Player Discussion Jesperi Kotkaniemi (Part 12)

[salbutera]

Generally speaking, I'm against sending him down to the AHL. The team needs his production from last year and if he's not able to at least perform a role he had last season, then that's a major setback in his development. But if he continues to be a liability out there and if he can't develop chemistry with his line mates, there may be no other option than to send him down.

And the last thing KK / the org needs is to go to Laval and have some bruiser from the opposing team hammer KK from behind because said player trying to get called up to the NHL & make a name for himself.

 

[Mrb1p]

Again Drouin and KK were on the ice and hemmed in our zone for some of the most brutal shifts this year.

It's not unusual for young players to sit and/or have limited minutes.

You're not refuting anything. For some reason you think KK should be handed the golden keys and play unlimited minutes and with choice linemates.

His play dictates where and how many minutes he plays. He's 19 years old. He's doing just fine. There will be bumps in the road.

Nobody is "ruining" KK.

Every line has been hemmed in their zone. The fact is KK/Drouin/Armia did bend a few times, like every line with a guy that is bad defensively and a rookie should, but they got scored on the least of all the three lines up until they were broken up... For some reason you want Kotkaniemi, a third overall pick, not an average 19 years old, get this out of your head right about now, to have the toughest road to success.

 

[habsfan891]

Suggesting that Kotka is somehow in the process of being "ruined" right now is a dumb view point. (since we're calling others opinions dumb)

Whatever you think theres evidence to back up that viewpoint.

 

[azcanuck]

Every line has been hemmed in their zone. The fact is KK/Drouin/Armia did bend a few times, like every line with a guy that is bad defensively and a rookie should, but they got scored on the least of all the three lines up until they were broken up... For some reason you want Kotkaniemi, a third overall pick, not an average 19 years old, get this out of your head right about now, to have the toughest road to success.

It's not that I want him to have "the toughest road to success" (whatever that means) it's just that it is a tough road to success in this league.

Development is not linear for these guys. He's learning on the fly as a 18-19 year old kid. I think he's doing phenomenally.

Have some patience. Quit going to the "he's being ruined" card so quick. He's not.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Whatever you think theres evidence to back up that viewpoint.

Why don't you provide me some evidence of players that have been ruined by poor development. You cant, its impossible. So what we are discussing here are two opposing theories.

 

[417]

Every line has been hemmed in their zone. The fact is KK/Drouin/Armia did bend a few times, like every line with a guy that is bad defensively and a rookie should, but they got scored on the least of all the three lines up until they were broken up... For some reason you want Kotkaniemi, a third overall pick, not an average 19 years old, get this out of your head right about now, to have the toughest road to success.

Always blows me away that we have the highest expectations of flawless play for our youngest players.

Not only does Kotkaniemi have to produce within a limited role, but he's got to be flawless on the ice.

If not, then he should be sent to Laval smdh

 

[Mrb1p]

It's not that I want him to have "the toughest road to success" (whatever that means) it's just that it is a tough road to success in this league.

Development is not linear for these guys. He's learning on the fly as a 18-19 year old kid. I think he's doing phenomenally.

Have some patience. Quit going to the "he's being ruined" card so quick. He's not.

Yes, exactly, its a really tough road, so why make it tougher ? Why not make it easier ?

 

[417]

It's not that I want him to have "the toughest road to success" (whatever that means) it's just that it is a tough road to success in this league.

Development is not linear for these guys. He's learning on the fly as a 18-19 year old kid. I think he's doing phenomenally.

Have some patience. Quit going to the "he's being ruined" card so quick. He's not.

Precisely...and that's why it's silly, IMO, to talk about sending him to Laval.

 

[Mrb1p]

Always blows me away that we have the highest expectations of flawless play for our youngest players.

Not only does Kotkaniemi have to produce within a limited role, but he's got to be flawless on the ice.

If not, then he should be sent to Laval smdh

But vets can succ dick for days and it doesn't matter. Even on that famed shift that changed everything for KK, against TB, it was Weber that did two mistakes in a row and Armia that didn't clear, but somehow its all KK that got the blame. Its absolutely crazy how young players are treated.

 

[gillyguzzler]

He hasn't been sent down yet the destruction continues just getting more and more stupid at this point it's obvious Julien has no interest in using or developing him so send him down until Julien is gone when we don't make the playoffs this year it's just beyond common sense at this point.

There is an argument to be had that Julien hasn't helped his development this year but I'm now surprised that he has KK still in the lineup with the way things are going. KK and his line had a good first period yesterday but by the second, KK looked lost again, defensively and on the PP. How many times can he bobble or give away the puck on simple plays on the PP? It must burn Julien... but he puts him back out there. For sure that Poehling would look better right now between Lehkonen and Byron.

 

[calder candidate]

Habs don’t have 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th line minutes - other than Danault’s line TOI is distributed based on pretty much on performance in a given game. If KK was performing his TOI would be inching up just as Suzuki’s has (14.5 min last night).

They are built for 4-line scoring depth, and the only C job up for grabs (re:upgrade from within) is potentially NTs.

Regardless of # (I’m aware that we basically roll 4 lines, it more like we have 2 2nd line and 2 4th line) someone still get more ice time than others. Thompson is playing great he win face off and without being flashy he generate offense and solid in his zone, if KK or Poehling can’t out perform Thompson then there no reason for them to be in the line up, that exactly why we have guy like Thompson, Weal, Byron, Cousin to plug the holes in the bottom 6 that prospect that are counted on to be future to 6 aren’t able to fill while they keep progressing.
Suzuki is performing and improving so there no issue with him seeing 14min a night in the NHL. But KK has been treading water since last year he is not performing well and only Cousins has less ATOI than KK he had less than 12

Regardless of if it him not performing or other outperforming him... Why keep in around to be on the bench send him to the AHL let him get ice time, have a impact and gain confidence, call him back up once he able to have a impact. Right now he doesn’t bring anything since he doesn’t generate offense, doesn’t win face off, doesn’t have a physical presence or great defensive. He has the potential to be the best player we need to make sure that he maximize is potential.

 

[blarneylad]

Always blows me away that we have the highest expectations of flawless play for our youngest players.

Not only does Kotkaniemi have to produce within a limited role, but he's got to be flawless on the ice.

If not, then he should be sent to Laval smdh

I don't think he 'should' be sent to Laval, in that he can't play in the NHL. But rather that he would benefit more playing in the AHL right now.

 

[Habs Icing]

This just isn't true. The teans future will be greatly enhanced if KK becomes a number 1. That's stating the obvious, but the teams future success is not 100% dependant on him.becoming a number. Personally I think he's going to be fine, but I also don't see a 1c with Kk. I think k he's likely a 2C.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Garbageyuk]

Galchenyuk 2.0 without the hands or shot.

 

[Archijerej]

Galchenyuk 2.0 without the hands or shot.

Galchenyuk's legendary "hands" was a collection of low-percentage junior moves that fooled a defenceman once in a while, but were counterproductive most of the time. Kotkaniemi's much more efficient with his stickhandling.

 

[Mrb1p]

Galchenyuk 2.0 without the hands or shot.

Damn that was quick.

When are we going to get Kotkaniecrap?

 

[azcanuck]

Galchenyuk's legendary "hands" was a collection of low-percentage junior moves that fooled a defenceman once in a while, but were counterproductive most of the time. Kotkaniemi's much more efficient with his stickhandling.

Plus the brains. KK has a high hockey I.Q. Alex was very low.

KK right now has a gangly teenage body that he will grow into. Then we will see his true potential.

 

[Garbageyuk]

Galchenyuk's legendary "hands" was a collection of low-percentage junior moves that fooled a defenceman once in a while, but were counterproductive most of the time. Kotkaniemi's much more efficient with his stickhandling.

I never said Galchenyuk's hands were that great, maybe a little above average. He sure seemed to think they were something though. Still, they were one of his standout attributes, regardless of how good they actually were.

 

[Garbageyuk]

Damn that was quick.

When are we going to get Kotkaniecrap?

Krapkaniemi you mean? He'll have to earn that one.

 

[417]

I don't think he 'should' be sent to Laval, in that he can't play in the NHL. But rather that he would benefit more playing in the AHL right now.

I think the benefits of playing in the AHL are overstated - but given he's already established as an NHL'er at this point, I think going down to Laval is taking a significant step back for Kotkaniemi.

He's not hurting the team, I really see no reason why he should be sent down.

Last night he got some shifts with Gallagher and Tatar...they switched him up with Danault a few times.

I think if they can continue to do that...great.

 

[azcanuck]

Hes an NHL player. He proved that last year.

The only reason to send him down is because he's having trouble continuing to be an NHL player, like you said. 13mins a night against the best competition in the world trumps 18 minutes a night in the AHL with inferior teammates playing against inferior competition.

I do believe that right now too. I'd keep him here. The game here doesnt overwhelm him. He just needs to grow into his body and he'll be more effective.

 

[ECWHSWI]

Again Drouin and KK were on the ice and hemmed in our zone for some of the most brutal shifts this year.

It's not unusual for young players to sit and/or have limited minutes.

You're not refuting anything. For some reason you think KK should be handed the golden keys and play unlimited minutes and with choice linemates.

His play dictates where and how many minutes he plays. He's 19 years old. He's doing just fine. There will be bumps in the road.

Nobody is "ruining" KK.

the only reason you're saying this is because of that one (almost) 2 minutes at the end of a period that ended up costing a goal...

and if you're talking about KK that ways is because our amazing coach lack cohones to call out his vets Price and Weber who did stupid moves to give the puck to the opponents, back to back stupid plays by the vets and not a word about them from the coach, later on the play KK made a mistake and sharpshooter Julien did not hesitate BAM BAM BAM! KK make a bad play he said in front of the cam!

 

[Kojo]

What's wrong with him and why aren't they sending him down to the AHL.

 

[Archijerej]

Plus the brains. KK has a high hockey I.Q. Alex was very low.

Yes. That's why Kotkaniemi's stickhandling actually has a purpose. Galchenyuk would stickhandle just for the sake of it. You almost had the impression all of his gliding was on purpose, so that he could stickhandle and try a couple of those ridiculous head fakes.

 

[417]

What's wrong with him and why aren't they sending him down to the AHL.

why do you think he should be sent down to Laval?