Post-Game Talk: Leafs lose in Boston. This is a recording.

[thusk]

You just don't get it. It doesn't matter if Marchand did it on purpose or if it was "just an unfortunate hockey play", when a guy who's known to be a dirty POS goes into the boards with one of your teammates who gets badly hurt as a result, you do something about immediately, if not sooner.

That's only if you're part of a team of course. If you're just a bunch of individuals, then you don't do anything. Instead, you wait until the game is over and watch the replay from 186 different angles hoping to find one you can point and say see, I'm not a gutless puke, it was an accident.

It's not just Marchand, the word is out and every team in the league knows that when you play the Leafs, you can do whatever you want because this team is nothing but a bunch of gutless pukes and therefore, there will never ever be any consequences/pushback.


You just don't get it. Taking a penalty if that's the cost of sending a message is fine and would help, not hurt our chances of winning a cup. Turning the other cheek maybe, just maybe gets us another irrelevant point or two in the standings after 82 games but is also a big part of why we get dummied year after year after year in the playoffs.

Player and coach having video replay on the bench, 15 sec later everyone on the bench already know it was accidental. You dont need 186 angle, just 1 ... every angle just show the same exact thing.

If on the ice, you dont see anything dangerous or intentionnal AND on replay just show the same thing... after this play was over and liljegren in locker room, leafs had absolutly 0 reason to respond. The only time it would be okay to react is immediatly after the bad hit and again its only if youre thinking it was a dirty hit

 

[MilkofthePoppy]

For the record, Perry should have had his skull caved in for his 'accident' on Tavares. That was a bullshit play.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Player and coach having video replay on the bench, 15 sec later everyone on the bench already know it was accidental. You dont need 186 angle, just 1 ... every angle just show the same exact thing.

If on the ice, you dont see anything dangerous or intentionnal AND on replay just show the same thing... after this play was over and liljegren in locker room, leafs had absolutly 0 reason to respond. The only time it would be okay to react is immediatly after the bad hit and again its only if youre thinking it was a dirty hit

Again, you just don't get it. When the biggest known to be dirty POS goes into the boards with your teammate who gets badly hurt on the play, an immediate response is required and whether that particular play was dirty or not is completely irrelevant. Not sure what your concern is here, if someone takes a shot at Marchand who deserves it many times over for past d-bag moves anyway, would that hurt you feelings or something?

 

[Evilhomer]

In what f***ing universe are we living in where we cannot use a center that we just made the highest paid player in the NHL at 3 on 3 OT?

This place is so dumb nowadays I swear to god.


Bert, you can't see the forest for the trees.

Keefe's lack of coaching ability is why Matthews/Marner did that dumb crap that lost of a bunch of OT's last year. He couldn't properly coach them to do things better in 3 on 3 OT.

He hasn't rectified the error yet, so his solution is to now take Matthews off the ice entirely and put a defensive center in a situation where there's no defensive structure at all.

You really can't see what's going on here?

Yeah, this really doesn't seem like complicated issue to me. Overtime is not much more than a skill and speed contest, so the idea of not playing your most skilled guys for as much time as possible seems like an idea too cute for its own good. Sometimes overthinking things doesn't work.

 

[Superstar]

Is Chara still playing for the Bruins?

 

[ACC1224]

Unless Kampf wins the draw, there is no tangible difference. We get ragged regardless of who loses the draw/possession.

It’s hilarious we can’t trust our so called Selke winger or two way franchise center to start.

Marner was on the ice to start.

 

[Arzak]

Yeah yeah... every time one of our guys gets injured on a dirty play its just a coincidence or a just a hockey play gone wrong. Give me a f***ing break. I coach a youth soccer team with more grit than these highly paid prima donnas. Those boys stick up for each other and I am proud of them when they do. There is a difference between being tough and dirty, but sometimes a harsh message needs to be sent.

It looked like a hockey play, but it was a trip. We see teams responding to clean hits. Who cares it wasn't intentional this time, that's for players safety department. Team needs to respond.Right or wrong

 

[thusk]

Again, you just don't get it. When the biggest known to be dirty POS goes into the boards with your teammate who gets badly hurt on the play, an immediate response is required and whether that particular play was dirty or not is completely irrelevant. Not sure what your concern is here, if someone takes a shot at Marchand who deserves it many times over for past d-bag moves anyway, would that hurt you feelings or something?

So you need tonrespond everytime one of your player losing his footing and fall into board???

The fact liljegren get seriously injured on the play dont make it worst than knies who also lost his footing felt into board but was not seriously injured ( dont remembered if it was vs lak or nashville) why nobody talking about that... Why the final result should make it worst ?

 

[PeteBestondrums]

Marchand's actions were most certainly intentional, but even it was an " accident", why do you get a penalty for accidentally high-sticking someone but not " accidentally " sending someone into a possibly career ending crash into the boards?
This league is nonsensical at times.

 

[hamzarocks]

2/6 points in the last 3. But let's take all the moral victories we can against a team without Bergeron, Krejci, Grzelcyk, and McAvoy. Good work.

2 of those guys dont exist any more in NHL world

 

[TheShape]

While Reaves has limited skill he was brought in to be our bouncer and take care of the dirty business and Ive seen enough of him in the past to know thats what he does and is pretty good at. Its becoming very clear that Keefe doesnt like rough and tumble hockey and has told Reaves to stand down. Its not the first time he has done that and Im sure it wont be the last but I wonder what Tre thinks about that. He stated he likes the tough stuff (snot) and he brought in Reaves so Reaves could do his thing only to have his enforcers wings clipped.

You could swap Reaves' name in this post with Matt Martin, Kyle Clifford, Wayne Simmonds etc and the same would ring true. We've brought in "snot" over the years, only then to make these guys into "puck possession" players instead. There's a common denominator here.

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

Its not because marchand had been stupid by the past than every thing hes doing on the ice is trying to injure

He tried to lift stick liljegren stick to win his position like everybody doing in a 1v1 battle. Kind of battle you see like 50 time everygame

Yes its suck it was an uncalled tripping penalty for sur and liljegren fall really hard on the board and seriously injured, but at the end it was just a 1v1 battle with a player losing his footing. It was not a dangerous play where you need to protect your teammate, it was just an unfortunate hockey play for liljegren.

You didn't answer the question. How would Vegas, Tampa, or Boston have reacted if the same play happened? Think they would do nothing?

 

[rumman]

Again, you just don't get it. When the biggest known to be dirty POS goes into the boards with your teammate who gets badly hurt on the play, an immediate response is required and whether that particular play was dirty or not is completely irrelevant. Not sure what your concern is here, if someone takes a shot at Marchand who deserves it many times over for past d-bag moves anyway, would that hurt you feelings or something?

Marchant, like Marchment (Brian)/ Ken Linsmen are hated by every team in the league except their own team, where they’re beloved. I wish the Leafs had a couple of them……..

 

[Guided by Veseys]

Randomly ranting here but it seems to me like it’s overwhelmingly Leafs fans who think it was dirty. Not really seeing much elsewhere where Marchand is getting called out for the play. So, in a nutshell, the players probably saw it that way as well. It’s a bit extreme to think of sending Reaves to go pound on Marchand in a situation like that. It maybe called for Rielly or Gio to do something about it but then they get filled in by Marchand and it’s pretty much pointless. It was a sketchy play but not nearly a classic Marchand slewfoot.

 

[Gary Nylund]

So you need tonrespond everytime one of your player losing his footing and fall into board???

The fact liljegren get seriously injured on the play dont make it worst than knies who also lost his footing felt into board but was not seriously injured ( dont remembered if it was vs lak or nashville) why nobody talking about that... Why the final result should make it worst ?

If that the way you'd characterize what happened? Seriously? Are you high?

 

[thusk]

You didn't answer the question. How would Vegas, Tampa, or Boston have reacted if the same play happened? Think they would do nothing?

Maybe in playoff with all emotionnal thing coming with but no i dont think thry would react to a teammate who lost his footing in a 1v1 battle...it was not a dangerous hit from behind or to the head, it was just a 1v1 battle who wasn't finish pretty well.

And like i said earlier, i dont even know what its the difference between that play or knies against nashville i think who lost his footing too in a 1v1 battle and hit the board really hard... except than liljegren had been seriously injured and not knies...

So i asking you the same question, why should be worst against liljegren than knies. The gravity of injury dont make the play worst or not, its the same exact play just with a different result

If that the way you'd characterize what happened? Seriously? Are you high?

1v1 physical battle marchand lost control of his stick who goes between liljegren leg and make liljegren losing his footing... so yes its 100% a 1v1 battle where a teammate losing his footing. If liljegren is not injured, ABSOLUTLY NOBODY would talk about it... but the result dont make this hockey play worst, sorry

 

[LaPlante94]

But Kampf is a better skater than Tavares is and better defensively. In terms of strategy it makes more sense to use Kampf and save Matthews and Tavares energy for when they have the puck.

It's 3v3. You're pretty much playing man coverage in the defensive zone or a zone like it's football depending on the coach. Don't got good skaters? Play a zone and force the other team to make a mistake. Matthews and Nylander our better skaters anyways so better to keep them on the bench until we get possession. Again though, the whole point of Kampf starting OT is to win the opening faceoff and then get off. He's at 43% on the season to Tavares 64% so use the better faceoff guy so we have a better chance to get possession. We lose the draw and lose in OT with Kampf on the ice anyways make the obvious change.

 

[Sypher04]

So you need tonrespond everytime one of your player losing his footing and fall into board???

The fact liljegren get seriously injured on the play dont make it worst than knies who also lost his footing felt into board but was not seriously injured ( dont remembered if it was vs lak or nashville) why nobody talking about that... Why the final result should make it worst ?

I get what you’re saying here, but Liljegren was tripped. That’s not what one would calling “losing his footing”. Those are entirely different things

 

[notbias]

It’s 3-on-3 hockey. I don’t think how good one is defensively really matters anymore in that type of situation.

Play your best players. It’s not that hard to grasp unless you’re Keefe.

We tried it a million times and failed... they change immediately if they get possession in OT, and Matthews has some terrible D zone coverage in only OT.

I don't mind the Kampf/Brodie/Marner thing assuming as soon as we get possession get Rielly and Matthews on.

It's 3v3. You're pretty much playing man coverage in the defensive zone or a zone like it's football depending on the coach. Don't got good skaters? Play a zone and force the other team to make a mistake. Matthews and Nylander our better skaters anyways so better to keep them on the bench until we get possession. Again though, the whole point of Kampf starting OT is to win the opening faceoff and then get off. He's at 43% on the season to Tavares 64% so use the better faceoff guy so we have a better chance to get possession. We lose the draw and lose in OT with Kampf on the ice anyways make the obvious change.

Matthews always seems to lose his man in OT.

I'd be fine with Tavares, but don't want Matthews starting because he seems to skip coverage too often in OT.

 

[Racer88]

Did you notice the bench when Reaves was having a chat with Marchand after the can opener? Everyone looked like they didn't care. So instead of all of them at the very least giving Marchand an earful they gazed into space. But the most egregious look was on Bertuzzi's face. That half smile while looking anywhere but at Marchand was disgusting and inexcusable. I wanted to jump through my tv screen and smack his ugly face. I hope someone has a screen shot. If you're not going to contribute offensively, or hitting, at least show that you care about your teammate.

Yup Bertuzzi was laughing. He should be a healthy scratch next game

Its not because marchand had been stupid by the past than every thing hes doing on the ice is trying to injure

He tried to lift stick liljegren stick to win his position like everybody doing in a 1v1 battle. Kind of battle you see like 50 time everygame

Yes its suck it was an uncalled tripping penalty for sur and liljegren fall really hard on the board and seriously injured, but at the end it was just a 1v1 battle with a player losing his footing. It was not a dangerous play where you need to protect your teammate, it was just an unfortunate hockey play for liljegren.

Wow just wow

 

[thusk]

I get what you’re saying here, but Liljegren was tripped. That’s not what one would calling “losing his footing”. Those are entirely different things

The only difference is its deserce a 2 min penalty for tripping because your responsible of your stick...but at the end still only 2 player 1v1 battle who finished pretty badly

If liljegren is not injured ABSOLUTLY NOBODY would talk about it... so at end whats really concerning is not the battle who finishing with a trip marchand vs liljegren, its only the result and nothing else.

 

[AcerComputer]

It’s 3-on-3 hockey. I don’t think how good one is defensively really matters anymore in that type of situation.

Play your best players. It’s not that hard to grasp unless you’re Keefe.

What's not hard to grasp is wasting Matthews on playing defensive hockey if they lose the draw, and the opportunity to switch out after losing the draw is not there. He then has to go off ice by the time they recover the puck. It makes perfect sense to only use him once you have possession. If it makes more sense to have Tavares start OT to win the draw, then fine, but he is a slower skater.

I also don’t understand what’s wrong with Matthews and why Keefe can’t trust him to win a faceoff anytime, let alone in OT. Something wrong with his wrist or something?

Maybe it was the fact he didn't win a single faceoff all night and has been brutal this year to start.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Maybe in playoff with all emotionnal thing coming with but no i dont think thry would react to a teammate who lost his footing in a 1v1 battle...it was not a dangerous hit from behind or to the head, it was just a 1v1 battle who wasn't finish pretty well.

And like i said earlier, i dont even know what its the difference between that play or knies against nashville i think who lost his footing too in a 1v1 battle and hit the board really hard... except than liljegren had been seriously injured and not knies...

So i asking you the same question, why should be worst against liljegren than knies. The gravity of injury dont make the play worst or not, its the same exact play just with a different result


1v1 physical battle marchand lost control of his stick who goes between liljegren leg and make liljegren losing his footing... so yes its 100% a 1v1 battle where a teammate losing his footing. If liljegren is not injured, ABSOLUTLY NOBODY would talk about it... but the result dont make this hockey play worst, sorry

Further discussion with you on this subject is obviously pointless. Several people have tried to explain to you what's what and if you still don't understand, then you probably never will. I can only assume you have never played team sports and that's fine.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Thought we played a solid road game. Boston showed why they are the class of the league yet again. This game had a playoff intensity, and we ultimately lost due to making 2 very costly mistakes.

1st GA was a complete fire drill. Ya Klinberg deserves a ton of blame on that play, but realistically that was 5 men all in the wrong position. Mo was literally at the point second before that puck crossed the goal line. Truly baffling display of "structure" in our own end.

2nd GA is all on Brodie. You just can't try and make that play at the far blue line against a team like this. There's zero awareness on his end to who is on the ice for the bruins. I knew the very second he dove for that puck that there'd be an odd man rush going back the other way. It was a lose lose situation. Not exactly sure what he was thinking TBH

Other then that, I liked our battle for most of the night TBH. Our first period was really solid with exception to the brain far 1st goal. Our 2nd period was really solid, probably should have gone into the intermission up 3-2. The 3rd was a bit of a chess match, but I was happy with the period overall.

OT was meh. Willy can't take that penalty. But other then that, we did OK.

Shootouts are irrelevant to me TBH.

That said, I just cannot understand the lack of response to the Marchand/Lilly incident. I am not expecting Reaves to fight Marchand. That's a matchup that would result in an instigator, and almost guaranteed to be broken up before it even starts. But the team didn't even seem fazed by it all. The apathy displayed on that bench is unacceptable, and it needs to change right away. You got Lilly down in the corner, and Bert chuckling at Marchand on the bench?? I would not be surprised if that was the reason he actually got benched. It's not OK.

I think there's more than one person to look at in the goals against.

First goal, yes, Mo was out of position, but so was JT, and Willy was slow reacting and didn't cover.

Second goal, yes, a bad decision at their blueline, but a big rebound right into the slot, and Mitch let his man go to put it in the net.

On the other hand, good to see Mitch and Matty on the scoreboard.

 

[myleafs]

I agree that the possibility that Keefe has "immasculated" Reaves exists, however it doesn't excuse the fact that he's no longer an NHL player who can contribute on the 4th line. He can't keep up with energy 4 liners he's up against and he's a minus 6 with an avg of 7:51 minutes of icetime...he's a liablity out there. If it's true that he isn't allowed to fight, or play to his limited strength, then you've proven my point that he shouldn't be in the lineup.

Im def not disputing his lack of hockey acumen and have been someone shocked at how bad he is at skating and handling the puck. The first two games of the season were what I thought we were getting with Reaves and I was ok with it as he was bringing an element this team sorely lacks but he has been neutered and has been rendered totally useless and I cant help but think its Keefe who is responsible.