Is there a trend of teams losing their best players being the best thing to ever happen to them?

[Jugitsu]

I never said immediately improved, I said quickly improved. And my point was not limited to the Leafs.

I sincerely think Nash requesting a trade out of Columbus was the best thing that ever happened to them, and if it's not then dodging the bullet on Bobrovsky and his $10 million contract was. CBJ has generally been one of the better teams in the East since they traded Nash.

And Boston trading away Jumbo set off a chain events that very quickly had them rise to have a sustained run of success as one of the best teams in the league (and one of the best decades of hockey in franchise history).

The Islanders record since losing JT speaks for itself.

The Hurricanes were kind off caught running in place in no man's land with Eric Staal and it seems trading him was the launching pad to get them back to the ECF and set up to be long term contender.

The Hurricanes also won the Stanley Cup with a 100-point Staal. Staal was on a downward spiral when Hurricanes traded him, so I don't think he's really that great of an example.

 

[General Disarray]

Because it forces the teams to go in a new direction to make up for it.

Yeah, plus some of those names are not really franchise players you build around. There's a reason why they are traded and guys like Barkov are not.

Also Tavares would turn Isles into the favorite from the east

 

[Quickdraw2828]

Also Tavares would turn Isles into the favorite from the east

Yeah, sure he would. Getting rid of his salary is the best thing that happened to the team. Eight years of him getting slower every season would have killed the future. After the Leafs are 22 million into his salary this year they may have a one and done and playoff miss to show for it. And he'll only get worse.

Now Panarin however....

 

[Kamiccolo]

Yeah, sure he would. Getting rid of his salary is the best thing that happened to the team. Eight years of him getting slower every season would have killed the future. After the Leafs are 22 million into his salary this year they may have a one and done and playoff miss to show for it. And he'll only get worse.

Now Panarin however....

It's a sad tale. Just like when Tampa missed the other year, it was the end of their window. Truly heart breaking.

4 points out with 30 games left btw.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

ROR would like a word with you, OP.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

This post is a big yikes from me dog.

I’m debating on which part is worse. Thornton being the best Bruin ever or Nash being a franchise player.

 

[JT Kreider]

I’m debating on which part is worse. Thornton being the best Bruin ever or Nash being a franchise player.

Nash was a franchise player for CBJ. He is the best player in franchise history and is their leader in nearly every point category. To say he is not is some serious revisionist history.

And I mean that Thornton was among the best Bruins ever and certainly was a "franchise player" when he was traded.

Also, weren't the Nationals perennial playoff underachievers and now just magically won a World Series as soon as Bryce Harper was eliminated from the equation?

 

[Kuznetsnow]

They are not.

But "best player leaving" and, if you have great young and underrated and still underpaid replacement kids, can have bigger impact together on the team than that market priced or overpriced "best player".

Just what happened at NYI when he left.

Same happened in Columbus after Duchene, Panarin, Bobrovsky left.

Basic thing in a cap world.

Some teams can survive without the best player, because they are drafting so well. Some teams will regress. You have to draft well.

Seems like a long winded way of saying best players are overrated.

You can add the Penguins going on a tear every time Crosby is out for months

 

[Legionnaire11]

Worked wonderfully for Quebec/Colorado trading away Lindros.

Edit: before I get roasted. Lindros was not the best Nordique/Avalanche player ever. But he was a franchise level, elite superstar player.

 

[CupHolders]

More coincidental. Or players just play harder to make up for the star player missing. People who think the Isles are better off without Tavares are idiots considering he’s exactly what they need to be a legit contender

No he's not. Panarin was.

 

[Atas2000]

Th Blues lost three key face of the franchise players in Oshie, Backes and Shattenkirk and won a Cup shortly thereafter?

Obviously none of those are superstars or best players as required in this thread. Backes(who has reached 60 pts once in his career) was let go when it was obvious he is over the hump, as evidenced by his performance ever since(also real superstars seem to stay competitive for a longer period. Look at OV, Crosby and Malkin. They are still a force in the league well beyond 30.). Shattenkirk was not so long ago called all kinds of names opposite to superstar. And he also never was a 1D even if we are generous. Oshie is an another once in a lifetime 60 pts player who is an integral part of the Caps now and was of the Cup run, but he is still no superstar, just a very good top 6 forward. So for the Blues it was more like making the move from having the team lead by players not good enough for that role to actually having superstars lead the team.

 

[boredguy]

The Bluejackets missed the playoffs 3 of the next 4 years after Nash was traded, i wouldn't say they quickly improved.

 

[JT Kreider]

The Bluejackets missed the playoffs 3 of the next 4 years after Nash was traded, i wouldn't say they quickly improved.

They missed by 1 point that first year, which was pretty much the 2nd most successful season in franchise history at that time. And made the playoffs, won their first ever playoff game and nearly beat the Penguins the 2nd year. Which was the most successful season in franchise history at that time. So yeah, they quickly improved and the Nash trade was followed by the most success in franchise history.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

I was just thinking about how bizarre it was that when CBJ, Tampa, Arizona (to a lesser extent) and Carolina traded away Nash, MSL, Yandle and Staal to the Rangers that was very quickly followed by the most success those teams have had in a long time? The same thing happened with Colorado trading away Duchene, literally the next day they took off and have been on a tear ever since. The Islanders have been one of the best teams in the league since JT left for the Leafs. CBJ also losing Bobrovsky looks to be a massive blessing in disguise.

Same thing with the Bruins when they traded away Jumbo... is this a crazy coincidence or is there more to it?

Edit: also add TOR trading Kessel to Pitt.

In a cap league it is which team spends the cap space the best. So a GM that spends to the cap and has lots of great contracts with low cap hits they can contend. One player doesn't make a team. Heck, Pens had the best record in the NHL over the 28 games Crosby was out.

So sometimes it's better to let the player go if he is asking for an outlandish cap hit type deal. Those almost always end badly. Pens have been lucky all 3 stars took much less than they could of gotten on the open market.

 

[boredguy]

They missed by 1 point that first year, which was pretty much the 2nd most successful season in franchise history at that time. And made the playoffs, won their first ever playoff game and nearly beat the Penguins the 2nd year. Which was the most successful season in franchise history at that time. So yeah, they quickly improved and the Nash trade was followed by the most success in franchise history.

In the 4 years before Nash was traded, miss playoffs 3 times, and loss in the 1st round once. 4 years after trade miss playoffs 3 times and lose in the 1st round once.

 

[BrockLobster]

Well considering 3 of those 5 teams had barely existed in 1995... and Tavares is absolutely one of the best players in Islanders history. Probably only behind Potvin and Bossy.

Tavares is not better than Brian trottier. Or pierre turgeon for that matter.

 

[Trap Jesus]

Boston was kind of a freak thing with the Thornton trade and injuries.

- Thornton dealt mid-2005/06 which paved the way for more opportunity for Bergeron; there was so much uncertainty coming out of the lockout, but even after Bergeron had a really good rookie year and an even better year in the AHL, the plan coming out of the offseason before injuries/trades was to have him as the 3C behind Thornton and Zhamnov
- Savard signed in the 2006 offseason to create a top 6 dynamic with Bergeron
- Bergeron suffers serious injury at the start of 2007/08 and wouldn't start rounding back to form until 2009/10, which paves the way for Krejci to form a top 6 dynamic with Savard
- Just as Bergeron is rounding back to form Savard suffers huge injury/injuries that essentially completely halt his career for good
- Bergeron and Krejci form a top 6 dynamic for the next decade which hasn't been challenged at all, even though roles have shifted between them as the decade went on

Dealing a player or having injuries occur just creates the opportunity to get better, but a lot of it is just luck.

 

[SEALBound]

You still need an all-star to be a game breaker. Teams can do better sure by filling the gap by committee but look at the SC winners of the last 15 years. All have a clear star player.

 

[Terry Yake]

anaheim isn't able to trade for pronger in '06 had kariya stayed

and without pronger the ducks don't win the cup in 07. so its safe to say there's no cup if kariya had stayed

 

[Muikea Bulju]

Uh, Thornton would be the second or third best player on that list.

"Top10 Bruins", not "Top10 Sharks"

Is Gretzky a Top10 St Louis Blue of all time? No.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Gotta follow the Montreal model - avoid superstars at all costs

 

[Voight]

I imagine long-term, Ottawa will be better off for having moved Karlsson for futures.

This year is looking promising for them. Good thing they got the Sharks 1st.

As for OP - heres one for you - If Orr's knee never gives out / they never trade him, do they still draft Bourque?

 

[wetcoast]

I am glad you mentioned those guys and Duchene, I'd surmise that if your franchise player is one of those players listed your franchise inst going to be that good. In Duchene, if you have a player like MacKinnon waiting in the wings all the better.

Exactly and MSL was probably the best player in the list the OP provided but he was freaking 38 years old when he was traded.

 

[King Mapes]

Uh, Thornton would be the second or third best player on that list.

Not sure about that one. Marchand, Bergeron, Chara, Rask all have a case to be better and Pastrnak probably now.

 

[King Mapes]

Yeah, sure he would. Getting rid of his salary is the best thing that happened to the team. Eight years of him getting slower every season would have killed the future. After the Leafs are 22 million into his salary this year they may have a one and done and playoff miss to show for it. And he'll only get worse.

Now Panarin however....

You don’t think adding JT would make them greatly improved?