played close to a full season. That isn't a good track record at all. I don't think there's much need to worry about his offensive production. When healthy, that's about the only thing about his game that isn't truly lacking.

 

[Bluelines]

Lupul's value to the team?

Which Lupul, the guy who was an elite power forward scoring at over a PPG or the guy who sulked his way into golf season?

 

[Ari91]

Lupul's value to the team?

Which Lupul, the guy who was an elite power forward scoring at over a PPG or the guy who sulked his way into golf season?

There was never such a thing as a Lupul who was an elite power forward

Look, the guy has had strong seasons prior to this year but that was never the kind of player he was or is and likely never will be.

 

[thewave]

To be fair, he was a guy who could put up 50 points on a consistent basis which is essentially what he's done with Toronto but his great season where he got a substantial raise hurt the Leafs. He is not a 5m player for what he provides. Not saying he sucks, he just isn't worth that money

Clarkson or Lupul?
Raymond or Lupul? [email protected]
Bolland? @4.5
Bozak?

He is the best hockey player in that group for the price of an enforcer extra. I am not saying don't trade him but you have to get a 10-15 first for him at least.

 

[Trapper]

Clarkson or Lupul?
Raymond or Lupul? [email protected]
Bolland? @4.5
Bozak?

He is the best hockey player in that group for the price of an enforcer extra. I am not saying don't trade him but you have to get a 10-15 first for him at least.

You won't get a 10-15 for any if those guys.
If we turn Lupul 5.25 into a Daley 3.3 or Korpikopski 2.5 we will be doing well. Both of those players take up 1 Lupul salary. A D man to help us or a better 2-way forward who scores a little less but can help us defensively again.
If we lose 20 goals off our GF, but reduce our GA by 20 or 30, that's a win and cap space.

 

[thewave]

You won't get a 10-15 for any if those guys.
If we turn Lupul 5.25 into a Daley 3.3 or Korpikopski 2.5 we will be doing well. Both of those players take up 1 Lupul salary. A D man to help us or a better 2-way forward who scores a little less but can help us defensively again.
If we lose 20 goals off our GF, but reduce our GA by 20 or 30, that's a win and cap space.

Lupul doesn't represent 30 GA himself not even close. The closest guy to that is Franson.

 

[Trapper]

Lupul doesn't represent 30 GA himself not even close. The closest guy to that is Franson.

I don't mean Lupul is responsible for all 30 goals against. However 2 other guys could be responsible for preventing 30.

 

[thewave]

I don't mean Lupul is responsible for all 30 goals against. However 2 other guys could be responsible for preventing 30.

The system that is now declared dead could do that. When changing a system you will see a different game I hope. Nobody on this team could work with the swarm.