Las Vegas building an arena?

[Kebekoi]

I think the era of 19-20k arenas is coming to an end. Developers are realizing that they can't count on sellout crowds every night, and an ocean of empty seats does nothing to promote a sense that you're someplace special.

I think that "traditionals" markets can continue to have big arenas as they will sell-out anyway. Winnipeg played it safe in building a 15k seats building. I hope that the new Colisée to be announced tomorrow is 18k.

On the LV concept : like the other poster said, that is the Big Owe XXX.

 

[Hawker14]

In regards to an NHL team possibly in Vegas, I foresee it just being another failure.

Like Phoenix, it likely will have a small but loyal fanbase, and as such, tourists will be required to attend in high numbers for the business plan to have any chance to succeed, which is the problem. To generalize, people go to Phoenix for the weather and to golf. People go to Vegas to gamble. Few want to watch hockey games, especially in the numbers necessary for an NHL team to be successful.

 

[Buck Aki Berg]

Wouldn't it be cheaper to just build desalination plants in California instead?

If SimCity has taught me anything, it's that desalination has a damn hefty price tag. It's probably cheaper to move fresh water 3,000 miles than it is to move salt water 500 miles and then desalinate it.

 

[AllByDesign]

If SimCity has taught me anything

 

[HanSolo]

Groundbreaking for the proposed 20000 seat AIG arena started in 2008, but the project was halted when the economy went bad.

 

[Killion]

In regards to an NHL team possibly in Vegas, I foresee it just being another failure.....Like Phoenix, it likely will have a small but loyal fanbase, and as such, tourists will be required to attend in high numbers for the business plan to have any chance to succeed, which is the problem.

I agree. You'd have to have a number of the Casino's buying huge blocks of tickets & luxury boxes because corporate presence is next to nil. Slammed by the foreclosure crisis, the economic downturn & fewer visitors, unemployment and a transient population base, I dont think any of the so called Big 4 sports' stands a chance in Hell of surviving long in Vegas, the NHL in particular IMO a virtual certainty to fail. To be frank, I dont much care for the league holding its Awards Ceremonies down their either, a crass & plastic affair that'd be better off held on a rotational basis in cities that have NHL teams.

 

[Kebekoi]

I agree. You'd have to have a number of the Casino's buying huge blocks of tickets & luxury boxes because corporate presence is next to nil. Slammed by the foreclosure crisis, the economic downturn & fewer visitors, unemployment and a transient population base, I dont think any of the so called Big 4 sports' stands a chance in Hell of surviving long in Vegas, the NHL in particular IMO a virtual certainty to fail. To be frank, I dont much care for the league holding its Awards Ceremonies down their either, a crass & plastic affair that'd be better off held on a rotational basis in cities that have NHL teams.

They should do the Awards in the same city that do the Draft, in the same week end.

Here are the big moments in a season :

*Season begins*
Entry Draft
Free Agency Day (NHL could do an event)
NHL Premiere Europe
Winter Classic
Skills Competition/All-Star Game or Winter Olympics
Hockey Day in Canada
Hockey Day in America
Heritage Classic
Trade deadline (NHL could do an event)
Stanley Cup Finals
Awards
*Season ends*

 

[htpwn]

That's why they have a plan to export water from the 5 Great Lakes down south and out west until they all dry up.

Not to take this too off topic, but there was actually a documentary a while ago that talked about this. One of the interesting decisions in the upcoming years is whether water constitutes a resource similar to oil and thus falls under NAFTA. The U.S. will obviously claim it does, Canada will claim it doesn't.

 

[Buck Aki Berg]

Not to take this too off topic, but there was actually a documentary a while ago that talked about this. One of the interesting decisions in the upcoming years is whether water constitutes a resource similar to oil and thus falls under NAFTA. The U.S. will obviously claim it does, Canada will claim it doesn't.

The US has all of Lake Michigan, so even if we make a stink about it, they have an option.

 

[Killion]

They should do the Awards in the same city that do the Draft, in the same week end.

The NHL seems loathe to combine events Kebekoi. They seem to like to divvy things up as separate "revenue centers". The Awards Ceremony's are a joke really, buried deep in the playoffs', ratings abysmal. Its just an expensive party really. It should be combined with the All Star Game, which IMO should be played Outdoors, possibly combining as well the annual Hockey Hall of Fame Inductions. As for Vegas, like I said; great place to party, no place for a serious sports league to be rewarding excellence on the ice, unless it floats in a glass, which is really the whole point oui'?....

 

[CorbeauNoir]

It looks to me like it was designed by architects employed up north at Area 51 who used reverse Alien engineering techniques, the buildings themselves capable of interstellar flight. Mass abductions. Only in Vegas. New attraction. Im in.

These are obviously preliminary renderings, but to me it screams 'wannabe-Dubai'. Yech.

 

[lockstock]

On what proof?

Most of the water in use is coming in from the Colorado River. So, if that's the case, will that river be dry? That would be a bigger problem for LA and SoCal as that's were they get a large portion of their water.

Search google for Lake Mead water levels. This is a major problem that is starting to get some real attention. There are news stories about this all of the time. Right now they are letting hundreds of billions of gallons out of Lake Powell on spring forecasts of water melt. The Hoover Dam was built during the wettest time of the last 500 years and many believe the southwest is going back to it's normal precipitation levels. A severe drought over the last 11 years has really dropped the water levels. This year's snow will help, but it's only 25-50% higher than an average pre-drought year.

If the water keeps dropping, the lake could be too small to generate power within a few years. Some believe that's why Lake Powell is being drained now. There is even a chance that Lake Powell will have to be completely drained just to give Hoover Dam and SoCal/Las Vegas a few years to get alternative power/water supplies online. With all of the water taken by Imperial Valley farmers, Las Vegas, LA county, etc, it's been a long time since the Colorado River made it to the ocean.

 

[Killion]

Not to take this too off topic, but there was actually a documentary a while ago that talked about this. One of the interesting decisions in the upcoming years is whether water constitutes a resource similar to oil and thus falls under NAFTA. The U.S. will obviously claim it does, Canada will claim it doesn't.

I think I saw that too. Chinatown. Hollis Mulwray, Jake Gittes. What the Sam Hill do water rights & supply have to do with Vegas's alien-hybrid reverse-engineered plasma powered flying stadia have to do with the Great Lakes?.

 

[KevFu]

Honestly, I'd put a team in Vegas before I would have put teams in Phoenix or Miami.

Obviously, Vegas is a tourism driven town. But they are still the size of San Jose when it comes to locals.

And it's not like the locals are playing at the casinos every night; or going to shows every night. Because if they did, they'd be broke.

So the entertainment dollars from the sports fans living in Las Vegas is there. And you'd be the first to hit that market. If you only have one local team, the city will get behind that team. (San Jose & Columbus for example).

And while Vegas isn't the size of LA, Chicago, Philly, Boston, Detroit, etc... The sponsorship dollars are plentiful. Some hotel is going to pay for the right to be the official hotel of the team (and get all the visiting teams to stay there).

I think Vegas would work better than most warm-weather markets.

That being said, I'd rather see Vegas get a team AFTER Winnipeg, Quebec City and Houston.

 

[kdb209]

Obviously, Vegas is a tourism driven town. But they are still the size of San Jose when it comes to locals.

Not really.

San Jose (city) - 964,695 (10th largest city in US)
Las Vegas (city) - 567,641 (#28)

San Jose (MSA/CSA) - 1,839,700 (#31) / 7,427,757 (#6)
Las Vegas (MSA/CSA) - 1,902,834 (#30) / 1,947,068 (#25)

San Jose is the largest city in the Bay Area - the 6th largest metro area in the US.

Due to historical reasons - going back to when San Jose was largely an agricultural region - the US Census Bureau arbitrarily splits the Bay Area into two MSAs (San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont, CA MSA & San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara, CA MSA).

The Sharks draw from significantly more than just the San Jose MSA (which is basically just Santa Clara County). While the whole Bay Area CSA (San Jose-San Francisco-Oakland, CA CSA) may overstate the Sharks market - the 4 counties which provide the bulk of the Sharks fanbase (Santa Clara, San Mateo, Alameda, San Francisco) have a combined population of ~5M.

This is a bit of a pet peeve of mine. I live ~16 miles from the HP Pavilion/Downtown San Jose. If I move 1/2 mile further north, suddenly I would no longer be in the San Jose metro area (according to people who blindly look at the MSA boundries). There are people who live ~10 miles from the Tank (in Fremont, Alameda Co) who are not counted in the San Jose MSA.

 

[htpwn]

Don't hate on Simcity. I still got SimCity 2000 somewhere around my place.

I think I saw that too. Chinatown. Hollis Mulwray, Jake Gittes. What the Sam Hill do water rights & supply have to do with Vegas's alien-hybrid reverse-engineered plasma powered flying stadia have to do with the Great Lakes?.

Well, if Vegas goes dry it won't be able to survive and the team will be forced to fold.

Anyways, these designs look a lot like several of the new stadia going up in Asia and the Middle East.

 

[dbr2]

This won't ****ing work.

Waste of money.

 

[AllByDesign]

Don't hate on Simcity. I still got SimCity 2000 somewhere around my place.

Not hating on SIMCity... love the game. The statement cracked me up.

 

[sushinsky4tsar]

It would make for an A+ Super Bowl destination.

 

[Blue Dragon]

Unlike the NBA/NFL/NBA, the NHL, though keeping it lower key, doesnt steer away from gaming or Vegas and either still has or (dont know if they still do?) had a sponsorship deal with PokerStars.net, an entry level online gaming service that can lead to serious betting as you work your way through & up the rungs of the ladder. Numerous NHL players used in commercials. Additionally, the NHL moved its annual Awards from Toronto to Vegas a few years ago, the reason being the "celebratory" nature of Vegas as opposed to the staid confines of T.O.. None of the other sports with the exception of Basketball, and even they with reservations, want to be associated with nor closely connected to the gaming industry, however, the NHL has no such compunctions or scruples, and Vegas has long been hungry for major league sports status.

It's nothing to do with scruples or compunctions, it's to do with the fact that people don't bet on hockey.