Player Discussion Josh Norris (C) 6’-1” - Part 3

[Micklebot]

Goaltending is definitely the biggest issue. Getting a sub 1.2M guy and sending the worst of the 3 to Belleville might be an option.

Brannstrom makes too much, he needs to go.

There are a lot of guys that can play 3LD for 1M on a 1 year deal.

We need to improve PK and GA. If we figure that out we are a playoff team.

Just replace the goaltending and you fix GA and PK since the biggest reason the PK still sucks is the goalteding,

Forsberg and Korpisalo rank 2nd, and 4th worsts respectively in xG saved above average /60 at 4v5 among goalies with 22 games or more.

Since Martin took over, we're 3rd in PK HDCA/60 and 5th in xGA/60.

 

[GCK]

Just replace the goaltending and you fix GA and PK since the biggest reason the PK still sucks is the goalteding,

Forsberg and Korpisalo rank 2nd, and 4th worsts respectively in xG saved above average /60 at 4v5 among goalies with 22 games or more.

Since Martin took over, we're 3rd in PK HDCA/60 and 5th in xGA/60.

Can’t argue. I want to give Sogaard and Merilainen another year so go get me a guy like Lyon

 

[JD1]

Your answer is : only Chabot? It's been proven countless times that this team is worse without Chabot though

It's been proven I'd say the past two seasons that we as a fan base had expectations that Chabot isn't leading us to.

As I have said many times before, Chabot is a finesse/skilled player with such smooth skating that it "looks" like he doesn't give an effort on TV but is a workhorse in reality.

Reality. Here's reality. I attend Sens games live and in person all the time. You live in Montreal. He doesn't look any better in person than he does on TV.

 

[Xspyrit]

Goaltending is definitely the biggest issue. Getting a sub 1.2M guy and sending the worst of the 3 to Belleville might be an option.

Brannstrom makes too much, he needs to go.

IIRC I wanted Dorion to sign one of Alex Lyon (0.9 AAV), Anthony Stolarz (1.1 AAV) or Laurent Brossoit (1.75 AAV) last summer (more on another site though) and damn, all 3 have good seasons

Yeah, in the Korpi5alo signing thread, I said "I would have doubled Alex Lyon or Anthony Stolarz AAVs."

Not sure how they'll fix this but they'll have to be creative.

Brannstrom doesn't make too much. Kubalik makes 2.5 too much aka he shouldn't even be here. Hamonic and Korpisalo same thing. The 5 M$ Dorion dead cap too. Norris makes too much but not entirely in his control due to injuries, a bit the same thing for Forsberg

There are a lot of guys that can play 3LD for 1M on a 1 year deal.

ok, you could say the same thing for Hamonic on RD. Does that mean he gives you quality play?

We need to improve PK and GA. If we figure that out we are a playoff team.

PK has been VASTLY improved under JM. It's the PP that continues to be far from efficient enough. GA is goaltending and team defense. TD has improved, goaltending has gotten worse. Coaching staff needs to be top notch and roster changes have to be smartly effective. It's not just about name recognition like Dorion used to do.

 

[Xspyrit]

It's been proven I'd say the past two seasons that we as a fan base had expectations that Chabot isn't leading us to.

There has been way too many problems for Chabot to lead us anywhere. You could say the same thing about Giroux, Stutzle, Sanderson and Tkachuk. Are they also overrated/overpaid? It's a team game.

We have just started to fix in the last few months what was blatantly obvious to many of us. It needs some time.

Reality. Here's reality. I attend Sens games live and in person all the time. You live in Montreal. He doesn't look any better in person than he does on TV.

Your opinion. He looks pretty damn good on TV and in person. Many teams would salivate if we would make him available because they don't all have the kind of GM and coaching staff we had and would use AND surround Chabot the right way, starting with a player that would complement him correctly.

Building a hockey team is like making a sophisticated recipe, it's not throwing ingredients you recognize randomly in the cooking pot. If you don't understand that, there's nothing more to say, we just don't see the sport the same way.


And for the 3rd or 4th time already, you dodged the question again

Or am I confused? Because you seemed that I wasn't making any changes with my 10 guys list to keep but you are suggesting to ONLY change Chabot and keep Chychrun? Very confusing

 

[Cosmix]

IIRC I wanted Dorion to sign one of Alex Lyon (0.9 AAV), Anthony Stolarz (1.1 AAV) or Laurent Brossoit (1.75 AAV) last summer (more on another site though) and damn, all 3 have good seasons

Yeah, in the Korpi5alo signing thread, I said "I would have doubled Alex Lyon or Anthony Stolarz AAVs."

Not sure how they'll fix this but they'll have to be creative.

Brannstrom doesn't make too much. Kubalik makes 2.5 too much aka he shouldn't even be here. Hamonic and Korpisalo same thing. The 5 M$ Dorion dead cap too. Norris makes too much but not entirely in his control due to injuries, a bit the same thing for Forsberg



ok, you could say the same thing for Hamonic on RD. Does that mean he gives you quality play?



PK has been VASTLY improved under JM. It's the PP that continues to be far from efficient enough. GA is goaltending and team defense. TD has improved, goaltending has gotten worse. Coaching staff needs to be top notch and roster changes have to be smartly effective. It's not just about name recognition like Dorion used to do.

I am ecstatic that Dorion and Smith are gone; I am not sure what my mood will be at the start of next season as our POHO/GM is inexperienced at the NHL level and coaching is in a state of change. I hope Staios proves to be an excellent POHO/GM but only time will tell that story (similar to our Dorion experience).

 

[atmx093]

I am ecstatic that Dorion and Smith are gone; I am not sure what my mood will be at the start of next season as our POHO/GM is inexperienced at the NHL level and coaching is in a state of change. I hope Staios proves to be an excellent POHO/GM but only time will tell that story (similar to our Dorion experience).

We'll see, but on the plus side it'll be difficult to do any worst than the prior owner.
Their first real test will be finding a coach that can help fix this team.

 

[HSF]

what a mess this has become

The sens shouldn't make the same mistake with Pinto unless his salary isn't high. Giving non-star players term and money is just asking for it

 

[Cosmix]

We'll see, but on the plus side it'll be difficult to do any worst than the prior owner.
Their first real test will be finding a coach that can help fix this team.

The first real test was hiring a POHO, and the second was hiring a GM. The requirements IMO were past experience as a GM, successful past experience as a GM, past experience as an AGM, etc.

We did not get that. What we got was an experienced GM of a junior team who was a personal friend of the owner.

 

[JD1]

There has been way too many problems for Chabot to lead us anywhere. You could say the same thing about Giroux, Stutzle, Sanderson and Tkachuk. Are they also overrated/overpaid? It's a team game.

We have just started to fix in the last few months what was blatantly obvious to many of us. It needs some time.



Your opinion. He looks pretty damn good on TV and in person. Many teams would salivate if we would make him available because they don't all have the kind of GM and coaching staff we had and would use AND surround Chabot the right way, starting with a player that would complement him correctly.

Building a hockey team is like making a sophisticated recipe, it's not throwing ingredients you recognize randomly in the cooking pot. If you don't understand that, there's nothing more to say, we just don't see the sport the same way.


And for the 3rd or 4th time already, you dodged the question again

Or am I confused? Because you seemed that I wasn't making any changes with my 10 guys list to keep but you are suggesting to ONLY change Chabot and keep Chychrun? Very confusing

You're confused

If the coach says there's an issue with compete level, you can't have a guy with compete issues as part of the leadership group. I'd move Chabot. 100% . If you don't like Chychrun, fine, move him too.

The rest of them are all salvageable. Younger. Compete harder.

Maybe a larger gutting is necessary. But I'd start with that and see how it works

 

[dumbdick]

Can someone explain the tape like stuff that Josh is wearing on his chest/shoulders? Is it for recovery or does it help prevent him from reinjuring himself?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Can someone explain the tape like stuff that Josh is wearing on his chest/shoulders? Is it for recovery or does it help prevent him from reinjuring himself?

Kinesiology tape .. lots of videos on it. KT tape or Rock Tape

 

[Relapsing]

The first real test was hiring a POHO, and the second was hiring a GM. The requirements IMO were past experience as a GM, successful past experience as a GM, past experience as an AGM, etc.

We did not get that. What we got was an experienced GM of a junior team who was a personal friend of the owner.

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but to be fair to SS, he has a bit more history and experience in a FO capacity than that.

Alas, we are where we are. Staios as a hire was called by a number of insiders so I guess it's not surprising, how it all turned out.

He's not what I wanted either - I would much rather we have a GM with a proven track record. Much like the players on our team, I think we may suffer for not having a lineage of NHL experience within the FO, but at least Poulin is there to provide some measure of it.

I am ultimately tired of this team being a proving ground for first timers.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but to be fair to SS, he has a bit more history and experience in a FO capacity than that.

Alas, we are where we are. Staios as a hire was called by a number of insiders so I guess it's not surprising, how it all turned out.

He's not what I wanted either - I would much rather we have a GM with a proven track record. Much like the players on our team, I think we may suffer for not having a lineage of NHL experience within the FO, but at least Poulin is there to provide some measure of it.

I am ultimately tired of this team being a proving ground for first timers.

At least Randy Lee wasn't a candidate this time

 

[Good in Osgoode]

Has there been any updates on the injury?

It's been nearly a week since the Preds game and all we know is that he is "going to be out for awhile"

I guess Norris will finish the season the same he started the season, clouded in mystery and hearsay.

 

[Adrianopolous]

Has there been any updates on the injury?

It's been nearly a week since the Preds game and all we know is that he is "going to be out for awhile"

I guess Norris will finish the season the same he started the season, clouded in mystery and hearsay.

And disappointment

 

[KnockHobbler]

josh Norris doesn’t exist

 

[Xspyrit]

You're confused

If the coach says there's an issue with compete level, you can't have a guy with compete issues as part of the leadership group. I'd move Chabot. 100% . If you don't like Chychrun, fine, move him too.

The rest of them are all salvageable. Younger. Compete harder.

Maybe a larger gutting is necessary. But I'd start with that and see how it works

ok I thought at the beginning you meant that I was keeping too many guys with my list of 10 players as I was talking about a "significant retool". And you said :

"The guys you listed would all be considered core or maybe inner core + outer core.

There's also 10 guys listed. The other roster positions would be largely filler.

Today on the drive they were talking to Jacques. He referenced compete level and structure as the things needing improvement"

So that's why I thought this

 

[JD1]

ok I thought at the beginning you meant that I was keeping too many guys with my list of 10 players as I was talking about a "significant retool". And you said :

"The guys you listed would all be considered core or maybe inner core + outer core.

There's also 10 guys listed. The other roster positions would be largely filler.

Today on the drive they were talking to Jacques. He referenced compete level and structure as the things needing improvement"

So that's why I thought this

I think you are keeping too many guys.

You listed 10. The 10 most significant. Add Chychrun.

Now, when the coach says there's a compete problem, I doubt he's talking only about the bottom. So the question is how many on your list does he feel have compete issues?

I'd start with Chabot. And when I said I think the rest are salvageable, well I think that meaning is pretty clear.

I answered your question when you asked it and with "salvageable" I even touched on an explanation why I answered it that way. My guess is you didn't understand because you didn't try to understand. You should try to understand rather than throw around a bunch of laughing emojis.

 

[Big Muddy]

Has there been any updates on the injury?

It's been nearly a week since the Preds game and all we know is that he is "going to be out for awhile"

I guess Norris will finish the season the same he started the season, clouded in mystery and hearsay.

I've wondered about the same thing.

All I've heard is that he will miss some time and was scheduled for a MRI.

I wonder if anyone has heard more?

 

[Big Muddy]

The Norris buyout was a fun exercise to see what it would look like, but it's not realistic at all. He wasn't performing bad enough that they would have considered it before the injury, and now he's injured again long term almost certainly with that same shoulder, so he can't be bought out. It had to happen this summer and he's injured, so not an option. They're gonna have to take their lumps on this one and just move forward without him in their plans. If he ever does come back and can actually stick, deal with it then, but I'd like to see management operate as if Stutzle-Pinto-Greig are their top 3 C's long term.

Here's a glass half full take.

The Senators pull a Kucherov maneuver and put Norris on LTIR for the entire regular season. We use the money that is freed up to sign another good player. Then we make the playoffs and Norris slides into the lineup.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Here's a glass half full take.

The Senators pull a Kucherov maneuver and put Norris on LTIR for the entire regular season. We use the money that is freed up to sign another good player. Then we make the playoffs and Norris slides into the lineup.

Well, that is definitely a glass half full take. Seeing how much Norris struggled this year after being out a full year, I'm not overly optimistic about his play after yet another extended absence. Nor could he ever reasonably be put on the same pedestal as Kucherov, so I'm gonna have to file this one away as not likely.

This is where I just wish the contract could go poof and just disappear. Would make their path easier to navigate than the unknowns he brings.

 

[PlayOn]

I've wondered about the same thing.

All I've heard is that he will miss some time and was scheduled for a MRI.

I wonder if anyone has heard more?

On yesterday’s coming in hot episode Wallace asked Bobby if he knew anything cause he tweeted something about Norris being back for training camp and Bobby said something like “no I don’t, I just know it’s not… he’ll be ready”. No idea what it means but he seemed to know something, so hopefully that means it’s not serious if he’s expecting to be back to start the season.

 

[Big Muddy]

Well, that is definitely a glass half full take. Seeing how much Norris struggled this year after being out a full year, I'm not overly optimistic about his play after yet another extended absence. Nor could he ever reasonably be put on the same pedestal as Kucherov, so I'm gonna have to file this one away as not likely.

This is where I just wish the contract could go poof and just disappear. Would make their path easier to navigate than the unknowns he brings.

I only mentioned Kucherov to illustrate the maneuver that Tampa made. I agree that Norris is not equivalent to Kucherov.

What the future is for Norris is certainly uncertain, and my post was clearly very optimistic. I'm not even going to try to predict. I'll just wait to see what unfolds. It sure sucks for Norris & the team though.

On yesterday’s coming in hot episode Wallace asked Bobby if he knew anything cause he tweeted something about Norris being back for training camp and Bobby said something like “no I don’t, I just know it’s not… he’ll be ready”. No idea what it means but he seemed to know something, so hopefully that means it’s not serious if he’s expecting to be back to start the season.

Hmmm ..... interesting. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

On yesterday’s coming in hot episode Wallace asked Bobby if he knew anything cause he tweeted something about Norris being back for training camp and Bobby said something like “no I don’t, I just know it’s not… he’ll be ready”. No idea what it means but he seemed to know something, so hopefully that means it’s not serious if he’s expecting to be back to start the season.

Hmm. Mysterious