"it would be nice to have another veteran guy on the team that’s for sure"

[Seedling]

Agreed. Hasn't looked like he's ready.

Interesting. You certainly loved the idea of him as captain this summer. What has changed your mind?

 

[Matador]

I don't buy it anymore. In a leadership vacuum one of the young players needs to step up. They haven't. Tavares, Landeskog, Toews, Crosby and Subban have all stepped up and taken significant leadership roles early in their careers.

Sure, bring in a veteran or two.....But what this signals to me is that the core group of players we are trying to build around aren't leaders. That is a major issue that isn't going to rectified by bringing in a veteran. Your best players need to be intrinsically motivated.

 

[Digger12]

Seguin had Bergeron, Chara, Krecji etc.

Duchene, Mackinnon, Landeskog have/had Tanguay and Hejduk

Stamkos had Lecavalier and St. Louis.

Hall, Ebs, Yak, Schultz, RNH have Horc lol.


Not one forward or D that have experience in being a star player in the NHL that can give tutelage to the kids. They're out on their own out there.

To which I ask "Where has Ales Hemsky been over these past several years?"

I'd be really curious as to what kind of tutelage he's been providing the young, offensively talented forwards since this rebuild started. I've heard often over the years about how he's been the lone shining light in a lot of dark times, you'd think that he'd only be too happy to help out the younglings.

Or not?

 

[Oilers10]

To which I ask "Where has Ales Hemsky been over these past several years?"

I'd be really curious as to what kind of tutelage he's been providing the young, offensively talented forwards since this rebuild started. I've heard often over the years about how he's been the lone shining light in a lot of dark times, you'd think that he'd only be too happy to help out the younglings.

Or not?

Ales has been living in the losing culture of the Oilers. As good of a player as I believe he is when he is healthy, I do not think he's a "leader" type and most certainly as MacT has mentioned this culture of losing has worn on the guy. We really need to get rid of almost anyone over the age of 23 that has been here through the losing years ala Smyth, Hemsky, Jones, Petry, etc.

 

[Cloned]

To which I ask "Where has Ales Hemsky been over these past several years?"

I'd be really curious as to what kind of tutelage he's been providing the young, offensively talented forwards since this rebuild started. I've heard often over the years about how he's been the lone shining light in a lot of dark times, you'd think that he'd only be too happy to help out the younglings.

Or not?

Hemsky's a quiet guy. That's his personality. He's not going to be very vocal about anything in the locker room, whether it be about his own performance or maybe offering assistance to other players. If management thought he would be a guy that could do that, they're even more out of the loop than I thought.

 

[KlimasLoveChild]

To which I ask "Where has Ales Hemsky been over these past several years?"

I'd be really curious as to what kind of tutelage he's been providing the young, offensively talented forwards since this rebuild started. I've heard often over the years about how he's been the lone shining light in a lot of dark times, you'd think that he'd only be too happy to help out the younglings.

Or not?

Teaching by example. Seems we have about three or four Hemsky clones on the wing these days. Flush this guy and give Yak his minutes.

 

[dustrock]

Knowing Hall, he wouldnt ever throw someone under the bus in public...he also wouldnt say anything for the sake of lip service. the guy speaks his mind and values his opinion. if he had something bad to say he would choose not talk.

Not sure about that. He's an assistant captain, and the former captain is returning to Rexall for the first time. Easier to mention bland nothings than to say "no comment", or "I don't discuss hockey on game days".

 

[Cawz]

To which I ask "Where has Ales Hemsky been over these past several years?"

I'd be really curious as to what kind of tutelage he's been providing the young, offensively talented forwards since this rebuild started. I've heard often over the years about how he's been the lone shining light in a lot of dark times, you'd think that he'd only be too happy to help out the younglings.

Or not?

He’s a talented hockey player, but he’s not a lockerroom leader. Its just not in his personality, based on watching him play and interview etc over his career.

As for leadership, this is something the team is sorely lacking. And trading Horcoff and Smid for capspace did nothing but hinder the team, since we need more complimentary players like that, not less. Until we put that capspace to some use, its hurting the team and the kids development.

 

[Soundwave]

I don't buy it anymore. In a leadership vacuum one of the young players needs to step up. They haven't. Tavares, Landeskog, Toews, Crosby and Subban have all stepped up and taken significant leadership roles early in their careers.

Sure, bring in a veteran or two.....But what this signals to me is that the core group of players we are trying to build around aren't leaders. That is a major issue that isn't going to rectified by bringing in a veteran. Your best players need to be intrinsically motivated.

Yeah I agree. The Pens and Hawks didn't "baby" their core with a ton of veterans either, despite how people like to revise the situation as.

Crosby/Toews naturally embraced that role even early in their careers, Tavares does just fine in New York leading the Islanders night in, night out also.

This team needs a guy who'll actually go battle in the corners and fish a puck out for the "kids" more than a locker room hero IMO.

 

[Kulleroinen*]

So what is Hall trying to say? For me that sounds that he wants to trade some young player for veterans. Could it be... Yakupov?

 

[Moose Coleman]

So what is Hall trying to say? For me that sounds that he wants to trade some young player for veterans. Could it be... Yakupov?

Oh brother.

 

[ZJuice]

Maybe they can bring him back in a management capacity as "senior player liaison" whose main job would be to crack heads in the locker room.

Pretty sure his head would pop after a few games.

 

[Supermassive]

Seguin had Bergeron, Chara, Krecji etc.

Duchene, Mackinnon, Landeskog have/had Tanguay and Hejduk

Stamkos had Lecavalier and St. Louis.

Hall, Ebs, Yak, Schultz, RNH have Horc lol.


Not one forward or D that have experience in being a star player in the NHL that can give tutelage to the kids. They're out on their own out there.

Perfectly put. And you can tell that Hall is getting sick of it.

 

[Soundwave]

Perfectly put. And you can tell that Hall is getting sick of it.

Then maybe he should step up and become a leader himself.

Crosby did it, Tavares does it, Landeskog assumed captaincy last year and is doing fine with it. I doubt Tanguay holds his hand every 5 minutes.

If this team is ever going to go anywhere, Hall/RNH/Eberle are the ones that have to lead it there.

 

[Tarus]

Yeah I agree. The Pens and Hawks didn't "baby" their core with a ton of veterans either, despite how people like to revise the situation as.

Crosby/Toews naturally embraced that role even early in their careers, Tavares does just fine in New York leading the Islanders night in, night out also.

This team needs a guy who'll actually go battle in the corners and fish a puck out for the "kids" more than a locker room hero IMO.

Those teams were/are full of veterans, especially Pittsburg/Chicago who both made a point of going out and signing older successful players so the younger guys wouldn't be fed to the wolves.

The experience levels of those teams allowed the younger guys to step into leadership roles at a younger age. The Islanders especially expose how poor the Oilers are, they are an example that you can fill a team full of affordable vets who will fill roles without complaint, something the Oilers have failed spectacularly at.

 

[Soundwave]

Those teams were/are full of veterans, especially Pittsburg/Chicago who both made a point of going out and signing older successful players so the younger guys wouldn't be fed to the wolves.

The experience levels of those teams allowed the younger guys to step into leadership roles at a younger age. The Islanders especially expose how poor the Oilers are, they are an example that you can fill a team full of affordable vets who will fill roles without complaint, something the Oilers have failed spectacularly at.

I think this is really over blown. Crosby was thrown to the wolves. So were Toews and Kane. So was Tavares.

The truth is they were good enough to deal with that and the main difference is not the veteran difference, but the fact that their rosters weren't as woefully imbalanced as the Oilers is.

This team needs some puck retreival, not a motivational speech in the locker room, that doesn't do much when the other team is pinning your in your own zone for 5 minutes until you cry daddy.

Horcoff, Smyth, Ference, are all good guys who have been through the battles, and Krueger was a motivational speaker ... that sorta thing only gets you certain results. You need players to perform on the ice.

This team is not an Alex Tanguay in the locker room away from the playoffs.

 

[The Nuge]

Maybe its just me, but, imo, this reads as though he's not against Yakupov. Hall's acknowledging we lack leadership, which also has a lot to do with what's going on with Yak

 

[McShogun99]

Did someone say trade Hemsky to Calgary for two 5'10 forward prospects?

 

[Tarus]

I think this is really over blown. Crosby was thrown to the wolves. So were Toews and Kane. So was Tavares.

The truth is they were good enough to deal with that and the main difference is not the veteran difference, but the fact that their rosters weren't as woefully imbalanced as the Oilers is.

This team needs some puck retreival, not a motivational speech in the locker room, that doesn't do much when the other team is pinning your in your own zone for 5 minutes until you cry daddy.

Horcoff, Smyth, Ference, are all good guys who have been through the battles, and Krueger was a motivational speaker ... that sorta thing only gets you certain results. You need players to perform on the ice.

This team is not an Alex Tanguay in the locker room away from the playoffs.

Pittsburg went and signed Gonchar, Reechi, Leclair, traded for Gary Roberts, Guerin, Hossa and a host of other vets. Mario Lemieux even came out of retirement for a year to help Crosby along.

Chicago signed players like Campbell, Hossa, and always had a ton of strong vet types lower down the roster.

Islanders specifically brought in players like Weight, Streit, Witt, Visnovsky and whatever other cheap, at the end of the line veteran they could find who could help the team along.

The only myth is that Tavares, Kane/Toews, and Crosby/Malkin were thrown to the wolves. The Oiler draft picks were thrown to the wolves, and just going through the rosters year by year of other rebuilds is an easy example of how incredibly inept and poorly run the Oilers organization is.

 

[McDavidson]

Crosby was far from thrown to the wolves, he Lived with Mario his first season even.

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

Pittsburg went and signed Gonchar, Reechi, Leclair, traded for Gary Roberts, Guerin, Hossa and a host of other vets. Mario Lemieux even came out of retirement for a year to help Crosby along.

Chicago signed players like Campbell, Hossa, and always had a ton of strong vet types lower down the roster.

Islanders specifically brought in players like Weight, Streit, Witt, Visnovsky and whatever other cheap, at the end of the line veteran they could find who could help the team along.

The only myth is that Tavares, Kane/Toews, and Crosby/Malkin were thrown to the wolves. The Oiler draft picks were thrown to the wolves, and just going through the rosters year by year of other rebuilds is an easy example of how incredibly inept and poorly run the Oilers organization is.

This is true - however, I think the Blackhawks also expected more from Kane and Toews at an earlier stage. Guys like Gagner, Eberle, and Hall are still being described as "kids" even though they've all been in the NHL for a while and aren't really being held accountable by anyone for the team's lack of success. After Toews' rookie year (or, by the time he was at Yakupov's stage) he was already team captain. And by the time Kane/Toews were at the same stage as Hall is, they had already won the Stanley Cup (with Toews being the Conn Smyth winner). Having a better leadership core definitely helped - but the players were helped by the fact the organization was way better functioning (and there was also better coaching in place). Incidentally, one of the reasons that the Hawks fired Savard and hired Quenneville is because it was determined that they needed someone more experience to get them to the next level. I know Eakins has a lot of time left on his contract, but the Oilers should still consider getting someone who knows what he's doing at the NHL level - like Laviolette.

 

[Tarus]

This is true - however, I think the Blackhawks also expected more from Kane and Toews at an earlier stage. Guys like Gagner, Eberle, and Hall are still being described as "kids" even though they've all been in the NHL for a while and aren't really being held accountable by anyone for the team's lack of success. After Toews' rookie year (or, by the time he was at Yakupov's stage) he was already team captain. And by the time Kane/Toews were at the same stage as Hall is, they had already won the Stanley Cup (with Toews being the Conn Smyth winner). Having a better leadership core definitely helped - but the players were helped by the fact the organization was way better functioning (and there was also better coaching in place). Incidentally, one of the reasons that the Hawks fired Savard and hired Quenneville is because it was determined that they needed someone more experience to get them to the next level. I know Eakins has a lot of time left on his contract, but the Oilers should still consider getting someone who knows what he's doing at the NHL level - like Laviolette.

Toews was a bit of a freak when you get down to it, he's a guy who stepped into the NHL and was nicknamed Captain Serious shortly after. It's unreasonable to suggest that a unique player is somehow the standard for which other rebuild franchise players should be judged.

By contrast, Crosby's first year in the league was full of on ice distractions as he whined about every play on the ice, to the point his own teammates could be seen rolling their eyes as "crybaby Crosby" would throw another one of his fits at the refs.

You're absolutely right about the coaching though. Renny clearly bought into the "young vs old" mentality that divided the locker room early, Kreuger wasn't given a chance, and Eakins has bombed spectacularly, this team needs a veteran leader coach in very bad way.

 

[Comrade Blunderbore]

this almost sounds like Hall is taking shots at his captain. ****ing go and provide some leadership of your own if you aren't liking what you have now enough, big boy.

 

[Oil80]

Why is this spoiled brat talking to the media about veterans? Trade him now

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

Toews was a bit of a freak when you get down to it, he's a guy who stepped into the NHL and was nicknamed Captain Serious shortly after. It's unreasonable to suggest that a unique player is somehow the standard for which other rebuild franchise players should be judged.

By contrast, Crosby's first year in the league was full of on ice distractions as he whined about every play on the ice, to the point his own teammates could be seen rolling their eyes as "crybaby Crosby" would throw another one of his fits at the refs.

You're absolutely right about the coaching though. Renny clearly bought into the "young vs old" mentality that divided the locker room early, Kreuger wasn't given a chance, and Eakins has bombed spectacularly, this team needs a veteran leader coach in very bad way.

No, I agree with you. My point was more that you can't just boil it down to guys like Kane/Toews getting ahead because of leadership in the room - that was part of it, but not close to being the only thing.

SOmething else that probably helped Toews a bit is that rather than going the major junior route, he instead went to boarding school for a couple of years and then spent two years playing in college (including in the year after he was drafted) before going pro. That probably encouraged a greater degree of maturity than playing in junior. But I'm not expert or anything.

The one who would benefit most from having someone solid around looks to be Hall - because he's the one who has the most potential to be a leader himself - probably in a Tavares kind of way - if there was just someone there to stop him from acting like such a tool half the time