Post-Game Talk: Koskivezina

[North]

I am not concerned because they are winning games using a formula that will impact offense until the team learns the system better.

Winning matters.

And lets be honest, this team needed to learn how to play without the puck.

That's the focus right now.

 

[guymez]

And lets be honest, this team needed to learn how to play without the puck.

That's the focus right now.

100%.

I have been beside myself watching the poor decision making from this team this season so far. There was no way the team was going to win until that was cleaned up.
Thats exactly why I posted a thread (with examples) about that very thing.

 

[McJadeddog]

I am not concerned because they are winning games using a formula that will impact offense until the team learns the system better.

Winning matters.

Hitch's system will depress scoring, even once the team learns the system well. This has been proven pretty definitively in his last few NHL tours. I suppose that is bad for those who like to cheer for McDavid to win the Art Ross, because he likely won't win it this year with Hitch as the coach. But I think the long term gain of having Hitch as the coach for the next 5 months is worth sacrificing another Art Ross for McDavid. Lets face it, Hitch won't be here next year. Chia will be fired once we miss the playoffs, a new GM will be hired, and that new GM will hire a new coach. But I don't mind the players concentrating on defense for the majority of a season, as they won't forget those lessons.

 

[guymez]

Hitch's system will depress scoring, even once the team learns the system well. This has been proven pretty definitively in his last few NHL tours. I suppose that is bad for those who like to cheer for McDavid to win the Art Ross, because he likely won't win it this year with Hitch as the coach. But I think the long term gain of having Hitch as the coach for the next 5 months is worth sacrificing another Art Ross for McDavid. Lets face it, Hitch won't be here next year. Chia will be fired once we miss the playoffs, a new GM will be hired, and that new GM will hire a new coach. But I don't mind the players concentrating on defense for the majority of a season, as they won't forget those lessons.

This post especially the bolded is nonsense. Post some evidence.

 

[McJadeddog]

Its generally not tenable to win games by scoring an average of 2goals/game and trying to average less than that. The Kings at times did it for awhile but had a perfect lineup in which to try to do that.

The Oilers lack a shutdown pairing and they lack classic shutdown players. What we hve instead is a lot of try on some nights as long as the players are on board taking the games more seriously than the opposition. So that what we see here is waves. Right now we're riding a good wave. Enjoy it as long as it lasts but I don't see the 1GA/game continuing. Or having so much success winning games by 1 goal.

What the poster meant by margin is that good teams can close out some games and win by margins. To remove doubt. We win by 1 goal, lose by several, not a great combination for odds.

Yeah, but we're NOT a good team, we're a fairly bad team. Yes, winning by more than, or scoring more than 2, would be great, but so what? We are dreaming if we think either of those things is going to happen with any regularity with this current roster.

 

[McJadeddog]

This post especially the bolded is nonsense. Post some evidence.

I can't remember the exact number, but something like 15-17 players on Dallas had offensive down years last year. This exact statistic has been referenced a few times on Oilers broadcasts in the past couple weeks. I did a little searching and couldn't find a print version of the statistic, although I've read it as well. I'm not your internet-research-assistant though, take my word for it or don't, I could care less.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Hitch's system will depress scoring, even once the team learns the system well. This has been proven pretty definitively in his last few NHL tours. I suppose that is bad for those who like to cheer for McDavid to win the Art Ross, because he likely won't win it this year with Hitch as the coach. But I think the long term gain of having Hitch as the coach for the next 5 months is worth sacrificing another Art Ross for McDavid. Lets face it, Hitch won't be here next year. Chia will be fired once we miss the playoffs, a new GM will be hired, and that new GM will hire a new coach. But I don't mind the players concentrating on defense for the majority of a season, as they won't forget those lessons.

My experience as a fan of the Oilers leaves me to be not so convinced. Instead I've seen decades of learning that lasts for all of 1,2, or 3 games.

What I've thought most about Oilers teams is they learn one thing, Forget another, as if long term memory is significantly limited.

Its why I'm never too moved by a couple defensive performances. We've seen Oilers teams regress so much its expected. Maybe this time its different. We'll know by Christmas.

 

[booyakasha]

Yeah, but we're NOT a good team, we're a fairly bad team. Yes, winning by more than, or scoring more than 2, would be great, but so what? We are dreaming if we think either of those things is going to happen with any regularity with this current roster.

I disagree, I actually think we're rather a really good team.
Yet to hit our stride.

 

[guymez]

I can't remember the exact number, but something like 15-17 players on Dallas had offensive down years last year. This exact statistic has been referenced a few times on Oilers broadcasts in the past couple weeks.

With all due respect if you are going to make a claim like you did then you need to back it up.

Your post looks to me like a collection of nonsensical thoughts supported by nothing. If I am wrong than it should be easy for you to find some evidence and post it.

If I was to extend this a little further then I would suggest that you are once again inventing a reason to remain negative about the team. Your post history backs that up 100%.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Yeah, but we're NOT a good team, we're a fairly bad team. Yes, winning by more than, or scoring more than 2, would be great, but so what? We are dreaming if we think either of those things is going to happen with any regularity with this current roster.

Just to keep score I'm not disagreeing.

Where are the goals coming from? We have 3 usual goal scorers on this whole roster. We're depending on hands of Chiasson and Caggiulia. I mean what could possibly go wrong?

 

[McJadeddog]

With all due respect if you are going to make a claim like you did then you need to back it up.

Your post looks to me like a collection of nonsensical thoughts supported by nothing. If I am wrong than it should be easy for you to find some evidence and post it.

If I was to extend this a little further then I would suggest that you are once again inventing a reason to remain negative about the team. Your post history backs that up 100%.

Like I said, I've seen in on TV, and I thought I read it (although I can't find it on the net, so maybe I didn't read it?). I'm not about to go re-watch all the games. If you are that interested, go look at the Dallas stats, and see if I'm right.

Edit: It was bugging me that I couldn't find this information. So I went and looked at the players who were on Dallas in 16-17 and 17-18 (when Hitch took over). I looked at the top-23 scorers on the team in 16-17 (arbitrary cutoff). There were 14 of these players that were on the team the next year. 6 had worst seasons under Hitch, 7 had better, and 1 was the same. So clearly I misheard on the TV. This is weird as I heard it a couple times, so I dunno to be honest? At any point, this was not true in Dallas, so I retract my statement regarding Hitch's effect on scoring in his last couple stops, as it was clearly not the case in Dallas.

 

[guymez]

Like I said, I've seen in on TV, and I thought I read it (although I can't find it on the net, so maybe I didn't read it?). I'm not about to go re-watch all the games. If you are that interested, go look at the Dallas stats, and see if I'm right.

Edit: It was bugging me that I couldn't find this information. So I went and looked at the players who were on Dallas in 16-17 and 17-18 (when Hitch took over). I looked at the top-23 scorers on the team in 16-17 (arbitrary cutoff). There were 14 of these players that were on the team the next year. 6 had worst seasons under Hitch, 7 had better, and 1 was the same. So clearly I misheard on the TV. This is weird as I heard it a couple times, so I dunno to be honest? At any point, this was not true in Dallas, so I retract my statement regarding Hitch's effect on scoring in his last couple stops, as it was clearly not the case in Dallas.

Its not weird at all...its called a negative bias.

 

[Hippasus]

McDavid totally set the tone in the first with his goal, because it was really looking like the Golden Knights were going to get on the board first. Koskinen is exactly what this team needs at this moment with the coaching change: a defensive leader. Otherwise, the Oilers had good forechecking from the Identity line, and good penalty killing and overall defensive play from Draisaitl. This team is at .500.

 

[Senor Catface]

Yeah, but we're NOT a good team, we're a fairly bad team. Yes, winning by more than, or scoring more than 2, would be great, but so what? We are dreaming if we think either of those things is going to happen with any regularity with this current roster.

Shocker you think that. You are miserable.

 

[booyakasha]

McDavid totally set the tone in the first with his goal, because it was really looking like the Golden Knights were going to get on the board first. Koskinen is exactly what this team needs at this moment with the coaching change: a defensive leader. Otherwise, the Oilers had good forechecking from the Identity line, and good penalty killing and overall defensive play from Draisaitl. This team is at .500.

we are actually over .500, which is a good thing.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

 

[McJadeddog]

Its not weird at all...its called a negative bias.

I'm negative in regards to this terrible team, that is true. But I would have bet money that I heard that correctly. Oh well, apparently not. It's good news though, because after hearing that (or thinking I had anyhow), I was worried about how Hitch would affect McDavid.

 

[McJadeddog]

Shocker you think that. You are miserable.

Well, all the evidence would back me up, soooo......

 

[RegDunlop]

Very seldom does a post cut right to the chase. You nailed it. But it isn't recent either. Edmonton market is like this, and always has been. Just watched the Documentary on Fuhr last night again. At one point Sather has to intervene and send Fuhr to the minors becaue the relationship between fans and player had become so toxic that Fuhr literally was just going to be getting constantly catcalled playing here. Fuhr had a shoulder injury/operation and things weren't going well for him. At one point he called the fans jerks. The gloves were off, I remember the time. The same fans at Northlands actually booed and griped about Coffey and Messier, if you can believe it. For around 2 seasons those players were getting the gears and in both instances I think it stemmed from a contract holdout.

I highlight the bolded because it is an illustration of a dynamic influence. That the Oilers sucking relates to a collective feeling among fans, to a negativity, that we are all impacted by. Its easy enough to feel it. Its like the constant expectation something will go wrong in a game. We're watching the games and sometimes we catch ourselves thinking this bad thing is going to occur. That's an example of the conditioned process.

What is ridiculous to me is that all you people think that this is exclusive only the Oilers.
EVERY orgs fans do this. And every star player is susceptible to it. Being under more scrutiny comes with the territory.

And I can't believe anyone responds or gives another moment of thought to the dumb fu**ers whom consistently post the same garbage. Why engage?

As the Coffey, Mess, et al, it had nothing to do with contract status. When they sucked, they got called out for it. Messier gave the puck away 17 times a game, Coffey had 2 stupid braindead plays most games and on and on. Dosent mean we didn't love them when they performed. Which - like Drai - they did a hell of a lot more than not.

I think your having a bit of revisionist history. When it was warranted, as is with Drai, and yes McD at times, there's nothing wrong with it.
And you should remember as well, back then it wasnt much different than now. Some knowledgeable and true fans questioning the effort, but always some a**holes with nothing more to offer than "he sucks".

 

[Tyrolean]

As a guy who was saying Mclellan quit on his team last season and should have definitely been fired for it, watching Hitchcock coach the Oilers makes me hate Mclellan even more.

Hitchcock is making an effort to win games and help his players get better. He backs up what he talks about.

That story that was told tonight about him asking Modano to watch McDavid for a few games to get his input on how he could help McDavid get better was something you’d never hear from Mclellan.

When did you ever hear anything about Mclellan doing anything to help the players? What we did hear was stories from explayers saying they never had any communication with him. The guy expected his players to be a finished product and for them to figure things out on there own. I agree with whoever it was that called him a lazy coach a week or so ago.Those 21 games he got to start the season were a waste of everyone’s time. Never should have happened.

There's no proof of this McClellan's been a good coach for years.

 

[Tyrolean]

So how do our lines look when healthy and who's the odd one out?

Chiasson-McDavid-Draisatl
Cagguila-Hopkins-Puljujarvi
Lucic-Brodziak-Kassian
Khaira-Spooner-Rattie
Zykov-Rieder

I'd guess Garrison is waived to make room for Rieder?

Lucic! if they had any guts,

 

[McAsuno]

Special f*** you to flames kiss ass Hrudey for his typical bashing on RNH along with that other clown Krypeos. Its amazing these guys are panel worthy. Absolute trash unless it comes to the flames and leafs.

 

[Hippasus]

we are actually over .500, which is a good thing.

I'm adding OL's to L's for a better indication of real .500. For loser points skew the mean that is real .500.

 

[JariCurry]

There's no proof of this McClellan's been a good coach for years.

McClellan was tired. His message wasn't getting through. Hitchcock is fresh and always speaks positively of his players yet.... or he seems to be focusing on their strengths rather than Todd who was focusing on what they werent doing. ie. Lucic scoring

 

[RegDunlop]

Agree with a lot of your posts but thought process easily gets "infected". Another human condition.

One of the easiest multivariate analyses that could be done on Oilers threads is a word search on the number of times Drai is mentioned negatively in GDT's in relation to other players. Just do plot bar graphs, time graphs, whatever one wants. its very clear, crystal, which player would peak. Drai is, for whatever reason, a polarizing figure. He gets a lot of negative attention. Another player, Talbot, wasn't even playing and it wouldn't surprise me if he was mentioned 100 times. typically he is. Even when not playing.

Its important to note though that Drai gets so much focus because its a relation on how much he is a chief part of this team. On how much the team results are moved by his play.

On this team there is McD, then there is Drai, and if those aren't going not much good is happening. So that Drai essentially is part of a 2-3 piston engine that has to be running all the time, never breakdown, never lose compression, because if it does the performance is wiped out.

The team goes as far as McDrai take it. Its that simple. With McDavid its obvious (and rightful) that he isn't going to be the subject of criticism. One would have to be entirely misdirected to focus criticism on McGod. So instead the criticism falls to mortals. to the significant others. On this team it falls on Drai. For years in Pittsburgh it would fall on Malkin. Even Messier would get undue criticism because it would be unreasonable to critique Gretzky. People want to be able to explain events by finding fault. A human tendency.

For your first part - you'd lose badly. Pretty sure Benning would be at double what Drai gets.
And thinking about that, of course it's not the same caliber, but why is it ok to s**t on Benning and criticize his play? Whether you are I like it, isn't he part of the team?

I also have a difference of opinion on Drai. I am a huge fan. Have been since prior to Oilers. But if he wasnt here, McDavid would lead this team to pretty much where they are, give or take. On the other hand if McD wasnt here, I doubt Draisaitl could carry this team anywhere.
I used to think so. And I still feel he may at one point, but not currently.

He's an incredible hockey player. Extremely important to this team and I'm very happy he's here.
..... But hes nowhere in the league of McDavid.