Lindros should be in the Hall

[The Panther]

We've complained about Mario and Crosby's career this way too but it pales in comparison with Lindros.

Again, for his 8 elite years, Lindros played more games than Crosby during his first 8.

I'll say again though, as far as his playoff resume goes, which names come to mind that have a worse resume that are in the HHOF?

(Okay, maybe Bure isn't "worse", but I don't think he's any better.)

 

[Big Phil]

Again, for his 8 elite years, Lindros played more games than Crosby during his first 8..... (Okay, maybe Bure isn't "worse", but I don't think he's any better.)

Good call. I didn't realize for whatever reason that Doug Bentley had that bad of a playoff resume. Obviously still an all-time great and pretty high up on the best "Cup less" player list but yeah that's worse than I would have guessed it. Mosienko, Housley, Howell and Gilbert I agree with too. No issues. You know, maybe Bathgate as well, although unlike Lindros his teams were just awful and there really wasn't the opportunity, and even then he did win a Cup and was a good part of it in 1964.

You really don't like Hawerchuk huh Panther? haha. Fine, he's right there with Lindros playoff-wise.

I can't say I agree with Milt Schmidt. I mean, Schmidt missed 3 prime years because of WWII, actually won a couple of Cups where one of them he could have won the Smythe had it existed. Bure is another one I think I would have to put ahead of Lindros when it comes to playoffs. He still did very well against NYR in the final in 1994 and his best postseason is better than Lindros'.

But either way, these guys all were all mostly better in the regular season, some much better. That's where I am not sure if Lindros' playoff career helps him here.

 

[Voight]

Again, for his 8 elite years, Lindros played more games than Crosby during his first 8.

Crosby accomplished more.

 

[Kyle McMahon]

And if Malkin didn't win that Cup in 2009 and his career ended tomorrow we would all be wondering in 10 years why Malkin wasn't in there. However, he has far less enemies than Lindros did.

I don't think we'd be wondering why he wasn't in. If you completely removed 2009, Malkin's case would be very weak. If you're saying 2009 still exists as is except Pittsburgh lost Game 7, that's a bit of a different story, but I wouldn't personally vote in favour him if I had a vote. As I see it, the Cup and Smythe would be what pushed Malkin over the top into the HOF if he retired right this minute.

 

[sr edler]

Okay, maybe Bure isn't "worse", but I don't think he's any better.

Bure's playoff record certainly isn't worse than say Sundin's or Selänne's.

 

[MXD]

Why are we comparing Lindros to Crosby? Crosby is assuredly an upper-tier HHOF'er at this point and absolutely not the standard Lindros has to meet.

Speaking of players with worse playoff resumes in the HHOF : Pat Lafontaine.

 

[The Panther]

Why are we comparing Lindros to Crosby? Crosby is assuredly an upper-tier HHOF'er at this point and absolutely not the standard Lindros has to meet.

Maybe it flatters Lindros a little, but not that much.

Remember, from 1992 to 2000 Lindros is 3rd in points-per-game behind only Jagr and Lemieux... and he was only 0.09 PPG behind Jagr, which is to say equal. He led in points once, just as Crosby did in his first 8 seasons. And Lindros played more games. Both led the playoffs in scoring once.

Crosby, though, is ahead in the first 8 years in that he actually won a Stanley Cup, but I think Lindros had more impact on the Flyers' run to the Final in '97 than Crosby in '09 (not sure about '08, admittedly -- I think Crosby performed a bit better then, but lost in the Final).

Don't get me wrong -- in 2016 Crosby is all over Lindros, but comparing their first 8 seasons (Lindros's Philadelphia days), I think they're very close.

 

[MXD]

Don't get me wrong -- in 2016 Crosby is all over Lindros, but comparing their first 8 seasons (Lindros's Philadelphia days), I think they're very close.

Well, during his first 8 seasons, Crosby won the Pearson thrice, the Hart and the Art Ross twice, one Stanley Cup, one Stanley Cup finals and he had two playoff runs that were better than Lindros' best. That's.... quite good. not to mention Lindros' career "artificially" started one year later than it should've.

But then again : that Crosby described above is an upper-tier, and maybe even upper quartile, HHOF'er.

 

[The Panther]

Well, during his first 8 seasons, Crosby won the Pearson thrice,

Actually twice.

the Hart and the Art Ross twice,

Art Ross once.

he had two playoff runs that were better than Lindros' best.

It's all subjective, but how do you figure Crosby's 2008 and 2009 are both better than Lindros in 1997? Remember Lindros didn't have a Malkin for scoring support.

 

[Wrath]

If you don't count playoffs, Lindros is easily at least comparable to Crosby in each of their first 8 seasons.

Of course, playoffs do count, especially to HHOF voters who care a lot about playoff success. It sucks that Lindros doesn't have a cup win to put him over the edge for HHOF voting, but he's not the first and won't be the last great player to never have won a cup.

Just imagine how we'd look at Dionne in retrospect if he won a cup or two.

 

[MXD]

For the first ones : Lindros has only himself to blame for NOT playing on his first season...

(Lindros should be in, but Crosby is a bad measuring stick. Lafontaine is probably very, very fair game, however, and Lindros is definitely superior)

 

[The Panther]

For the first ones : Lindros has only himself to blame for NOT playing on his first season...

So now we're punishing him because he didn't play at 18. Better throw 80% of Hall of Famers out...

 

[MXD]

So now we're punishing him because he didn't play at 18. Better throw 80% of Hall of Famers out...

Yeah, but we're comparing the first 8 seasons of Crosby with the first 8 seasons of Lindros... And there are good reasons to think Lindros' first season should've happened a year earlier than it did. And that he wouldn't be QUITE as good as he was (which is no shame), a bit like Crosby would end up being better (than he was in 2005-06).

 

[sandercohan78*]

Again, for his 8 elite years, Lindros played more games than Crosby during his first 8.

(Okay, maybe Bure isn't "worse", but I don't think he's any better.)

You could throw in Cam Neely(who I liked more then Lindros) aswell.

 

[Hardyvan123]

For the first ones : Lindros has only himself to blame for NOT playing on his first season...

(Lindros should be in, but Crosby is a bad measuring stick. Lafontaine is probably very, very fair game, however, and Lindros is definitely superior)

Agree with this in that Crosby isn't agood comp at this point or even in their first 8 years either.

There really isn't a good comp although the closest. Might be a winger in Cam Neely, although Lindros was obviously superior.

Lindros didn't miss his first year either it's a dominant junior and Canadian national team member as well as OG for Canada.

 

[Big Phil]

I don't think we'd be wondering why he wasn't in. If you completely removed 2009, Malkin's case would be very weak. If you're saying 2009 still exists as is except Pittsburgh lost Game 7, that's a bit of a different story, but I wouldn't personally vote in favour him if I had a vote. As I see it, the Cup and Smythe would be what pushed Malkin over the top into the HOF if he retired right this minute.

Two Art Rosses though? 3 first team all-stars, 1 Hart. I don't know, he'd be brought up a lot as a guy who isn't in if we took out his 2009 playoff performance and the Pens, let's say, get bounced out the first round. But that is neither here nor there, Malkin will be certainly enshrined in the HHOF.

Why are we comparing Lindros to Crosby? Crosby is assuredly an upper-tier HHOF'er at this point and absolutely not the standard Lindros has to meet.

Speaking of players with worse playoff resumes in the HHOF : Pat Lafontaine.

Yeah, it is so much a thing of the past now that bringing it up means little. If you compare Lindros' first 8 seasons to Crosby's there is at least a bit of an interesting comparison. I would still take Crosby because when he was injured he was injured for most of the year. None of this 50-60 game stuff regularly. In his first 8 years alone he had elite years in 2006, 2007, 2009, 2010, 2013. Obviously in 2008, 2011 and 2012 he has them if he plays a full year but he also blows Lindros out of the water in the postseason during this time. He captains Team Canada to a Gold Medal and scores the winner. He wins more awards. So yeah a 2005-'13 Crosby beats a 1992-'00 Lindros. It is at least worthy of a discussion, however, Crosby has had 3 seasons since then and been elite all three years so there is no argument anymore. I can't even find 5 elite seasons that Lindros had in his first 8 years, he just missed too much time.

As for Lafontaine, I think he gets in because despite his injuries he put in more time than Lindros and wasn't a headache off the ice. His 1993 season pushes him over the top, but you have to count it and that single season is as good as any other single season Lindros had. So if anything longevity might be hurting Lindros.

 

[Jumptheshark]

sorry no

No one will ever convince me that he should be in

the off ice crap he cause while he played and then crap he pulled when he was the NHL ombudsman for the NHLPA--

there are two sides to Lindros that he tries really hard to control

the guy who plays the media very well, tries to be the all around community guy who tries to be a pillar of the community

then we have one of the most self serving, egotistical, the world revolves around me and I think I am GOD so therefor I am, the guy who put himself a head of everything and tried to make everything he gets involved in about him

for me--without getting too political--his refusal to report to Quebec keeps him out--that there is where we see the true Lindros

 

[Big Phil]

sorry no

No one will ever convince me that he should be in

the off ice crap he cause while he played and then crap he pulled when he was the NHL ombudsman for the NHLPA--

there are two sides to Lindros that he tries really hard to control

the guy who plays the media very well, tries to be the all around community guy who tries to be a pillar of the community

then we have one of the most self serving, egotistical, the world revolves around me and I think I am GOD so therefor I am, the guy who put himself a head of everything and tried to make everything he gets involved in about him

for me--without getting too political--his refusal to report to Quebec keeps him out--that there is where we see the true Lindros

He basically screwed three teams, Sault St. Marie, Quebec and then Philly. He was 16, 18 and 27 when he did this. The first two, maybe you blame Bonnie and Carl for it. He's 18, I mean, what can you say? Your parents tell you something you are going to trust them right? But by 27 he should have done things much differently, he was old enough.

The ironic thing is that since Quebec was definitely a team on the rise in 1991 had he reported to that team he'd be in the HHOF today, no questions asked. He'd have a Cup. He'd also have saved the franchise and would have joined Stastny, Goulet and Sakic as players who made the HHOF playing in that city.

 

[Helistin]

Add him to HOF as a builder for Quebec/Colorado.

 

[FrozenJagrt]

He basically screwed three teams, Sault St. Marie, Quebec and then Philly. He was 16, 18 and 27 when he did this. The first two, maybe you blame Bonnie and Carl for it. He's 18, I mean, what can you say? Your parents tell you something you are going to trust them right? But by 27 he should have done things much differently, he was old enough.

The ironic thing is that since Quebec was definitely a team on the rise in 1991 had he reported to that team he'd be in the HHOF today, no questions asked. He'd have a Cup. He'd also have saved the franchise and would have joined Stastny, Goulet and Sakic as players who made the HHOF playing in that city.

With Philly, he was far from the only villain in that situation

Regarding Quebec, it can be argued that they don't win the Cup without the spoils of the Lindros trade. And they were likely moving regardless.

 

[mja]

He basically screwed three teams, Sault St. Marie, Quebec and then Philly. He was 16, 18 and 27 when he did this. The first two, maybe you blame Bonnie and Carl for it. He's 18, I mean, what can you say? Your parents tell you something you are going to trust them right? But by 27 he should have done things much differently, he was old enough.

The ironic thing is that since Quebec was definitely a team on the rise in 1991 had he reported to that team he'd be in the HHOF today, no questions asked. He'd have a Cup. He'd also have saved the franchise and would have joined Stastny, Goulet and Sakic as players who made the HHOF playing in that city.

That was a decidedly two-sided affair. The Flyers were done with Lindros and Lindros was done with the Flyers. He tried to engineer the trade to TO late in the season but he wasn't solely responsible for the break at all.

 

[authentic]

Add him to HOF as a builder for Quebec/Colorado.

 

[Bongo]

Based on character: No way
Based on achievement: Mos Def

I don't know how much of a issue character is when it comes to the HHOF.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Based on character: No way
Based on achievement: Mos Def

I don't know how much of a issue character is when it comes to the HHOF.

Look how long glenn Anderson waited. 6 cup rings and they forced him to wait because of off ice stuff

 

[Hobnobs]

He basically screwed three teams, Sault St. Marie, Quebec and then Philly. He was 16, 18 and 27 when he did this. The first two, maybe you blame Bonnie and Carl for it. He's 18, I mean, what can you say? Your parents tell you something you are going to trust them right? But by 27 he should have done things much differently, he was old enough.

The ironic thing is that since Quebec was definitely a team on the rise in 1991 had he reported to that team he'd be in the HHOF today, no questions asked. He'd have a Cup. He'd also have saved the franchise and would have joined Stastny, Goulet and Sakic as players who made the HHOF playing in that city.

Just imagine that Quebec team...

Sakic and Lindros as centers with a pool of wingers consisting of Sundin, Nolan, Kamensky, Deadmarsh, Rucinsky, Lindsay and Kovalenko. They would have had enoup to trade for players to fill gaps on defense.