Line Combos: Leafs' biggest need?

[egd27]

Been a lurker for years. Can confirm these 2 never happened.

A.) Everyone said "wtf are we watching" before covid ended the season. Barely maintaining .500 hockey at one point and games were a bore. Fred letting in 6 goals every third or so game.
B.) When hockey came back it was the general consensus that Jackets are inferior to the Leafs.

B is a non story for me either way. Sports world doesn't work like a bunch of message board debates. A fan is going to root for his team when the playoffs come around and there will be bias. Big deal. If that triggers you, that's weird. It's entertainment at the end of the day. Second, pro-Dubas people said Jackets are inferior and Leafs should take the series. So b.) as a whole is false. Sadness and embarrassment follows and a lot of Marner bashing. Maybe the 1 person you were arguing with said B.) and you use it to generalize as a fact. I see that happening a lot in my short time here within the crowd that thinks their anger and disappointment is worth more than facts and logic.

So your assertions are that:

1. The folks that support almost every Dubas move did not argue that the Leafs were a Top 10 Team once Keefe took over from Babcock
2. That many of these same folks, when discussing the Leafs being favorites against CBJ, don't point to the fact that they were tied in points over the 2019-20 season so they were more or less equal.

I'm afraid I have to disagree. But welcome to the discussions.

 

[Bluelines]

To me it points out that 2 high paid stars got beat by 1 high paid star further pointing out that the model of spending all that money on those two is flawed.

Sometimes that happens the playoffs, goalies take over and win series, Ward in Carolina, Binnington in St Lou, Quick in LA. Matthews is too good of a player to go 0 for his career, he's going to have a break out playoffs, when who knows. Same goes for Mitch.

 

[mikeyz]

Matthews is too good of a player to go 0 for his career, he's going to have a break out playoffs, when who knows. Same goes for Mitch.

In theory, you’re right. But, after that 3 to 1 choke job, I am no longer convinced.

I really think that playoff failure is now officially in Matthews and the other members of the core 4’s heads and that’s going to be a very tough obstacle to overcome IMO.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Maybe the 1 person you were arguing with said B.) and you use it to generalize as a fact.

Funny enough, nobody actually said it. It was taken out of a longer statement which was actually making the complete opposite point that to call them lesser acknowledges that there is more to evaluating something than simply looking at a team record.

 

[zeke]

If the underlying metrics indicate Mitch and Matthews are dominating but they are not scoring, is that choking or is that just hot goalie, good defensive strategy, good opposition coaching?

For me the choking is when Mitch zipped the puck over the boards, I think choking = panic move. If the offensive metrics indicate they are doing everything right, IMO that means hot goalie, good defensive posturing.

Well I don't think price is anything special, and tb showed that.

Why I view it as choking is that they created golden chances but couldn't finish. To me that's no different than the puck over the glass. Just an inability to bear down at the critical moment - nothing to do with their skill level, which still let them pretty much dominate the matchup - simply their ability to convert when the chances their skill created needed to be finished off.

 

[zeke]

In theory, you’re right. But, after that 3 to 1 choke job, I am no longer convinced.

I really think that playoff failure is now officially in Matthews and the other members of the core 4’s heads and that’s going to be a very tough obstacle to overcome IMO.

It's obviously in their heads now. And this market doesn't help. It's gonna take some serious resolve to break through.

Of course you know if we traded any of them they'd break through in a less pressured environment no problem.

 

[ShaneFalco]

In theory, you’re right. But, after that 3 to 1 choke job, I am no longer convinced.

I really think that playoff failure is now officially in Matthews and the other members of the core 4’s heads and that’s going to be a very tough obstacle to overcome IMO.

You could see it in the way they played in game 7. Even before game 7. Playing scared

 

[All Mod Cons]

You could see it in the way they played in game 7. Even before game 7. Playing scared

I'll never forget Jake Gardiner's face when the national anthems were playing before game 7 against Boston. Scared shitless.

 

[Bluelines]

Well I don't think price is anything special, and tb showed that.

Why I view it as choking is that they created golden chances but couldn't finish. To me that's no different than the puck over the glass. Just an inability to bear down at the critical moment - nothing to do with their skill level, which still let them pretty much dominate the matchup - simply their ability to convert when the chances their skill created needed to be finished off.

Toronto, Winnipeg, LV all had issues with Price, one team didn't because they have a 3 time cup winning coach that understands how to coach.

I think the phrase bear down is over used phrase, I think the word you are looking for is produce and you referenced finished off and convert. Their advance stats actually look really good for that series, all the stats suggest both of them should have had a good series.

Watch the series highlights again and tell me Price was not a significant factor, he made saves no goalie has any business making. Say he made 4 great saves on Marner and 4 great saves on Matthews in the 7 games and I'm being conservative. That is the difference in the series. If Matthews and Marner score 4 goals each, that would be considered a pretty good series for both of them right?

 

[zeke]

Toronto, Winnipeg, LV all had issues with Price, one team didn't because they have a 3 time cup winning coach that understands how to coach.

I think the phrase bear down is over used phrase, I think the word you are looking for is produce and you referenced finished off and convert. Their advance stats actually look really good for that series, all the stats suggest both of them should have had a good series.

Watch the series highlights again and tell me Price was not a significant factor, he made saves no goalie has any business making. Say he made 4 great saves on Marner and 4 great saves on Matthews in the 7 games and I'm being conservative. That is the difference in the series. If Matthews and Marner score 4 goals each, that would be considered a pretty good series for both of them right?

well if you think it was just a hot goalie again, that's fair enough. you could be right.

 

[Racer88]

Sometimes that happens the playoffs, goalies take over and win series, Ward in Carolina, Binnington in St Lou, Quick in LA. Matthews is too good of a player to go 0 for his career, he's going to have a break out playoffs, when who knows. Same goes for Mitch.

I sincerely hope you are right and believe that Mathews will break out but as far as Marner goes it’s been almost 3 years of playoffs for him with almost no goals.

 

[Bluelines]

I'll never forget Jake Gardiner's face when the national anthems were playing before game 7 against Boston. Scared shitless.

He had the look that he was trying to figure out questions rolling around in his head...

Did I turn off the stove?
Did I?
I think I did?
I didn't?

Shhhhit I didn't turn off the stove...

(Boston Scores..... foghorn)

What's that sound?
Is that my fire alarm?

(Boston Scores..... foghorn)

What if you combined a Shih Tzu and a Pit bull.... would you call it a Sh-it?

(Boston Scores..... foghorn)

Can SOMEONE turn off their car alarm...!!! It's going off every time I it the ice...

 

[Bluelines]

well if you think it was just a hot goalie again, that's fair enough. you could be right.

Not just Price, I think he was some of it, I think we were out coached, guilty of trying to be too pretty at times, guilty of not having the right depth. JT getting hurt didn't help. Not respecting Danault's line enough to consistently try and get our top line away from him. Marner was shooting too much, if he is shooting it means Matthews is not. Mitch is simply not a goal scorer.

One thing that is pretty universal, I don't see a single thread about our D or goalie being at fault, that is something different for me as a Leaf fan, its always the D , it's always the goalies fault. it's nice that we have a set D and set goalie tandem (all be it an injury prone goalie tandem)

 

[tmlms13]

Powerplay

 

[Racer88]

Powerplay

Oh, do we have a power play

 

[ShaneFalco]

I'll never forget Jake Gardiner's face when the national anthems were playing before game 7 against Boston. Scared shitless.

That dude had the best expressions

 

[ShaneFalco]

Oh, do we have a power play

A pathetic one and never going to win anything with it so bad and no adjustments. Take Mitch off of it - at least pp1

 

[All Mod Cons]

He had the look that he was trying to figure out questions rolling around in his head...

Did I turn off the stove?
Did I?
I think I did?
I didn't?

Shhhhit I didn't turn off the stove...

(Boston Scores..... foghorn)

What's that sound?
Is that my fire alarm?

(Boston Scores..... foghorn)

What if you combined a Shih Tzu and a Pit bull.... would you call it a Sh-it?

(Boston Scores..... foghorn)

Can SOMEONE turn off their car alarm...!!! It's going off every time I it the ice...

 

[darrylsittler27]

There is absolutely no way that defense can win a round if Muzzin goes down again.