John Tavares has taken that next step.

[socko]

He skates like Andreychuk. I like to spend money on guys that can skate.

 

[Mats13]

He’s been good defensively, but to call this his best hockey ever is just false.

He’s a former Hart candidate. This isn’t his best

 

[moon111]

You're essentially taking (+/-) of Tavares.

+/- is a useless stat.

There are 6 players on the ice at a time. A goal being scored while a player on the ice, isn't necessarily reflective upon that player's skill/effort.

There are 5 other players on the ice who may have been responsible for a goal-against/goal-for.

Have you taken statistics? Roll a pair of dice, how often do they add up to seven? In the beginning the totals can be all across the board but
keep on going and statistically the seven becomes the most common total. Tavares's plus/minus figures aren't a small example. They're
a career-long trend, with multiple line-mates and teammates.

We had fans rip apart Connor Brown when the Leafs lost in the playoffs for not scoring much while he was on for zero goals against even-strength.
That's a positive playoff contribution.
In 12 playoff games, Tavares has been on for 5 power-play goals for, 8 even-strength, and 16 goals against. If Tavares can maintain a ppg AND outscore the opposition,
think he too can be a positive contribution in the playoffs.

 

[Stephen]

Stamoks > Tavares. But it's close.

As a big Stamkos fan, Tavares isn’t that close.

That said I thought he had a pretty good game against the Canucks in the losing cause. Looked a helluva lot better than the dogs breakfast the first line gave us.

 

[ACC1224]

Great snipe tonight

 

[Kurtz]

He's elevated his defensive game, but you don't pay someone $11 mil per season to be Bobby Holik. He does need to provide more offensively.


Also, the Islanders were hot trash in his early years. Of course he was on the ice for more goals against than for.

But Holik got paid close to $11

 

[Incetardis]

Tavares is overpaid @ 11mil/per. No doubt about it but that's what it costs to get an upper echelon unrestricted FA on a long term deal. Those guys rarely become available. I don't blame them for doing it and I definitely don't blame him for signing.

Leafs management obviously saw a chance to add an elite level veteran to play along the ridiculously skilled group of young forwards still on ELCs. Unfortunately they didn't have much success during that window and now that all the kids have moved on to massive paydays they're stuck with a serious cap crunch and limited roster flexibility.

BUT you've got to admit that Dubas and co have done a superb job building around that salary bloated forward group as seen with the stellar play of the team thus far. JT doesn't cheat you for effort so even if he doesn't have the pace to truly take over a game like some of the other stud players up front, it's still valuable to have a guy of his status setting the compete bar so high for the rest of the team. He's a solid 2way player that doesn't need to be an elite skater to produce offensively so because of that I feel the contract will age well and he'll be a steady contributor throughout. All good there

 

[NoGoalCaufield]

Should of never signed him in the first place. Keeping Kadri as 2C and spending the remaining money on D would of been a better option. But in Dubas we trust.

 

[Leafs87]

He’s been pretty awful.
Not sure why people keep trying to defend him by painting a different picture. He started the year off well though

 

[Confucius]

He’s been pretty awful.
Not sure why people keep trying to defend him by painting a different picture. He started the year off well though

Look around the league. There will be ups and downs thrills and spills, the season is a rollercoaster ride

 

[Stephen]

Look around the league. There will be ups and downs thrills and spills, the season is a rollercoaster ride

No doubt. Even Marner and Matthews can look brutal on occasions. I suppose the lowered expectations on Tavares is he’s never going to give you $11 million in 5 on 5 shift to shift dominance in the traditional sense of a centerman making big plays. So it’s really about managing expectations and making sure he’s hitting those slightly lowered marks on a consistent basis. Play really well defensively, be a match up center and chip in a near PPG average.

 

[Confucius]

No doubt. Even Marner and Matthews can look brutal on occasions. I suppose the lowered expectations on Tavares is he’s never going to give you $11 million in 5 on 5 shift to shift dominance in the traditional sense of a centerman making big plays. So it’s really about managing expectations and making sure he’s hitting those slightly lowered marks on a consistent basis. Play really well defensively, be a match up center and chip in a near PPG average.

Couple of good things about JT, he wanted to be here and I'm sure he is doing the best he can. Not giving a crap certainly won't be an issue. Secondy he didn't cost us a 1st round pick or a couple of grade A prospects. He came for free, I know caphit isn't free but still.

Could you imagine the complaining if we lost a 1st round pick plus Robertson for him as well as the 11 million salary.

 

[saffronleaf]

If next step means going from superstar to declining veteran, then I agree.​

 

[Stephen]

Couple of good things about JT, he wanted to be here and I'm sure he is doing the best he can. Not giving a crap certainly won't be an issue. Secondy he didn't cost us a 1st round pick or a couple of grade A prospects. He came for free, I know caphit isn't free but still.

Could you imagine the complaining if we lost a 1st round pick plus Robertson for him as well as the 11 million salary.

Well, I disagree a bit with the notion that he was "free." In a rapidly rising cap environment, 100% but in a stagnant or flat cap world cap space becomes its own asset. So you can kind of see the year to year impact of signing Tavares meant losing JVR, Bozak, Gardiner, Brown, Zaitsev and later Kapanen and Johnsson, in conjunction with having to get rid of Marleau, etc. It's the hidden costs.

I think the Tavares homecoming storyline is a nice narrative, but also feel like the organization may have given him a bit too much with the captaincy. That said, the job now is to surround him properly and make sure he's optimized to help us achieve the ultimate goal. And Dubas has done a good job with supplementing really cheap veteran UFAs and rejuvenating the system with the Kapanen trade.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Just read today Tavares has 170 pts in 171 games as a Leaf. No slow down,cycles really well, always a scoring threat. Never was a speedster should always be remembered. He has generated offense from the area behind the net since coming in to the league and still does. He needs speed and tenacity in his wingers. Thats what he works best with. Way to go JT

 

[Confucius]

Well, I disagree a bit with the notion that he was "free." In a rapidly rising cap environment, 100% but in a stagnant or flat cap world cap space becomes its own asset. So you can kind of see the year to year impact of signing Tavares meant losing JVR, Bozak, Gardiner, Brown, Zaitsev and later Kapanen and Johnsson, in conjunction with having to get rid of Marleau, etc. It's the hidden costs.

I think the Tavares homecoming storyline is a nice narrative, but also feel like the organization may have given him a bit too much with the captaincy. That said, the job now is to surround him properly and make sure he's optimized to help us achieve the ultimate goal. And Dubas has done a good job with supplementing really cheap veteran UFAs and rejuvenating the system with the Kapanen trade.

We can keep extrapolating, bottom line we are better now with JT than we were with the guys you mentioned.

 

[moon111]

If next step means going from superstar to declining veteran, then I agree.

The only way Tavares was a superstar was if you're looking at his performance in NY and applying the grass is always greener on the other side.
Pretty sure the Isles never cared what he really did defensively. Even players who can be defensive like Bozak at times had to throw caution to
provide offense because there wasn't anyone else to call on. Think things are now different for Tavares and the team he's playing for. Unless they're
losing with time running out, there's less need to gamble. If this team can keep cutting the opposition down rather then trying to prop their own
individual stats up, the playoffs can be a much different story. If you can get Tavares out against Boston's top line and neutralize all scoring, you
can trust the Leafs will win with the other three lines. That hasn't happened. Teams look at Tavares and have smelled the opportunity to win....
and they have in the past.

 

[BigBlu]

What did Marcel Dionne ever do to you??

And sorry, but remind me how many Cups JT has hoisted?

 

[moon111]

What did Marcel Dionne ever do to you??

And sorry, but remind me how many Cups JT has hoisted?

Dionne just tops the list of a player who in my mind was quite the scorer who was never going to win with his own and teammates defensive abilities.
The French Connection line was pretty fantastic offensively as well. These types of players end up running into someone like Bob Gainey who shuts
them down while the rest of their team ends up losing as well. As for him not hoisting a Cup, there was a time there was a LOT of flack hitting a few
Toronto players about their defensive abilities and I saw Tavares not getting mentioned. Over and over again, Tavares was getting outscored upon
while on the ice. Nifty his line scored two points... the opposition was getting three. Don't think the improved defense is just from roster moves alone.
Tavares seems to be more focused on a two-way game IMHO. Personally think he almost looks inexperienced doing it, but it's working.
When the Leafs hit the playoffs, they have to be ready to win games they don't score a lot in. For the team to succeed, Tavares has to continue improving
his defensive side.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Islanders vs. Leafs since Keefe became coach:

Toronto:
Record: 45-20-7 (.676) (5th in the NHL)
Team Defense(xGA/60): (8th in the NHL)

Islanders:
Record: 33-26-13 (.549) (18h in the NHL)
Team Defense(xGA/60): (10th in the NHL)

I don't know why you pick that particular event (the coaching change), beyond the fact that it coincides nicely with some Islander injuries that resulted in a slump.

Why not use stats from when he was acquired:

Toronto:
Record: 100-59-19 (.615) (7th in the NHL)
Team Defense (GA/60): (17th in the NHL)

Islanders:
Record: 98-56-21 (.620) (5th in the NHL)
Team Defense (GA/60): (3rd in the NHL)

Why not use stats from just this year:

Toronto:
Record: 18-6-2 (.731) (3rd in the NHL)
Team Defense (GA/60): (5th in the NHL)

Islanders:
Record: 15-6-4 (.680) (6th in the NHL)
Team Defense (GA/60): (3rd in the NHL)

Why not use stats from the playoffs since he was acquired, as they are the most important games:

Toronto:
Record: 5-7 (.417) (16th in the NHL)
Team Defense (GA/60): (13th in the NHL)

Islanders:
Record: 17-13 (.567) (5th in the NHL)
Team Defense (GA/60): (2nd in the NHL)

Come to think of it, I do know why.

 

[notDatsyuk]

I don't have anything against Tavares, beyond the contract, which isn't his fault.

He is very good on faceoffs, and at putting the puck in the net, particularly when he is open in the slot, and more particularly, on the PP.

On the other hand, he is a below average skater, and a terrible passer. On Saturday, I counted three "what the *beep*" passes DURING ONE POWERPLAY!

When he has the puck in front of the opposing net, he usually makes good decisions (shoot). Other than that, not so much.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

At some point JT moves to wing and Willy takes over as centre ... it happens when JT slows down a little more maybe 1-2 years out ... and he still will score 30 because his hand eye is still incredible

 

[Stephen]

The lone ranger rush he made vs Winnipeg where he dished off to set Nylander up was unreal. Need to find a way to bring out that version of him on a regular basis.

 

[Faltorvo]

Well, I disagree a bit with the notion that he was "free." In a rapidly rising cap environment, 100% but in a stagnant or flat cap world cap space becomes its own asset. So you can kind of see the year to year impact of signing Tavares meant losing JVR, Bozak, Gardiner, Brown, Zaitsev and later Kapanen and Johnsson, in conjunction with having to get rid of Marleau, etc. It's the hidden costs.

I think the Tavares homecoming storyline is a nice narrative, but also feel like the organization may have given him a bit too much with the captaincy. That said, the job now is to surround him properly and make sure he's optimized to help us achieve the ultimate goal. And Dubas has done a good job with supplementing really cheap veteran UFAs and rejuvenating the system with the Kapanen trade.

[Mod]

1 guy did not cause that ,,for f***s sake jvr/bozak signed for 1 million more when combined

gimme JT + 1m player over boz/jvr in a HEART BEAT!!!

 

[Antropovsky]

The lone ranger rush he made vs Winnipeg where he dished off to set Nylander up was unreal. Need to find a way to bring out that version of him on a regular basis.

He's tries that stuff quite often or at least occasionally, but he typically gets stopped by one or all defenders. What's that phrase about a broken clock?

This is coming from a Tavares fan.