Ok thanks. I found some clips of some players trying on specifc skates on youtube. Like Jordan Stall, Cole, Ponikarovsky,Wheeler, and Jeff Carter on the bauer supreme totalone. I tried on a pair of the Supreme One100 and they were very comfortable and felt very stable; but they were a slight too long and they had nothing smaller. Next time I'll try on a pair of totalone, they are supposed to be a similar fit to the one100. I was just thinking that it might be useful to know which players used which skates to get an idea of which skates would suit you (besides the fit of the boot) by comparing their skating styles with yours.
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HowToHockey
Registered User
Yup, I was at Bauer and RBK/CCM headquarters. They say a lot of the pros customize the skates so there is a big difference in pro vs retail. An interesting fact is that Bauer has two lines Vapour and Supreme. I am pretty sure they said Vapour is designed with the feedback of pro's, and Supreme is designed based on feedback from retail.
Also I think about 60% of the pro's wear bauer skates.
Don't worry about "skating style" when it comes to skates, fit is incredibly more important than anything else. Totalones are great skates if they fit your feet, but they are ridiculously expensive too. Any reasonably high end skate from any of the major brands (Bauer, CCM, RBk or Easton) are all pretty good right now, but all fit different types of feet, try on a wide range of skates from all brands with an experienced fitter in a store and you'll find the skate that fits your foot best. Some people have had durability issues with the Rbk pumps, and a few years ago there were a couple CCM and Easton models that had some durability issues, but they seem to have fixed those problems and I hear nothing but positive reviews about the new CCM U+ skates (the black/red/silver ones, not the old blue/grey/black ones) and Easton EQ skates.
Basically you want:
- when standing in a skating position (with the skates done up) your toes should just be barely "feathering" the toe cap
- with the skates tied your ankle should be completely locked in
- there should be a firm hold around your entire foot, but without any real pressure points/excess tightness. You'll need to keep the skates on for a bit and walk around in them to know if they're too narrow
- the top of your foot should not be bulging out of the skates, it should be roughly in-line with top of the skates (where the eyelets are)
- when laced up properly, the eyelets should follow a pretty straight line, not waving in and out
When you find a skate that satisfies this fit, get them baked and sharpened and you should be good to go. Depending on your feet you may also want to get some insoles, all skates come with garbage stock insoles, for me Superfeet yellow insoles make a massive difference. If you have pressure points/general issues during your first few skates that don't seem to go away, bring them back to the shop, any good hockey shop (i.e. a real hockey shop, not a sport check type shop) should have good fitters who will tweak your skate (for free) through punching/stretching/re-baking so that it fits you just right.
Basically you want:
- when standing in a skating position (with the skates done up) your toes should just be barely "feathering" the toe cap
- with the skates tied your ankle should be completely locked in
- there should be a firm hold around your entire foot, but without any real pressure points/excess tightness. You'll need to keep the skates on for a bit and walk around in them to know if they're too narrow
- the top of your foot should not be bulging out of the skates, it should be roughly in-line with top of the skates (where the eyelets are)
- when laced up properly, the eyelets should follow a pretty straight line, not waving in and out
When you find a skate that satisfies this fit, get them baked and sharpened and you should be good to go. Depending on your feet you may also want to get some insoles, all skates come with garbage stock insoles, for me Superfeet yellow insoles make a massive difference. If you have pressure points/general issues during your first few skates that don't seem to go away, bring them back to the shop, any good hockey shop (i.e. a real hockey shop, not a sport check type shop) should have good fitters who will tweak your skate (for free) through punching/stretching/re-baking so that it fits you just right.
Graf lists the pros that use their skates on their site
http://www.grafcanada.com/hockey/pro_hockey_players.php
However everybody with a * after their name only wears their custom footbeds not their skates.
The Bauer Hockey Twitter Feed http://twitter.com/#!/BauerHockey exists to brag every time a player with their skates or stick scores a goal. Look through their post history should give you a good idea which pros wear their gear.
http://www.grafcanada.com/hockey/pro_hockey_players.php
However everybody with a * after their name only wears their custom footbeds not their skates.
The Bauer Hockey Twitter Feed http://twitter.com/#!/BauerHockey exists to brag every time a player with their skates or stick scores a goal. Look through their post history should give you a good idea which pros wear their gear.
Pro's get anything they want if they are fully sponsor'd
Graf's w/ Tuuk holders
Total One's w/ Graf insoles
Custom widths and lengths
At the end of the day, I think they all use super stiff boots... and with all the variations of mid to high end skates out there... you'll find something that'll work.
I personally fit Easton's the best in regular D, and I like their S15 and S17 skates
Graf's w/ Tuuk holders
Total One's w/ Graf insoles
Custom widths and lengths
At the end of the day, I think they all use super stiff boots... and with all the variations of mid to high end skates out there... you'll find something that'll work.
I personally fit Easton's the best in regular D, and I like their S15 and S17 skates
Supreme and Vapor skates also fit quite differently, Supreme's have a wider forefoot (the standard "D" width Supremes actually are built on a last with a slightly wider "E" forefoot, while "D" Vapors are actual D width). Also, Vapors have a more pitched forward stance (good for quick acceleration going forwards, but not as great for going backwards), while Supremes have a more neutral stance. I'd say most new skates on the market have a more pitched forward stance than Supremes, which have more of an old school stance, but you'll adapt to pitched forward or neutral within the first few skates anyways.
Bauers are the most popular skates with NHLers, but that's as much about their marketing as it is about the product itself, if you were to compare, for example, the $600ish skates from all the major manufacturers (Bauer one100s, Bauer Vapor X7.0s, CCM U+ CLs, Rbk 11Ks and Easton EQ50s) they're all so close in weight, stiffness, build quality, etc. that you really shouldn't be worried about anything but the fit. Basically the same with any other price point too.
************
As for custom skates, pros get a lot of custom options, but you can get quite a few custom options retail too. In general at any high end hockey shop they'll have a relationship with reps from the major brands, and if you want they'll have a rep come in who will fit you for a custom skate. Basically the cost is the same as for the top of the line skate plus around $100 or so (regardless of how many custom options you add). Custom skate options generally include:
- Quarter sizes length wise, and different sizes per skate (i.e. you could get 8 3/4 on one foot, 8 1/2 on the other, if your feet are different sizes)
- A wide variety of widths for both the forefoot and the ankle, instead of just the 2 general widths for the whole skate that are normally offered
- A wide variety of liners to chose from
- Different skate stiffnesses
- Some eyelet moving options, basically for more or less volume
- Double stitching (better durability)
- Extra foam around the ankles
etc.
Custom skates are generally (always?) only available for the top of the line skate in each brand/line though, not for midrange skates unfortunately. Before getting a custom skate I'd definitely want to have spent quite a bit of time trying on the retail models, so you know roughly what you want in terms of length/width (for example, maybe a size 9, D width Easton EQ50 fits you almost perfectly, but you'd like it just slightly shorter, with a slightly narrower ankle, it's best to know that going into the custom fitting instead of just relying on foot measurements).
Ozolinsh_27
Registered User
- Apr 1, 2005
- 558
- 0
Great post!
If I remember correctly, when the Vapors first started coming out the marketing was geared towards the agile forward while the Supremes were geared towards power forwards and defenseman. I believe their two main guys were Pavel Bure and Eric Lindros wearing these signature lines.
I remember my first major skate purchase was a set of Bauer Supremes in 98 and with the fit, they absolutely crushed my ankle so bad in my first skate in them that I had a lingering blister for 3 weeks! But with the materials, I was moved to another skate and ended up in Graf 705s for several years - I'm thinking that Bauer wasn't really into heat molding yet, but Graf was?
Thanks for the information. That's the type of info I was looking for, especially the part about pitched forward abd neutral stance skates. I have a pair of rebook 8k that allow for quick acceleration and sharp turns; what I don't like about them is that making a quick transition between going forwards to backwards is awkward and I sometimes feel like I'm going to stumble or trip myself. I think it has something to do with the fact that the skate has a pitched forward stance. I wonder if I'd have the same feeling with a more neutral stance skate like the supremes. The skates that are angled forwards force you to skate hunched over while the neutral stance skate I think would provide more stability on the ice allowing you to skate more upright. I wonder if the difference between the two skates is better acceleration and sharper turns with the angled forward skates, while better stability and trasition between backwards abd forwards with the neutral stance. Perhaps two-way players and playmakers are better off with a neutral stance skates while snipers and speedsters are better off with angled forward skates.
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Fleuryoutside29
Registered User
- Nov 3, 2009
- 583
- 0
I checked into a bunch of different brands and found a list of the players that are part of the brand's "team".
Bauer Team: http://www.bauer.com/athlete/index
CCM Team: http://ccmhockey.com/en/players/
MLX Team: http://mlxskates.com/players.html
Easton Team: http://eastonhockey.com/the-team
Reebok Team: http://www.reebokhockey.com/team/
I realize it doesn't show the specific skates the player is using, but I don't know if you had any favorite players and wanted to buy their skates. I hope this helps.
Bauer Team: http://www.bauer.com/athlete/index
CCM Team: http://ccmhockey.com/en/players/
MLX Team: http://mlxskates.com/players.html
Easton Team: http://eastonhockey.com/the-team
Reebok Team: http://www.reebokhockey.com/team/
I realize it doesn't show the specific skates the player is using, but I don't know if you had any favorite players and wanted to buy their skates. I hope this helps.
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Just to clarify though, this would be the worst idea ever. By far the most important thing about skates is how they fit your feet, and all brands/lines fit a bit differently, buy the skates that fit best, not the skates with the best marketing.
I'm sure Bauer will market their Vapor and Supreme lines as for specific types of players, but really things like pitch/stance are just personal preference/what you're used to, I'm sure for every "type" of player in the NHL you'll see a variety of pitches/stances based simply on the player's preference. I have had both skates that put me a bit more forward and those that are more neutral, and honestly it just takes me a couple skates to adjust, then I hardly notice the difference. If you are having trouble with forwards/backwards transitions, you just need more practice, not new skates. Again, you should base your skate choice almost entirely on fit, other things like stiffness, stance, etc. are things you should basically only use to decide between two different skates that fit similarly.
Also, just wanted to clarify, you talk about "skating upright" and "skating hunched over" like having your knees/ankles bent is a bad thing that makes you unstable, when it's actually the opposite. A low, knees/ankles bent stance is best for all forms of skating, you can generate more power and are much more stable with a low, "athletic stance," like this:
Only beginners skate upright, because they're too scared to bend their knees/ankles:
Regardless of the skates you are wearing you want to always have a real good, deep/low ankle/knee bend.
Fleuryoutside29
Registered User
- Nov 3, 2009
- 583
- 0
Ponder I agree I merely just thought this was the question originally posed by Smoke Monster and was doing my best to answer it. In my opinion it is kind of cool to see what brands different players use?
Most definitely, cool to see for sure, just making sure the OP knows not to buy skates worn by his favorite player IF they don't fit well.
Not trying to doubt you, but where do you get this information? I've heard this dozens of times online, and all the knowledgeable people I've asked say this isn't true.
I'm sure Bauer will market their Vapor and Supreme lines as for specific types of players, but really things like pitch/stance are just personal preference/what you're used to, I'm sure for every "type" of player in the NHL you'll see a variety of pitches/stances based simply on the player's preference. I have had both skates that put me a bit more forward and those that are more neutral, and honestly it just takes me a couple skates to adjust, then I hardly notice the difference. If you are having trouble with forwards/backwards transitions, you just need more practice, not new skates. Again, you should base your skate choice almost entirely on fit, other things like stiffness, stance, etc. are things you should basically only use to decide between two different skates that fit similarly.
Also, just wanted to clarify, you talk about "skating upright" and "skating hunched over" like having your knees/ankles bent is a bad thing that makes you unstable, when it's actually the opposite. A low, knees/ankles bent stance is best for all forms of skating, you can generate more power and are much more stable with a low, "athletic stance," like this:
Only beginners skate upright, because they're too scared to bend their knees/ankles:
Regardless of the skates you are wearing you want to always have a real good, deep/low ankle/knee bend.
I'm an experienced skater, I don't have trouble going backward or forwards or transitioning between them. The reason my current skates are not adequate is because they are not the right fit - they are slightly too long and too narrow. That's the reason I'm looking for new skates.
Got it online too, but from very knowledgeable posters who own hockey shops or who have worked at hockey shops for a long time and deal with Bauer reps. It's also very obvious when you try the skates on: at the same size D width Supremes are noticeably wider in the forefoot than D width Vapors, I am very confident that it's true. And posters who have ordered custom Supremes have confirmed that if you want the retail width you must order an E width forefoot, a D width forefoot will be narrower, because retail "D" width Supreme's are built on the same last as custom E width Supremes, while with Vapors this is not the case (the custom D width forefoot is the same as the forefoot on the D width retails.
Poor fit is a fantastic reason to get new skates. Wasn't trying to be a ****** or anything, just wanted to give you good advice and hammer in the "fit is king" point, since you were originally talking about which players use certain skates being something you'd want to know pre-purchase.
When you say too narrow, too narrow in your forefoot, too narrow around your ankle, or too narrow in both the forefoot and ankle? I'd say if you were to compare a D width Supreme skate (like the one100s you tried on) with your D width 7Ks in the same size, the Supremes should be a bit roomier in the forefoot (especially around the toes), but the Supremes should also be a bit tighter around the ankles (unless you really go crazy with the pump I guess), at least I seem to remember that being my experience when I last bought skates and tried on both Supremes and Rbks. Reeboks are decently wide and decently high volume skates though, if your current Reeboks are too long but still too narrow, maybe you have a relatively wide foot and need a wide skate? Because at the right length for you those 7Ks would be even tighter, and as I said, it's not like Reeboks are super narrow to start with. What size and width are your current skates, and how much extra room do you have length wise?
It does sound like Supremes could be a good choice for you, if you want a more neutral pitch and a wider forefoot, but make sure to try on skates from all brands, in wide widths if you do indeed need wide skates.
Fleuryoutside29
Registered User
- Nov 3, 2009
- 583
- 0
Have you look into customized skates where you bake them. I know you can bake most skates, but from my experience with my Vapor APX's I think a skate fits great when it meant to be baked.
Here are the ones that I know me and my teammates like:
Bauer Vapor APX: http://www.bauer.com/gear/player/skates/11583-BAUER#shell
Reebok 10K Pump: http://www.reebokhockey.com/gear/products/player/skates/product/10k-pump-skate/
(not Baked, but has the pump feature)
Easton EQ50: http://eastonhockey.com/eq50-4.html
CCM U+10: http://ccmhockey.com/en/catalogue/skates/product/u-plus10-skates/
MLX: http://mlxskates.com/performance.html
I've had my reebok 8k heat treated because they were very uncomfortable initially. My mistake was that I was tempted by the 50% sale they had on the reebok 8k and made my purchase on the spur of the moment instead of shopping around, trying on many skates, and not getting advice from experienced and competent sales people. After the salesman told me it's normal that the boot should feel uncomfortable since it needs to be broken in, he tells me later that ideally you should try to avoid having your skates heat treated or baked since you lose some of the rigidity of the skate and hence the performance. It turned out later, out of curiosity, I went to a different store to try out another size of the same reebok 8k skate(I originaly bought a reebok 8k in size 8.5D) I had just bought to see if it would be a better fit and, lo and behold, I fit perfectly into a size 8 E instead of a 8.5 D. So all I can say to other guys looking for a pair of skates is don't trust the salesman, try on as many skates until you find the perfect fit, ideally with the help of someone who is experienced and competent in fitting skates on people. I would avoid a salesman that tells me that it's normal that the skate should be uncomfortable and that it needs to be broken in; its more likely you have the wrong size or type of boot for your shape of foot. I've tried the bauer vapor x50 and they were uncomfortable. This salesman told me the vapors, supremes, and ccm crazy u series each have their own distinct boot fit. So the vapor x60 and apx won't be confortable for me if the x50 isn't. The ccm crazy u lites were not comfortable for me either. But the supremes one100 I found reasonably comfortable. I have not tried any easton, mlx, or graf skates. But right now my top choice looks like the supremes one100's or the supreme totalone which I have not tried yet but I assume they have the same fit as the one100.
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Gooseamania
Registered User
I didn't want to start a new thread for this, and my question feels like it belongs in this thread so here it goes: my question is not to figure out which skates pro's wear, but i WAS wondering if pro's ever wear INFERIOR skates? for example, in 2010 reebok released it skates for the years 2010 and 2011, starting with the 11k being their top of the line, then the 10k, then the 8k (you get the point). bauer released the APX's, the x7.0, x6.0, etc.
do pro's ever defer the top skates (11k, APX, total one, U+ crazy lights) in favor of an inferior skate (10k, x7.0, u+12, supreme one80, etc)? if so, i would imagine that it's because they may prefer a less-stiff boot? perhaps a faster break in period? or maybe just because they dont like the feel of the top of the line skates?
do pro's ever defer the top skates (11k, APX, total one, U+ crazy lights) in favor of an inferior skate (10k, x7.0, u+12, supreme one80, etc)? if so, i would imagine that it's because they may prefer a less-stiff boot? perhaps a faster break in period? or maybe just because they dont like the feel of the top of the line skates?
Sometimes you see them using non top end models, could be for any number of reasons really, from stiffness to fit to whatever else. They get a lot of custom options with their skates though, so if they want, for example, a less 11k skate, they can just get an 11k that is less stiff than the retail model. More often you'll see them in older top of the line models, probably because they're used to said older models. For example, a lot of CCM's top players (Ovy, Thornton, etc.) seem to be using the old U+ pro reloadeds over the new U+ CLs.
Gooseamania
Registered User
interesting. i mean i figured some players must use older skates, but you see so many players wearing the "latest and greatest" gear every year which is understandable.
so, i understand that pro's wear older PRO or TOP of the line skates even when newer models are available, but do they wear skates that are NOT top skates? like would a player wear an 8k RBK if they had a better 11K? i'm sure it's just preference like you said, i guess i always assumed that players with a pro level skating ability would just jump to the best new skate because they transition from skate to skate would probably be seamless for them.
so, i understand that pro's wear older PRO or TOP of the line skates even when newer models are available, but do they wear skates that are NOT top skates? like would a player wear an 8k RBK if they had a better 11K? i'm sure it's just preference like you said, i guess i always assumed that players with a pro level skating ability would just jump to the best new skate because they transition from skate to skate would probably be seamless for them.
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