OT: Los Angeles Angels Talk

[Deuce22]

As an Angel fan, I don't blame the team for hanging onto Ohtani last year. His trade value was less than people think since he was never going to sign an extension. And at the time, the Angels were still in contention for the playoffs. They had to make a run.

But I'm with others in that my fandom is pretty much in shambles. I have no desire to give this team any of my time or money while Moreno owns it. He's awful and has ruined the franchise.

It’s a stretch to say that they were a playoff contender. Needed to begin the rebuild with what Ohtani would bring.

 

[Quack Shot]

As an Angel fan, I don't blame the team for hanging onto Ohtani last year. His trade value was less than people think since he was never going to sign an extension. And at the time, the Angels were still in contention for the playoffs. They had to make a run.

But I'm with others in that my fandom is pretty much in shambles. I have no desire to give this team any of my time or money while Moreno owns it. He's awful and has ruined the franchise.

The odds were like 5% of making the playoffs, was a stupid decision

 

[Hockey Duckie]

As a Dodger fan, I’m excited. Also still shocked at how incompetent and egotistical it was not to trade Ohtani and rebuild.

Yup. That's our, Angel's owner, owner for ya. That ego ruining baseball ops occurred long before Ohtani's situation.

 

[Deuce22]

Yup. That's our, Angel's owner, owner for ya. That ego ruining baseball ops occurred long before Ohtani's situation.

No doubt. Threw DiPito under the bus in power struggle with Scioscia. No good GM or manager is going to want to work for him.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

No doubt. Threw DiPito under the bus in power struggle with Scioscia. No good GM or manager is going to want to work for him.

Scioscia also forced one of the worst trades in team history: Mike Napoli + Juan Rivera for Vernon Wells who made 20+ million a year in 2011 and 2012 while putting up sub .700 ops at around .670 ish. All because Scioscia had it out with Napoli and wouldn't play him anymore. At the time Napoli was one of the most cost effective players who could play Catcher/1B/DH and provide OBP and HRs and they traded him for a negative asset in Wells.

Then you have the Tony Reagins GM vs Eddie Bane scouting director war.
Reagins had it out with Bane and set him up to fail by having him focus on toolsy/speedster type players in the 2010 draft. Bane's job in the 2009 draft is the best in team history in terms of a single draft: Trout, Richards, Skaggs, Corbin, Grichuk. The Angels farm system has never been the same since.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Scioscia also forced one of the worst trades in team history: Mike Napoli + Juan Rivera for Vernon Wells who made 20+ million a year in 2011 and 2012 while putting up sub .700 ops at around .670 ish. All because Scioscia had it out with Napoli and wouldn't play him anymore. At the time Napoli was one of the most cost effective players who could play Catcher/1B/DH and provide OBP and HRs and they traded him for a negative asset in Wells.

Then you have the Tony Reagins GM vs Eddie Bane scouting director war.
Reagins had it out with Bane and set him up to fail by having him focus on toolsy/speedster type players in the 2010 draft. Bane's job in the 2009 draft is the best in team history in terms of a single draft: Trout, Richards, Skaggs, Corbin, Grichuk. The Angels farm system has never been the same since.

I remember Sosh wanted an injured Hambone in the playoffs, but Dipoto wanted a utility speedster that was healthy. Hambone went 0 for 13. smh.

Gm 1: Lose 3-2 in the 11th
Gm 2: Lose 4-1 in the 11th
Gm 3: Lose 8-3

All we needed was one extra run before the 11th to win.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Arte does not deserve a talent like Ohtani on his roster. He has wasted the talent of 2 transcendent players

 

[KaseMeOutside]

As an Angel fan, I don't blame the team for hanging onto Ohtani last year. His trade value was less than people think since he was never going to sign an extension. And at the time, the Angels were still in contention for the playoffs. They had to make a run.

But I'm with others in that my fandom is pretty much in shambles. I have no desire to give this team any of my time or money while Moreno owns it. He's awful and has ruined the franchise.

Same I used to watch every game but not anymore. The angels used to be a good organization that could develop talent, let's face it they got lucky with Trout, Arte has chased short term gains for so long and neglected the most important part of a baseball organization and thats its player development/farm system, until the team is sold they will never have sustained success again

 

[JAHV]

It’s a stretch to say that they were a playoff contender. Needed to begin the rebuild with what Ohtani would bring.

He wasn't going to bring much. And trading him when the team was a couple games out of a playoff spot would have been a betrayal of the fans. The only way they were going to keep him was by making the playoffs and fhey had a chance. I fully support them hanging onto him. It just didn't work out.

 

[Deuce22]

Arte does not deserve a talent like Ohtani on his roster. He has wasted the talent of 2 transcendent players

Ohtani made Arte a lot of money and I think that's what he wanted most.

 

[KelVarnsen]

Screw this organization until Arte is gone.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Screw this organization until Arte is gone.

Unfortunately, I can't. I don't like Arte, but I'll still follow the team.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Arte does not deserve a talent like Ohtani on his roster. He has wasted the talent of 2 transcendent players

Arte wasted the talents of Ohtani and Trout by not spending beyond the luxury tax before the start of the season. The Dodgers don't care if they go over the luxury tax and that's why they're perennial playoff participants. It's crazy to think you have 5 MVPs between Trout and Ohtani (probaby 7 or 8 b/c damned old man politics), but nothing to show for it... not even the playoffs!

Just how frugal with profit is Arte? Back in 2011, Arte signed da Macheen (pujols) to a 10-year contract worth $254 mil. Then Arte parlayed that move to net a tv contract with Fox Sports worth over $3 billion for 20 years. That TV deal should have covered any luxury tax in the past decade.

Then tack on Arte's interference on how an MLB roster should look like rather than let baseball people do baseball ops while also trying to stay below the luxury tax. Can you imagine instead of signing Hambone, the Angels re-signed both Greinke and Hula Dula (Torii Hunter)? The other effect of not signing FA Hambone was the Angels didn't lose a first round pick!

It was and still is a no-win situation for any GM under Arte. But Arte will never see himself as the common denominator for all the losing with two franchise players on the same team.

 

[Rybread86]

I hate that Ohtani went to the Dodgers. I hate LA everything which is also why I hate that the team in OC is called LA. I think we had a shot at resigning him but if we didn't, I was really hoping he went East.

Silver lining is they could use that money on pitching instead of Ohtani. Key word there is "could". Were at a point where even though I love Trout, I wouldn't mind seeing him traded to Philly for a decent haul.

Still a lot of questions to be answered. I just hope one of the answers to the questions is "Arte sells the team".

Unfortunately, I can't. I don't like Arte, but I'll still follow the team.

Agreed. You can still support the team while telling Arte to go eff himself.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I hate that Ohtani went to the Dodgers. I hate LA everything which is also why I hate that the team in OC is called LA. I think we had a shot at resigning him but if we didn't, I was really hoping he went East.

Silver lining is they could use that money on pitching instead of Ohtani. Key word there is "could". Were at a point where even though I love Trout, I wouldn't mind seeing him traded to Philly for a decent haul.

Still a lot of questions to be answered. I just hope one of the answers to the questions is "Arte sells the team".

Agreed. You can still support the team while telling Arte to go eff himself.

Ohtani wants to be in the playoffs. Winning the WBC and striking out Mike Trout to win the championship solidified the notion of being a part of a playoffs team for Ohtani. The Angels finally going all in at the last minute is not a sign of an organization that wants to win year in and year out. All of Ohtani's six years in the org have always finished under .500 and nowhere close to a sniff at the playoffs.

Is that a wakeup call to Arte to have a two-time MVP not want to return to the organization because it's priority is not to make the playoffs for all of his six years as an Angel?

I'd say no.

===========

Trout has a no trade clause. Also, Trout loves the anonymity of being an Angel. People will still come to watch Trout as well as purchase Trout stuff.

For several years now, Arte has often cited he's in the market for an Ace and we come out with nada. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me for a sixth consecutive year, ...

The previous GM, Eppler, has been a dud with his first round picks - being successful with only one out of five prospects, LHP Reid Detmers. GM Minisian has actually made the Angels younger in the past couple of seasons due to trades and good drafting. All three of his first round picks have already made the MLB level in RHP Bachman, SS Neto, and 1B Schanuel. A 2021, 11th round pitcher, Silseth, made it to the MLB's this past season. Via trades, there's 23-year old C O'Hoppe and 25-year old CF Moniak.

For the 2024 draft, the Angels will select 8th overall. Minisian has been selecting college players, which allows them to reach the MLB sooner like SS Neto and 1B Schanuel.

============

Will Arte let his GM sign top-end pitching now that Ohtani isn't with the team? No. I won't be fooled once again.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

 

[TheGoodShepard1]

I hate that Ohtani went to the Dodgers. I hate LA everything which is also why I hate that the team in OC is called LA. I think we had a shot at resigning him but if we didn't, I was really hoping he went East.

Silver lining is they could use that money on pitching instead of Ohtani. Key word there is "could". Were at a point where even though I love Trout, I wouldn't mind seeing him traded to Philly for a decent haul.

Still a lot of questions to be answered. I just hope one of the answers to the questions is "Arte sells the team".



Agreed. You can still support the team while telling Arte to go eff himself.

Hard to do so when he does crap like this on the regular.



Which has been the overarching problem with this franchise since forever.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Hard to do so when he does crap like this on the regular.



Which has been the overarching problem with this franchise since forever.

And the hits just keep on coming. So glad Ohtani was able to escape from this hell.

 

[Rybread86]

Hard to do so when he does crap like this on the regular.



Which has been the overarching problem with this franchise since forever.

Angels are a joke

 

[TheStuntman]

Angels don't have the roster nor the depth to be a playoff team. The Angels should do a complete rebuild. However Arte is too stupid/cheap/stubborn to allow it to happen because he won't spend the money on good infrastructure (scouting/player development/support staff). It wouldn't surprise me if he doesn't sign anyone and just keep pocketing the money and then cry poverty when he won't spend anymore or sign anyone.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Angels don't have the roster nor the depth to be a playoff team. The Angels should do a complete rebuild. However Arte is too stupid/cheap/stubborn to allow it to happen because he won't spend the money on good infrastructure (scouting/player development/support staff). It wouldn't surprise me if he doesn't sign anyone and just keep pocketing the money and then cry poverty when he won't spend anymore or sign anyone.

Seeing how Ohtani was going to only take $2 mil and defer the rest of his salary so that whatever team he went to he didn't want to prevent the team from acquiring players, the Angels truly screwed the pooch. If Arte would have spent to go over the luxury tax a few seasons ago to give proof to Ohtani that this org wants to be a perennial playoff team, then Ohtani would have easily re-signed with the Angels.

So pissed now. That late rush to go over the luxury tax is like someone realizing late how good the person they were dating were, but it was far too little too late.

 

[Bender66]

Seeing how Ohtani was going to only take $2 mil and defer the rest of his salary so that whatever team he went to he didn't want to prevent the team from acquiring players, the Angels truly screwed the pooch. If Arte would have spent to go over the luxury tax a few seasons ago to give proof to Ohtani that this org wants to be a perennial playoff team, then Ohtani would have easily re-signed with the Angels.

So pissed now. That late rush to go over the luxury tax is like someone realizing late how good the person they were dating were, but it was far too little too late.

I'm guessing Ohtani saw enough of the internal/structural dysfunction in angels in the last few years to know there was no way he was ever re-signing with angels. And if he didn't, that Sam Blum athletic article from sep should have been enough to convince Shohei that it was pointless even considering coming back. A guy with that kind of competitiveness and self drive would see this as what it is - a sinking ship with a clueless captain at the helm, more than happy to steer into the iceberg as long as he can make a profit off the insurance money

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I'm guessing Ohtani saw enough of the internal/structural dysfunction in angels in the last few years to know there was no way he was ever re-signing with angels. And if he didn't, that Sam Blum athletic article from sep should have been enough to convince Shohei that it was pointless even considering coming back. A guy with that kind of competitiveness and self drive would see this as what it is - a sinking ship with a clueless captain at the helm, more than happy to steer into the iceberg as long as he can make a profit off the insurance money

I wouldn't say the Angels are a sinking ship, but rather a ship not fit enough to set sail. The Angels have eight consecutive years of being below .500, no ship is allowed to sail if they're below "C" level. ba da bump tshhhhhhhhhhh Othani was part of that ship for 6 years and put up three consecutive MVP performances.

Look at the Dodgers, they have 11 consecutive playoff appearances. If I was Ohtani and wanted to be a participant in the playoffs, then I would have jumped ship to the Dodgers too. The World Baseball Classic (WBC) Championship was exciting, especially with Ohtani striking out Trout for the championship. I don't blame Ohtani one bit and just glad we were able to witness him going beyond Babe Ruth in an Angels uniform.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

The SS Arte...

 

[Hockey Duckie]

No idea if this article is true, but I'd be disgusted if it is.

Angels declined to match Dodgers' offer to Ohtani

It isn’t clear if the two-way superstar would have accepted the Angels’ offer if they’d matched the Dodgers.

theathletic.com