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Buffalo Bills It's the Off-Season. Go.

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Jim Bob

Jim Bob

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truthbluth said:
I like this mock for the Bills. Keon Coleman and Kam Kinchens in the 4th would be a coup.
Click to expand...
33. Buffalo Bills (via mock trade w/ Panthers) - Ladd McConkey, WR, Georgia

60. Buffalo Bills - Brandon Dorlus, EDGE/DL, Oregon

101. Buffalo Bills (via mock trade w/ Panthers) - Keon Coleman, WR, Florida State

128. Buffalo Bills - Kamren Kinchens, S, Miami

133. Buffalo Bills - Nathan Thomas, OL, Louisiana

144. Buffalo Bills - Dwight McGlothern, DB, Arkansas

160. Buffalo Bills - Tyrone Tracy, RB, Purdue

163. Buffalo Bills - Cedric Johnson, EDGE, Ole Miss

200. Buffalo Bills - Donovan Jennings, OL, UCF

204. Buffalo Bills - Ryan Flournoy, WR, SE Missouri State

248. Carolina Panthers (via mock trade w/ Bills) - Ro Torrence, CB, Arizona State

Meh. Not a fan of Coleman. Not a fan of drafting 3 WRs. Not big on Dorlus. Not the biggest fan of McConkey over Legette. McGlothern could be another Elam-esque tough transition to the Bills scheme. Kinchens at 128 is about the only pick that I'd be really excited about.
 
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Jim Bob

Jim Bob

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Feb 27, 2002
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theathletic.com

NFL Draft mock trade: Bills send 'Julio Jones package' to Giants to draft new No. 1 WR

The Bills need a Stefon Diggs replacement. Should they go all in to get one? Does the move make sense for a Giants team short on star power?
theathletic.com theathletic.com

So the full deal would be:

Bills receive: 2024 first-round pick (No. 6) and 2025 seventh-round pick
Giants receive: 2024 first-round pick (No. 28), 2024 second-round pick (No. 60), 2024 fourth-round pick (No. 128) and 2025 first-round pick
Click to expand...

Most Giants fans want more to move back from 6 to 28. And I can't blame them.

Personally, I do not want the Bills to trade more than 2 1st or 2nd round picks to move up. And this gives up 3.

No thanks.

Just look at the Rams and Packers WR rooms. You do not need to give up a 3 1st and 2nd round picks to get a really good WR. Especially with a draft that is this deep at WR.

theathletic.com

Why you should draft Rome Odunze instead of Marvin Harrison Jr. and Malik Nabers

Michael Salfino explains why paying the premium for the top rookie wide receivers and tight ends is often a mistake in fantasy football.
theathletic.com theathletic.com
 
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TehDoak

TehDoak

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Jim Bob said:
theathletic.com

NFL Draft mock trade: Bills send 'Julio Jones package' to Giants to draft new No. 1 WR

The Bills need a Stefon Diggs replacement. Should they go all in to get one? Does the move make sense for a Giants team short on star power?
theathletic.com theathletic.com



Most Giants fans want more to move back from 6 to 28. And I can't blame them.

Personally, I do not want the Bills to trade more than 2 1st or 2nd round picks to move up. And this gives up 3.

No thanks.

Just look at the Rams and Packers WR rooms. You do not need to give up a 3 1st and 2nd round picks to get a really good WR. Especially with a draft that is this deep at WR.

theathletic.com

Why you should draft Rome Odunze instead of Marvin Harrison Jr. and Malik Nabers

Michael Salfino explains why paying the premium for the top rookie wide receivers and tight ends is often a mistake in fantasy football.
theathletic.com theathletic.com
Click to expand...

Time for Beane to breakout those photos of Schoen he's been saving for a rainy day.
 
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truthbluth

truthbluth

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Jim Bob said:
Meh. Not a fan of Coleman. Not a fan of drafting 3 WRs. Not big on Dorlus. Not the biggest fan of McConkey over Legette. McGlothern could be another Elam-esque tough transition to the Bills scheme. Kinchens at 128 is about the only pick that I'd be really excited about.
Click to expand...
Would love to get into this. I don't love Coleman, but he is a legit player whose in game athleticism is significantly better than his combine testing. I would hate it if the Bills selected Coleman as their first WR, because I think his skill set is limited, and what they need is a guy who can lineup everywhere. But Coleman can play, and in the 4th round, this is close to best value of the draft territory. I think there's very little chance Coleman makes it out of the 2nd, let alone the 3rd, but it's fun to think about.

McConkey is also a near perfect fit for what the Bills need. I like Legette better too, but McConkey is very very good.


Dorlus is also a near perfect fit for the Bills. They need a rotational DE, and a backup 3 tech. All in one package. In reality, he'll.primarily do only one of those things, but they have the luxury of getting to evaluate him at both positions before settling on where he lines up. But that man gets upfield.
 
John Price

John Price

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he had a complicated post playing legacy but let's be honest he was a great back for Buffalo.
 
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Der Jaeger

Der Jaeger

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ValJamesDuex said:
Do you prefer Coleman or Walker ?

I missed ?, but would appreciate your takes on McConkey, Franklin, Worthy (one trick pony ?)
Click to expand...
Walker, by a lot.

Walker: he's what you want in an X receiver. Ran faster at the combine than expected. Gets into the secondary fast and gets past coverage. Good catching radius and good hands, and wins contested catches. He's more of a one-trick-pony than people would expect, as he's basically a #2 type boundary receiver that will take coverage deep. But unlike Gabe Davis, who filled that role for the past two seasons, he's faster and has better hands. Walker bounced around a bunch of schools, so he's really raw, hasn't run a complete route tree, and needs a lot of refinement. If Beane can get back into the 3rd round, I'd look at Walker at 3 or 3-.

Coleman: a basketball player style receiver. Jumps well and has great hands. Will make highlight reel catches. He's not going to use quickness to separate, but catches balls like a forward on the interior of the lane of a basketball court: he's got someone right next to him, but he out-positions himself and uses his leaping and hands to win. Is that good enough in the NFL? These aren't bad traits, but I wouldn't take him on Day 1 or 2.

McConkey: For a while, I've compared Shakir to Diggs, which is part of the reason I thought Diggs would eventually be traded or released. McConkey is the same mold. Not huge but great hands and a very good route runner. Can play all receiver spots effectively. McConkey's timed speed is faster than Diggs or Shakir, so he could be even more of a deep threat. But does Beane want to spend a premium asset on a receiver like one he's already got in Shakir? I like McConkey, so that's a good question. He probably got a 1- to 2+ grade from most teams.

Franklin: has boundary skills without the boundary body. Fast and gets to a lot of deep balls. Impressive accelerations. Has a tough time against press coverage and has average hands. Might not be able to line up on the ball a lot, and might need to motion from inside to outside to free him up. I'm not at huge fan because he's got a lot of boundary receiver traits but a lot of boudnary receiver downside. I'd think about him at 60, but if it's between him and Worthy, I'm taking Worthy.

Worthy: sometimes a player is average at a lot but has one elite asset which vaults him into higher tiers. That's Worthy with his speed. He's not big, isn't going to win a lot of contested balls, doesn't really have the college production you'd like to see, and doesn't have elite hands. But he's got scary speed. He's got Hill-type of speed and explosiveness, and that could be enough for Beane to take him. He'd be in play at 60 if I were running the Bills.

And one extra, as I've been asked about him:

Rice: great hands and doesn't drop the football. High-points a lot of footballs and rarely lets balls into his pads. Won contested catches at the Senior Bowl. Long-strider with fantastic body control. Even though he didn't run particularly well at the combine, he gets past coverage, even when it's off coverage. Gets faster as he goes and with the ball in his hands. Average agility, which hinders his explosiveness, which translates into average separation. With that said, he gets open a lot. He's got the feet and body control to use technique more than actual timed quickness to separate, which will take time to develop. But in the NFL, there are a lot of contested catch situations because the coverage is so good. So you've got to either be able to separate by quickness, or have the hands to win footballs. Rice has the latter, and for me, he's probably got the best hands in the draft. He's a 3- player for me but he's going to be a lot better pro than what he showed in college.
 
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Husko

Husko

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Husko said:
New poll: 2024 HF Bills Big Board 19

@Rowley Birkin won't be happy as Mitchell comes off the board at #18 with a shocking 75% of the vote. Newton the overwhelming add.

New poll: 2024 HF Bills Big Board 19

1. Marvin Harrison Jr., WR, Ohio State (88%)
2. Malik Nabers, WR, LSU (83%)
3. Rome Odunze, WR, Washington (100%)
4. Joe Alt, OT, Notre Dame (38%)
4. Dallas Turner, DE, Alabama (38%)
6. Olu Fashanu, OT, Penn State (40%)
6. Laiatu Latu, DE, UCLA (40%)
8. Brian Thomas Junior, WR, LSU (40%)
9. Jackson Powers-Johnson, C, Oregon (40%)
9. Jared Verse, DE, Florida State (40%)
11. Brock Bowers, TE, Georgia (50%)
12. Cooper Dejean, DB, Iowa (50%)
13. Byron Murphy, DT, Texas (40%)
14. Taliese Fuaga, OL, Oregon (25%)
14. JC Latham, OT, Alabama (25%)
14. Terrion Arnold, CB, Alabama (25%)
14. Quinyon Mitchell, CB, Toledo (25%)
18. Adonai Mitchell, WR, Texas (75%)
Click to expand...
It's McConkey here for me, and he's probably the last WR I'll be voting for in this project. Big gap between him and the next WR to me.
 
truthbluth

truthbluth

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Husko said:
It's McConkey here for me, and he's probably the last WR I'll be voting for in this project. Big gap between him and the next WR to me.
Click to expand...
McConkey/Legette/Pearsall are a total tossup for me, but I went Johnny Newton here. He's the most Kyle Williamsish DT I can remember. Just a straight up wrecking ball.
 
Jim Bob

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
56,567
36,005
Rochester, NY
truthbluth said:
Would love to get into this. I don't love Coleman, but he is a legit player whose in game athleticism is significantly better than his combine testing. I would hate it if the Bills selected Coleman as their first WR, because I think his skill set is limited, and what they need is a guy who can lineup everywhere. But Coleman can play, and in the 4th round, this is close to best value of the draft territory. I think there's very little chance Coleman makes it out of the 2nd, let alone the 3rd, but it's fun to think about.

McConkey is also a near perfect fit for what the Bills need. I like Legette better too, but McConkey is very very good.


Dorlus is also a near perfect fit for the Bills. They need a rotational DE, and a backup 3 tech. All in one package. In reality, he'll.primarily do only one of those things, but they have the luxury of getting to evaluate him at both positions before settling on where he lines up. But that man gets upfield.
Click to expand...
Coleman does not seem like the kind of WR that Allen works with best. I couldn't care less about the combine numbers. I care about what the tape shows. Coleman is not a guy that gets separation. And he is not great at contested catch situations.

Guys that can't get separation in college and live and die in contested catch situations bust in the NFL way more than they succeed. I would much rather have Legette as the prototypical X WR early and then comeback with someone like Tahj Washington on day 3 (speedy WR with return ability) than taking McConkey and Coleman.

:dunno:
 
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Der Jaeger

Der Jaeger

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Breaking in some language on the board. Some teams rank players on a numbers system, and some don't. It's not universal and depends on what the GM likes.

There's another system widely used, and it's the tiered +/- system. The Bills used it in 1995 and probably use it today based on the way Beane talks about grades.

Each round is called by the appropriate number, and then the round is divided into thirds. The top third is annotated as "+" and the bottom of the round is annotated as "-" by the teams.

So if we are grading Marvin Harrison, we'd call him a 1+ player.

That's useful because it helps teams determine where talent is massed. Eg: if there are 10 players graded as "1+" and 10 players graded at "1" and 5 players graded as "1-" then a team with the 29th pick will know they aren't getting a player with a 1st round grade. The GM then has to determine if they trade into a position to get a player with a 1st round grade (like Beane did with Elam), or trade down.

In the case of Kincaid, Beane saw a "1" player there and got him in "1-" range.

Not every team uses this, but a lot do and I think the Bills still use it. The benefit over the number system is that you can more readily see value. If you've got the 29th pick, and the 27th rated player is there, it seems like a value pick as BPA. But if that kid has a "2+" rating, you're actually reaching at 29.

That's one of the reasons why the ESPN and NFL Network number systems on draft day don't align sometimes with team's boards. The other is that there are 32 different boards, so some teams have a player rated much higher than what you see on TV. It looks like a reach on TV but it's actually right where the team graded the player.

Hope that helps.
 
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Husko

Husko

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truthbluth said:
McConkey/Legette/Pearsall are a total tossup for me, but I went Johnny Newton here. He's the most Kyle Williamsish DT I can remember. Just a straight up wrecking ball.
Click to expand...
Interesting, I see a gulf between them. McConkey I have a first round grade, think he profiles as a true #1, and I'd be fine with a modest tradeup for him. My only real concern is injury. Legette and Pearsall are guys I'd be fine with but not excited about at 60.

Legette is an intriguing skill set and athletic profile, but not eclipsing 20 catches until his 5th year senior season is a massive red flag. I do like that he played outside and downfield, though, so he's one of my favorites in that round 2-3 range. Pearsall is another super senior with an old breakout age. I think he's high floor, but probably slot only which doesn't really interest me with a highish pick.

FWIW Brugler ranks them McConkey WR5, 1-2 round grade; Pearsall, WR9, 2-3 round grade, Legette WR14, 3rd round grade.

Jim Bob said:
Coleman does not seem like the kind of WR that Allen works with best. I couldn't care less about the combine numbers. I care about what the tape shows. Coleman is not a guy that gets separation. And he is not great at contested catch situations.

Guys that can't get separation in college and live and die in contested catch situations bust in the NFL way more than they succeed. I would much rather have Legette as the prototypical X WR early and then comeback with someone like Tahj Washington on day 3 (speedy WR with return ability) than taking McConkey and Coleman.

:dunno:
Click to expand...
I agree. I'm low on Coleman because I think he's the kind of receiver that Allen doesn't work well with. Allen's best success has always been with good separators. Coleman's worst attribute is his separation.
 
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truthbluth

truthbluth

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Husko said:
Interesting, I see a gulf between them. McConkey I have a first round grade, think he profiles as a true #1, and I'd be fine with a modest tradeup for him. My only real concern is injury. Legette and Pearsall are guys I'd be fine with but not excited about at 60.

Legette is an intriguing skill set and athletic profile, but not eclipsing 20 catches until his 5th year senior season is a massive red flag. I do like that he played outside and downfield, though, so he's one of my favorites in that round 2-3 range. Pearsall is another super senior with an old breakout age. I think he's high floor, but probably slot only which doesn't really interest me with a highish pick.

FWIW Brugler ranks them McConkey WR5, 1-2 round grade; Pearsall, WR9, 2-3 round grade, Legette WR14, 3rd round grade.


I agree. I'm low on Coleman because I think he's the kind of receiver that Allen doesn't work well with. Allen's best success has always been with good separators. Coleman's worst attribute is his separation.
Click to expand...
Legette's lack of production before his 5th year can be explained if you look into it. What's notable is that the moment he finally got on the field, as an injury replacement, he grabbed the opportunity and refused to let it go. He has incredible attributes. And he's hungry. McConkey is great, if he didn't literally have the smallest wingspan in the draft, I'd be more inclined to move him up into the AD, BTJ tier. Using Der Jaeger's lingo, they're all 2- who I'd be happy "reaching" for at 28.
 
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