Jaromir Jagr vs. Alexander Ovechkin

[wetcoast]

If you rewatch Kuzy's exploits in those playoffs, it's often because two defenders were focused on Ovechkin.

In this one Ovie is standing at the blue line. Two Pens are skating towards Ovie, coming within 10 feet of him, trying to prevent the breakout pass from going to Ovie. This gives Kuznetsov a wide open zone entry.

Funny that the forward was looking at the puck carrier and the Pens were guilty of a poor line change but sure use one clip to make a sweeping judgment that its par for the course.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

If you rewatch Kuzy's exploits in those playoffs, it's often because two defenders were focused on Ovechkin.

In this one Ovie is standing at the blue line. Two Pens are skating towards Ovie, coming within 10 feet of him, trying to prevent the breakout pass from going to Ovie. This gives Kuznetsov a wide open zone entry.

Yes ovechkin was doing what he does best standing around

 

[Midnight Judges]

He's only the greatest goal scorer to ever play the game. Why would any team give him extra attention?

 

[Midnight Judges]

Funny that the forward was looking at the puck carrier and the Pens were guilty of a poor line change but sure use one clip to make a sweeping judgment that its par for the course.

They weren't changing in the video I linked.

I mean, wow. This is basic stuff here man.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

If you rewatch Kuzy's exploits in those playoffs, it's often because two defenders were focused on Ovechkin.

In this one Ovie is standing at the blue line. Two Pens are skating towards Ovie, coming within 10 feet of him, trying to prevent the breakout pass from going to Ovie. This gives Kuznetsov a wide open zone entry.

Damn this is delusional. No one is afraid of OV in the NZ at this point, especially stationary. Letang just lost his mind on this play.

 

[Zbynek]

As a pure goal scorer Ovie, but for literally everything else, Jagr.

 

[Midnight Judges]

Damn this is delusional. No one is afraid of OV in the NZ at this point, especially stationary. Letang just lost his mind on this play.

Oh yeah that seems realistic. Your Norris finalist 12-year veteran skated across from his position to double cover the greatest goal scorer of all time purely on accident.

 

[Midnight Judges]

I get that you guys hate Ovie, and lying for Crosby is a widely endorsed practice, but the delusions are entirely yours. Here's Ovie in the neutral zone, eliminating your team:





And the Lightning:

 

[wetcoast]

Damn this is delusional. No one is afraid of OV in the NZ at this point, especially stationary. Letang just lost his mind on this play.

Pretty much this and like the audio says they got spread out on the "change" meaning line change.

 

[McVespa99]

Missing an option. Jagr will never be done playing

 

[Midnight Judges]

Pretty much this and like the audio says they got spread out on the "change" meaning line change.

Indeed, Mike Milbury said something false - spur of the moment. I don't know what your excuse it though, because it wasn't a line change.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

I always thought that he changed after Lindros tuned him. He was obviously a great player regardless but I wonder how he’d be remembered if he kept his physicality more, and also shot more like his early days .

The Lindros fight was definitely one reason. I think the other was self-preservation. Thornton, as a young power forward, was already struggling with injuries. He missed more games between 2001 and 2004 (ages 21 to 24) than he did between 2006 and 2017 (ages 26 to 37). And he was heavily criticized by Boston's media and fans in 2004 (he had broken ribs, but played in the playoffs anyway, and was held scoreless in seven games - he was damned if he played, and damned if he didn't).

I wonder if it was Thornton himself who decided to change, or if he was steered that way by his agent and/or coaches. Many of the top power forwards from that era had all kinds of injury problems, so in hindsight, Thornton's change was for the better. (Plus, of course, there was less emphasis on size/strength after the lockout). Still, he would have been an amazing player if he continued to play like he did in 2001 (but it's unlikely he would have come close to 1,700 games).

 

[wetcoast]

Indeed, Mike Milbury said something false - spur of the moment. I don't know what your excuse it though, because it wasn't a line change.

Well I didn't see what happened before what the clip shows but often when an opposition player is behind his own net, line changes are happening like what 95% of the time.

Your claim that Ovi was drawing the 2 defenders when he was standing still outside of the blue line is a stretch to say the least.

I get that you guys hate Ovie, and lying for Crosby is a widely endorsed practice, but the delusions are entirely yours. Here's Ovie in the neutral zone, eliminating your team:





And the Lightning:

Yet your original premise was that Ovi draw players to him which left others open, these 3 videos don't how that to be the case.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Ultimately Ovechkin goes down as the greater player when it's all said and done and that's what will be remembered.

Also if someone is trying to say Ovechkin isn't strong in the neutral zone at this point then they should be ignored, he's picked more pockets in the open ice clean than I've seen from a winger over the last few years and he's done it in the playoffs as well. He's a very solid positional player, still capable of breaking the zone and has a very active stick to accompany his physicality. Anything to the contrary is simply just ignoring the recent state of his game. Very underrated at this point.

 

[LightningStorm]

Voted Jagr now and forever, but wish there was an option for Jagr now and Ovechkin having a chance to pass him. Voted the first option cause I think it's most likely Jagr remains higher in my all time rankings.

When it comes to wingers, I have Jagr #2 and Ovechkin #4 all time.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Ultimately Ovechkin goes down as the greater player when it's all said and done and that's what will be remembered.

Also if someone is trying to say Ovechkin isn't strong in the neutral zone at this point then they should be ignored, he's picked more pockets in the open ice clean than I've seen from a winger over the last few years and he's done it in the playoffs as well. He's a very solid positional player, still capable of breaking the zone and has a very active stick to accompany his physicality. Anything to the contrary is simply just ignoring the recent state of his game. Very underrated at this point.

Time to turn off the Xbox.

 

[Kunta Kinte]

Jagr was a team leading scorer at 43 years old. (Panthers) Even went to the playoff with that team. (He sucked in those tho)

He was 8pts short the next year at 44...

Led his team in pts at 41 years old too (Devils)

Leading a NHL team in pts twice as a 40 years old +...

I ain't gonna talk about the rest.

AO is amazing at goalscoring but c'mon its not even close.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Jagr was a team leading scorer at 43 years old. (Panthers) Even went to the playoff with that team. (He sucked in those tho)

He was 8pts short the next year at 44...

Led his team in pts at 41 years old too (Devils)

Leading a NHL team in pts twice as a 40 years old +...

I ain't gonna talk about the rest.

AO is amazing at goalscoring but c'mon its not even close.

How is this a fair argument, when Ovi has yet to turn 40? So if Ovi leads the Caps in scoring at age 41 and gets 40 goals, what would you say then?

FWIW I voted Jagr.

 

[Faceboner]

Only way to truly tell would be getting a time machine and having them play on the same team for the sabres

 

[Video Nasty]

During Ovechkin's 3 season run where he was so close to sweeping every major individual award, I definitely thought it was the best I had seen someone play at the time (more than just a single season of otherwordly play) since Jagr.

Key word "since" Jagr. Ovechkin unfortunately couldn't put together a few more seasons remotely on that level to make this more interesting.

1994-1995 through 2000-2001 Jagr, even when factoring in Jagr's disinterest before Mario came back for the remainder of the 2000-2001 season is a consistently higher level than Ovechkin.

Jagr has arguably 7 different seasons that are better than Ovechkin's best.

Then you factor in his unusually good play later on.

Age 41 where he led the Devils in scoring and was 5 points out of the top 15 (finished 27th) on a team that scored only 197 goals and was 27th out of 30 teams in scoring.

Then age 43 where he led the Panthers in scoring and was 21st in the league. He finished just 5 points behind age 30 Ovechkin in the same number of games. Jagr also managed to finish 7th in Hart voting (6th among forwards).

Ovechkin is a mere 3 points above 1 PPG since the conclusion of his age 24 season, a span of 878 games. He spent the bulk of that time below 1 PPG. It took the highest scoring season since 1995-1996 for him to climb back above it at age 36. It's a little hard to imagine him scoring at a healthy clip, even with scoring going up.

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

During Ovechkin's 3 season run where he was so close to sweeping every major individual award, I definitely thought it was the best I had seen someone play at the time (more than just a single season of otherwordly play) since Jagr.

Key word "since" Jagr. Ovechkin unfortunately couldn't put together a few more seasons remotely on that level to make this more interesting.

1994-1995 through 2000-2001 Jagr, even when factoring in Jagr's disinterest before Mario came back for the remainder of the 2000-2001 season is a consistently higher level than Ovechkin.

Jagr has arguably 7 different seasons that are better than Ovechkin's best.

Then you factor in his unusually good play later on.

Age 41 where he led the Devils in scoring and was 5 points out of the top 15 (finished 27th) on a team that scored only 197 goals and was 27th out of 30 teams in scoring.

Then age 43 where he led the Panthers in scoring and was 21st in the league. He finished just 5 points behind age 30 Ovechkin in the same number of games. Jagr also managed to finish 7th in Hart voting (6th among forwards).

Ovechkin is a mere 3 points above 1 PPG since the conclusion of his age 24 season, a span of 878 games. He spent the bulk of that time below 1 PPG. It took the highest scoring season since 1995-1996 for him to climb back above it at age 36. It's a little hard to imagine him scoring at a healthy clip, even with scoring going up.

I hope this was a typo.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Jagr was a team leading scorer at 43 years old. (Panthers) Even went to the playoff with that team. (He sucked in those tho)

He was 8pts short the next year at 44...

Led his team in pts at 41 years old too (Devils)

Leading a NHL team in pts twice as a 40 years old +...

I ain't gonna talk about the rest.

AO is amazing at goalscoring but c'mon its not even close.

How is this a fair argument, when Ovi has yet to turn 40? So if Ovi leads the Caps in scoring at age 41 and gets 40 goals, what would you say then?

FWIW I voted Jagr.

 

[Ignatius]

 

[frisco]

Typical Ovechkin. His career Olympic highlight is hitting a 38 year-old legend in a tournament where his team finishes 6th.

My Best-Carey

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Typical Ovechkin. His career Olympic highlight is hitting a 38 year-old legend in a tournament where his team finishes 6th.

My Best-Carey

Don't forget the classic leaving his feet