Post-Game Talk: Leafs Win 4:2! Hanta Yo!

[Marshy]

Leafs didn't win their 10th game until the end of November last year .. And so far this season we haven't really seen them hit their stride or play a game where they are in complete control

Good points. I like that we are finding ways to win games while also not peaking in the first 1/5th of the season. It's cliché but as Babcock says - keep getting better every day.

 

[ToneDog]

Heard an interesting stat on sirius radio yesterday. In a small sample size of 25 teams, (4) teams that did not have 20 points after 20 games did not make the playoffs (16%). Oilers need 9 points in their next 6 games to get to 20 in 20. We got our 20th point last night with 3 games to play.

 

[ThaiTanicDK]

Critizising Andersen is okay but you gotta remember:

Leafs has been out shot in the last 8 out of 12 games.
He has a horrible D in front of him.
Rebounds, we have no gritty D-men that can help him clear the rebounds, so he has to do that too, which we saw three times tonight.

How is a goalie supposed to carry a team day in and day out if he has such horrible working conditions to begin with? Yes he have had bad goals against him but constantly bashing number 31 despite him carrying the team far last year seems like a typical Toronto fan base thing and not an objective opinion.

Stop comparing him to Price or Quick or who ever the hell you are. Look at the personal those guys have in front of them, then compare.

 

[SprDaVE]

Critizising Andersen is okay but you gotta remember:

Leafs has been out shot in the last 8 out of 12 games.
He has a horrible D in front of him.
Rebounds, we have no gritty D-men that can help him clear the rebounds, so he has to do that too, which we saw three times tonight.

How is a goalie supposed to carry a team day in and day out if he has such horrible working conditions to begin with? Yes he have had bad goals against him but constantly bashing number 31 despite him carrying the team far last year seems like a typical Toronto fan base thing and not an objective opinion.

Stop comparing him to Price or Quick or who ever the hell you are. Look at the personal those guys have in front of them, then compare.

A #1 goaltender deals with these conditions most of the time. That's why they are called #1 goaltenders. If Andersen can't make routines saves consistently, and even sometimes *GASP* make a tough save or stand on his head, then he's not a #1 goaltender. It's really that simple to me. Andersen so far has been wildly inconsistent, where he'll make a great save one second and let in a wrister from the top of the circle over his shoulder the next.

He deserves every bit of criticism going his way, just like the players in front of him deserve every bit of it as well. Nobody is saying he's solely to blame for some of the goals against. There were plenty of games early on where the Leafs completely dominated a game only to have Andersen give up soft and unfocused goals against. It goes both ways.

He's had a tough start to the season like some players so once he starts giving us consistent goaltending, people will stop focusing on him so much. He's capable of better and we only want him to deliver on that.

 

[The Podium]

With how 'sky is falling' this place has been lately, itll be comforting to know the Leafs are sitting 4th overall in the league (albeit more GP than most the league)

 

[Gallagbi]

Critizising Andersen is okay but you gotta remember:

Leafs has been out shot in the last 8 out of 12 games.
He has a horrible D in front of him.
Rebounds, we have no gritty D-men that can help him clear the rebounds, so he has to do that too, which we saw three times tonight.

How is a goalie supposed to carry a team day in and day out if he has such horrible working conditions to begin with? Yes he have had bad goals against him but constantly bashing number 31 despite him carrying the team far last year seems like a typical Toronto fan base thing and not an objective opinion.

Stop comparing him to Price or Quick or who ever the hell you are. Look at the personal those guys have in front of them, then compare.

He's his own worst enemy for rebounds and even with a great night yesterday we still saw it.

Most people would be happy if he looked average right now. He doesn't need to look Vezina worthy, just average.

 

[Bluelines]

A #1 goaltender deals with these conditions most of the time. That's why they are called #1 goaltenders. If Andersen can't make routines saves consistently, and even sometimes *GASP* make a tough save or stand on his head, then he's not a #1 goaltender. It's really that simple to me. Andersen so far has been wildly inconsistent, where he'll make a great save one second and let in a wrister from the top of the circle over his shoulder the next.

He deserves every bit of criticism for his way, just like the players in front of him deserve every bit of it as well. Nobody is saying he's solely to blame for some of the goals against. There were plenty of games early on where the Leafs completely dominated a game only to have Andersen give up soft and unfocused goals against. It goes both ways.

He's had a tough start to the season like some players so once he starts giving us consistent goaltending, people will stop focusing on him so much. He's capable of better and we only want him to deliver on that.

So I read..Bias, bias, confirmation bias and bias about 75 more times.

He does make routine saves, he does make incredible 10 bell saves and he is a a very good goalie.What posters like you want is perfection and NO player, is perfect, yes sometimes he lets in mistakes, yes he is human but he is also a HELLOFA lot better than what most teams have. No there were not plenty of games where the Leafs dominated, with the exception of a couple of games early on for the most part we have been out played, out hustled, out checked and out skilled in almost every game.

By your definition of a #1 goalie, I guess Price is not a #1 goalie ?

 

[SprDaVE]

By your definition of a #1 goalie, I guess Price is not a #1 goalie ?

It isn't what Andersen has shown in his first 15 games that's for sure. The team infront of him hasn't been great either. It's weird how someone can see that multiple players aren't playing well, not placing the blame solely on one aspect and completely being ignorant to the rest.

If you think that's a #1 goaltender, then that's your prerogative.

I remember now why I had you on my ignore list.

 

[Bluelines]

It isn't what Andersen has shown in his first 15 games that's for sure. The team infront of him hasn't been great either. It's weird how someone can see that multiple players aren't playing well, not placing the blame solely on one aspect and completely being ignorant to the rest.

If you think that's a #1 goaltender, then that's your prerogative.

I remember now why I had you on my ignore list.

Because generally you are a negative and angry individual.

 

[Clark4Ever]

We've had so many key players aside from Andersen get off to a slow start, it's a miracle we're still 10-7.

 

[Trapper]

Critizising Andersen is okay but you gotta remember:

Leafs has been out shot in the last 8 out of 12 games.
He has a horrible D in front of him.
Rebounds, we have no gritty D-men that can help him clear the rebounds, so he has to do that too, which we saw three times tonight.

How is a goalie supposed to carry a team day in and day out if he has such horrible working conditions to begin with? Yes he have had bad goals against him but constantly bashing number 31 despite him carrying the team far last year seems like a typical Toronto fan base thing and not an objective opinion.

Stop comparing him to Price or Quick or who ever the hell you are. Look at the personal those guys have in front of them, then compare.

All goalies will have ups and downs in the season. Trouble with the goalie is that it's so much more noticeable. Can't just skate up and down the wing as a goalie and disappear.
People can say what they want, I think back to the first game of the year against Winnipeg. We should have lost that game. We should have been down 4-0 after the first period but Andersen stood on his head. We went 6-1 after that. A big defeat in that game and maybe we don't catch the swagger and go 1-6. Then get pounded out West. Andersen needs to be better and he will.
But people can't let the team off the hook. If the team is playing well and with structure then you can focus on the goalie. If they are not and you expect Andersen to save us, shame on everyone.

 

[Kurtz]

He's his own worst enemy for rebounds and even with a great night yesterday we still saw it.

Most people would be happy if he looked average right now. He doesn't need to look Vezina worthy, just average.

His rebound control was excellent yesterday. If you're expecting him to not give up a rebound when a player shoots it at his pad from 2 feet away, you'll be let down by every goalie in the league.

 

[pheasant]

Bozak apparently played over 15 minutes. I honestly have no idea how he managed that, because I almost never saw him on the ice. I think he played with Marner a couple shifts in the 3rd, but he was never noticeable in a good way.

I have been a big Bozak supporter, he was in my playoff avatar. But something is wrong here. I expected him to be on the ice for like 20 minutes, picking up some slack for Auston's absence. But he played 15, and looked like he played 8.

 

[ACC1224]

Bozak apparently played over 15 minutes. I honestly have no idea how he managed that, because I almost never saw him on the ice. I think he played with Marner a couple shifts in the 3rd, but he was never noticeable in a good way.

I have been a big Bozak supporter, he was in my playoff avatar. But something is wrong here. I expected him to be on the ice for like 20 minutes, picking up some slack for Auston's absence. But he played 15, and looked like he played 8.

I think the amount of penalties kept their ice time down.

 

[SprDaVE]

His rebound control was excellent yesterday. If you're expecting him to not give up a rebound when a player shoots it at his pad from 2 feet away, you'll be let down by every goalie in the league.

Did you miss the 2nd goal against, where the shot was right in his chest and it popped out? Even Andersen was mad at himself at that one... so I'm not sure why we're excusing it when even he would agree that shouldn't have happened.

Those things happen to the best of goaltenders though. Not a big deal.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Fun fact:
Despite his poor start to the season, Andersen still has a better SV% than Reimer, Bernier and Price.

Random thoughts:
How many #1 goalies are there, does every team have one?
What's the criteria for saying a goalie is a #1?
Is a goalie who hasn't made 10 starts by now a legit #1 goalie?
Last season, Andersen carried a huge work load, only 1 goalie had more than his 66 starts.
Out of goalies with more at least 40 starts, his SV% ranked 13th. Out of goalies with at least 50 starts, he ranked 9th.

He also had a poor start last season but by the time it was over, his numbers showed that for that season, he was (at least to my mind) a legit #1 goalie, and a slightly above average one at that.

At a glance, I see that out of goalies who have started 10 or more games this season, Andersen ranks 23rd by SV%. There being 31 teams, maybe that means he is playing like a legit #1, albeit a low end #1? And it's only been 15 games for him, after last season, doesn't he deserve better than all the people crapping on him the way they are?

Put your pitchforks away guys. Poor start or not, Andersen is our guy, let's get behind him the way we should be behind all our players (even JVR and Bozak LOL).

 

[taurine330]

We have had such a poor goaltending for the past decade that I think people are still experiencing PTSD from that.

 

[Mess]

Good to see Freddy steal one for the Leafs last night and Wild outshot, outplayed and outchanced the Leafs all night.

Without Auston the attack was very limited.

 

[The Kessel Run]

Bozak apparently played over 15 minutes. I honestly have no idea how he managed that, because I almost never saw him on the ice.

I saw him falling over and lobbing it up the middle a few times.

 

[Mess]

For the very first time since Matthews entered the league we got to see Hyman with 2 different players other than Auston and Willie on his line.

Hyman made a great play setting up Marleau for a goal, so at least now if nothing else we have a glimpse of what Hyman can do without Matthews and he did for Marleau what he does for his regular line.

 

[zeke]

For the very first time since Matthews entered the league we got to see Hyman with 2 different players other than Auston and Willie on his line.

Hyman made a great play setting up Marleau for a goal, so at least now if nothing else we have a glimpse of what Hyman can do without Matthews and he did for Marleau what he does for his regular line.

he also turned over the puck twice in a row to hand the Wild their first goal.

 

[Gallagbi]

His rebound control was excellent yesterday. If you're expecting him to not give up a rebound when a player shoots it at his pad from 2 feet away, you'll be let down by every goalie in the league.

The second goal hit him square in the crest...

 

[hotpaws]

For the very first time since Matthews entered the league we got to see Hyman with 2 different players other than Auston and Willie on his line.

Hyman made a great play setting up Marleau for a goal, so at least now if nothing else we have a glimpse of what Hyman can do without Matthews and he did for Marleau what he does for his regular line.

outside of that one play which was also due to very poor coverage and a shot that should have been saved he looked bad as did the majority of the team

but we got the bounces and the win and i'll take W while playing poorly than dominate the game and lose

 

[cookie]

Of all the games I've seen this year, Andersen has been responsible for more huge saves due to defensive breakdowns this year compared to last year. He's still allowing some softer goals, but at the same time, what goalie doesn't? Last I checked, it's still early in the season, and we are seeing many steady players struggling to play up to their level of play. I'll go line-by-line and bold guys who are making decisions that they don't usually make or just bad defensive players altogether:
Hyman - Matthews - Nylander
Komarov - Kadri - Brown
JVR - Bozak - Marner
Martin - Moore - Leivo
ex. Kapanen, Fehr
Rielly - Hainsey
Gardiner - Zaitsev
Borgman - Carrick

While it isn't fair to say other teams don't have defensively-deficient dullards, the sheer fact that 2/3 of what is supposed to be our matching line is not playing up to their billing is cause for concern. This means that, more often than not, the Leafs forward group on the ice will be a liability in transition and in their own end. If that wasn't bad enough, our second pairing has not been good this season either. Both guys were arguably the team's top defenders last year.

 

[deletethis]

Big Picture:

I'm not sure the team has played one complete good game all season and other than Matthews few of the players are off to a good start. Plus the goalie has been average to date. Yet here is the team with a 10-7 record. What happens when Andersen gets consistently good like he was most of last season and the players start playing closer to their abilities?