Kaner's 1100th point watch thread

[LDF]

Yeah, John Torchetti was on NHL network yesterday talking about how teams are starting to use trap defenses more like they did in the 90’s.

There is a ridiculous amount of parity in the league right now. I don’t like it, but it is what it is. The teams at the bottom have a similar probability of making the playoffs as they do of picking No. 1. So if things stay like this, much like the Dead Puck Era, goalies will be more important and separate good from great teams.

the owners mention this when trying to get a hard salary cap. teams in the nhl to be more parity for economic reasons. so teams can see the improvement via fans/season ticket holders.

 

[AmericanDream]

people also aren't looking at things like improvements in technology, training, conditioning, etc..these are all areas where certain athletes can remain in an elite class for longer periods of time. you add that to simple genetics and skill and a player like Kane who plays hockey as if it was a game of chess add up to him playing for at least 5-7 more seasons at a very high level of play. meaning 70 plus points per year level of play.

Kane doesn't need to hit 100 points in a season once over the next 8 seasons to eclipse Mikita. obviously we all can only speculate on how healthy a player can remain, and from what we have seen from Kane over the last 3-4 years is one who is not going into high traffic areas unless he has open ice and is not taking big hits along the boards frequently.

500 plus points sounds like a lot, but look at guys like Ovi and Sid...they aren't slowing down either and considering the amount of injuries Crosby has had, I have full belief Kane can hit 1,400 points when it is all said and done.

I like the fact that he finally is playing with some talent, that is only going to help him as many years he had to consistently generate his own offense...now he has guys like Strome and AA generating space for him on the ice and a player like Cat who he can now feed like the Cookie Monster with all those sick dishes for one-timers. plus add a hopeful top 5-7 pick in this coming draft and possibly his brother from a Russian mother in Panarin back - and yeah, he will pass Stosh!

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

This is a GREAT thread.

Martin St. Louis put up 774 points from age 30 to age 40(closest Kane comparable player?). I see absolutely no reason that Patrick Kane cannot match that production, or come close. St. Louis only has 147 more points than Kane, right now. He is currently 581 points behind Mikita. If he matches St. Louis' production from 30-40, he ends up with 1660 points.

My prediction? He will retire as the greatest American-born player of all time, the all-time leading scorer of the Blackhawks, and, quite possibly, top 10 EVER in points. Yeah, it's a bold prediction. So what. Convince me he can't do it. Better yet, convince HIM he can't do it. I bet you can't.

What's beautiful about Kane is, like St. Louis, his physical tools have almost nothing to do with his production. He's just that much smarter than everyone on the ice.

He will age like a fine wine.

This got me curious, so I did a bit of research. Post lockout there are 22 players who've put up 400+ pts in their 30+ seasons. 5 got 581+ pts and Marleau could get there as well. Not sure which side of the argument this supports, but found it interesting. I think Kane is clearly as talented as almost everyone on the list. The question is going to be health.

Player Season Finder | Hockey-Reference.com

 

[hawksrule]

He’s going to play into his late thirties for sure. He doesn’t hit, doesn’t get hit, works hard, and loves playing hockey. Unless something weird happens like with Hossa, he’ll pass Mikita.

 

[LDF]

people also aren't looking at things like improvements in technology, training, conditioning, etc..these are all areas where certain athletes can remain in an elite class for longer periods of time. you add that to simple genetics and skill and a player like Kane who plays hockey as if it was a game of chess add up to him playing for at least 5-7 more seasons at a very high level of play. meaning 70 plus points per year level of play.

Kane doesn't need to hit 100 points in a season once over the next 8 seasons to eclipse Mikita. obviously we all can only speculate on how healthy a player can remain, and from what we have seen from Kane over the last 3-4 years is one who is not going into high traffic areas unless he has open ice and is not taking big hits along the boards frequently.

500 plus points sounds like a lot, but look at guys like Ovi and Sid...they aren't slowing down either and considering the amount of injuries Crosby has had, I have full belief Kane can hit 1,400 points when it is all said and done.

I like the fact that he finally is playing with some talent, that is only going to help him as many years he had to consistently generate his own offense...now he has guys like Strome and AA generating space for him on the ice and a player like Cat who he can now feed like the Cookie Monster with all those sick dishes for one-timers. plus add a hopeful top 5-7 pick in this coming draft and possibly his brother from a Russian mother in Panarin back - and yeah, he will pass Stosh!

excellent post. you are making 2 different but great post. one is passing Stosh and the other if players like Kane can keep up his production.

i will ref the 2nd point. today's players, based on the hard salary cap has to show that that player is not a liability per his contract cost..... hence many posters opinions on Toews contract via his play.

those elder statesmen will need to show that they are still capable of producing at the older age to show that it is still economical feasible to continue to pay them

look at Seabs and Keith.

 

[crazyhawk]

people also aren't looking at things like improvements in technology, training, conditioning, etc..these are all areas where certain athletes can remain in an elite class for longer periods of time. you add that to simple genetics and skill and a player like Kane who plays hockey as if it was a game of chess add up to him playing for at least 5-7 more seasons at a very high level of play. meaning 70 plus points per year level of play.

Kane doesn't need to hit 100 points in a season once over the next 8 seasons to eclipse Mikita. obviously we all can only speculate on how healthy a player can remain, and from what we have seen from Kane over the last 3-4 years is one who is not going into high traffic areas unless he has open ice and is not taking big hits along the boards frequently.

500 plus points sounds like a lot, but look at guys like Ovi and Sid...they aren't slowing down either and considering the amount of injuries Crosby has had, I have full belief Kane can hit 1,400 points when it is all said and done.

I like the fact that he finally is playing with some talent, that is only going to help him as many years he had to consistently generate his own offense...now he has guys like Strome and AA generating space for him on the ice and a player like Cat who he can now feed like the Cookie Monster with all those sick dishes for one-timers. plus add a hopeful top 5-7 pick in this coming draft and possibly his brother from a Russian mother in Panarin back - and yeah, he will pass Stosh!

For sure AD .. all players have gotten better not only goalies what with training, conditioning and genetics etc. So the main reason scoring was higher in the 80's early 90's was the lack of defensive systems employed by teams with a lesser but still notable reason of goalies being bigger, with advanced larger equipment and athleticism/style.
And I agree .. Kane has a very good chance to pass ole Stan the Man! Truly a generational talent our Kaner!

 

[LDF]

For sure AD .. all players have gotten better not only goalies what with training, conditioning and genetics etc. So the main reason scoring was higher in the 80's early 90's was the lack of defensive systems employed by teams with a lesser but still notable reason of goalies being bigger, with advanced larger equipment and athleticism/style.
And I agree .. Kane has a very good chance to pass ole Stan the Man! Truly a generational talent our Kaner!

while i will not disagree with your premise, i will say the fault lies in the growth of the NHL as a whole. now the new tech plus other intangibles are helping the whole NHL/hockey success..

 

[LordKOTL]

excellent post. you are making 2 different but great post. one is passing Stosh and the other if players like Kane can keep up his production.

i will ref the 2nd point. today's players, based on the hard salary cap has to show that that player is not a liability per his contract cost..... hence many posters opinions on Toews contract via his play.

those elder statesmen will need to show that they are still capable of producing at the older age to show that it is still economical feasible to continue to pay them

look at Seabs and Keith.

The converse to that is that either Stan would have learned his lesson by 2023 or he'll be replaced by then. Plus there's a CBA change on the horizon.

Honestly I'm not worried about the Kane situation come 2023. He won't be resigned for 10.5M for 8 years when he's 35 years old.

And besides, Keith may not be playing at his salary point this year and last, but the amount of years he played well above it? I'll take that in a heartbeat. His deal even today is not that bad. Seabs is a fustercluck of Mongolian proportions, but Keiths? Nah.

 

[AmericanDream]

For sure AD .. all players have gotten better not only goalies what with training, conditioning and genetics etc. So the main reason scoring was higher in the 80's early 90's was the lack of defensive systems employed by teams with a lesser but still notable reason of goalies being bigger, with advanced larger equipment and athleticism/style.
And I agree .. Kane has a very good chance to pass ole Stan the Man! Truly a generational talent our Kaner!

absolutely, the 80's and much of the 90's was a shit show if you watch games from then lol... team systems were so lacking, players were just running and gunning, and goalies?? hahaha, they weren't even using certain techniques that are the basic simple norm nowadays. you still had elite goalies, but the gap between the top 5 goalies and the bottom 5 goalies was massive..we are just starting to widen the gap today which it needs to be. the average goalie was hitting a .910 save% 3-5 years ago, that would have led the league in much of the 90's lol..

Kane is playing at the right time now after years of low scoring and clutching and grabbing. he finally looks to be surrounded with some talent and players that will work well with him. it will always come down to health, but if he plays 7 more full seasons, he breaks Mikita's record by year 7, and I will stand by that.

 

[Rick C137]

This is a GREAT thread.

Martin St. Louis put up 774 points from age 30 to age 40(closest Kane comparable player?). I see absolutely no reason that Patrick Kane cannot match that production, or come close. St. Louis only has 147 more points than Kane, right now. He is currently 581 points behind Mikita. If he matches St. Louis' production from 30-40, he ends up with 1660 points.

My prediction? He will retire as the greatest American-born player of all time, the all-time leading scorer of the Blackhawks, and, quite possibly, top 10 EVER in points. Yeah, it's a bold prediction. So what. Convince me he can't do it. Better yet, convince HIM he can't do it. I bet you can't.

What's beautiful about Kane is, like St. Louis, his physical tools have almost nothing to do with his production. He's just that much smarter than everyone on the ice.

He will age like a fine wine.

I’ve always brought up MSL as a comparable for how I think Kane will age. Could very easily see Kane being a 60pt guy in his late 30s. His game is all about avoiding contact which is very good for longevity.

If Kane stays healthy, he’s got a very good chance imo.

 

[LDF]

I’ve always brought up MSL as a comparable for how I think Kane will age. Could very easily see Kane being a 60pt guy in his late 30s. His game is all about avoiding contact which is very good for longevity.

If Kane stays healthy, he’s got a very good chance imo.

i would say good genes.

 

[Malagahawks]

Kaner on a torrid 1.30 PPG pace this season. Imagine if he reaches that the next 2 seasons. 212 points closer. If he finishes with 46 more points this he is at 934 total plus hypothetically 212 more he will have 1146 going into the 21/22 season at age 33/34. Great stuff

 

[Ace Card Bedard]

Kaner would need to stay healthy for the next 6-7 years.
I'm going to say no.

 

[AmericanDream]

has anyone even realized Kane almost has as many goals this season compared to his entire 2017-18 season?? 27 goals vs 25 right now, in only 46 games...Kane could be a consistent 40-50 goal scorer if he actually shoots around 300 plus shots per year...he hasn't hit 300 shots in a season yet in his career - he is on pace to do just that this season.

he also has 888 points right now...lol - I am sure Foley and Edzo will be making stupid jokes in their Harry Caray voices tonight...

 

[HawksBeerFan]

people also aren't looking at things like improvements in technology, training, conditioning, etc..these are all areas where certain athletes can remain in an elite class for longer periods of time. you add that to simple genetics and skill and a player like Kane who plays hockey as if it was a game of chess add up to him playing for at least 5-7 more seasons at a very high level of play. meaning 70 plus points per year level of play.

Kane doesn't need to hit 100 points in a season once over the next 8 seasons to eclipse Mikita. obviously we all can only speculate on how healthy a player can remain, and from what we have seen from Kane over the last 3-4 years is one who is not going into high traffic areas unless he has open ice and is not taking big hits along the boards frequently.

500 plus points sounds like a lot, but look at guys like Ovi and Sid...they aren't slowing down either and considering the amount of injuries Crosby has had, I have full belief Kane can hit 1,400 points when it is all said and done.

I like the fact that he finally is playing with some talent, that is only going to help him as many years he had to consistently generate his own offense...now he has guys like Strome and AA generating space for him on the ice and a player like Cat who he can now feed like the Cookie Monster with all those sick dishes for one-timers. plus add a hopeful top 5-7 pick in this coming draft and possibly his brother from a Russian mother in Panarin back - and yeah, he will pass Stosh!

While I have no proof, I'm also fairly confident a ton of professional athletes use steroids. I'm obviously not pointing the finger at Kane directly, or anything like that. However, I wouldn't be shocked if a significant portion of the league is extending their playing career using steroids.

 

[ChiHawks10]

Kaner would need to stay healthy for the next 6-7 years.
I'm going to say no.

What has happened in his career to say he won't stay healthy for the next 6-7 years? He's had one injury in the course of his entire career, and it was a freak thing. He literally plays a style of game that keeps him healthy.

 

[Ace Card Bedard]

What has happened in his career to say he won't stay healthy for the next 6-7 years?

I think it's more a matter of age.
As you get older you're more susceptible to injury.

 

[piteus]

That little dude amazes me all the time. At one point, I thought he would party himself out of the League. Now he's matured and focused. With the new rules, Kane is the type who could play for another 10 years at a reasonably high rate.

 

[piteus]

I think it's more a matter of age.
As you get older you're more susceptible to injury.

Kane doesn't really strain himself. He's always under control. He doesn't leave himself vulnerable. He's not a fan of the corners . Speed really isn't his game although he can play fast. My biggest concern is that he gets slashed by a clumsy oaf ... or gets boarded by a goon. That said, he really stays clear of the boards. The slashing injury to the hands is just sheer dumb luck.

 

[Blackhawks]

it doesnt really matter as Kane is clearly the much more superior player, the NHL in Mikita's time was slow and boring. AHL players of now would dominate the NHL of then.

 

[Crow]

I truly believe has gotten stronger physically in the last year. He is noticeably harder to get off the puck now, more than ever.

 

[AmericanDream]

While I have no proof, I'm also fairly confident a ton of professional athletes use steroids. I'm obviously not pointing the finger at Kane directly, or anything like that. However, I wouldn't be shocked if a significant portion of the league is extending their playing career using steroids.

well, they do multiple random drug tests, so not sure how they would be getting by on this unless you are suggesting there is a fix and star players simply aren't getting punished for it?

 

[AmericanDream]

it doesnt really matter as Kane is clearly the much more superior player, the NHL in Mikita's time was slow and boring. AHL players of now would dominate the NHL of then.

 

[Blackhawks]

Is that you in the pic?

 

[AmericanDream]

Is that you in the pic?

yes, when I was 32...