Former Bruins Is Ray Bourque a Top 10 All-Time Player?

[DKH]

I can go to 1966 and sat in defensive zone 1&3 where he patrolled and he was fantastic

I don’t count Orr he stands alone

Bourque would be my first pick if I could have any defensemen since League went To 12 teams (Orr was 6 league to start)

I don’t even think close - he was perfectly balanced like Stan Musial hit totals home and away both incredibly 1830

 

[DKH]

Or course, it was Sinden's fault Bourque doesn't have a statue or ring in Boston.

To me Bourque, Potvin and Lidstrom are really close. Most hockey people see it that way too. But as time marches on, Eddie Shore is losing ground and many "experts" are dropping him into that group also.

If Bourque in 1979 went to Montreal they probably win 4 Cups minimum

Orr
Bourque

To me it gets tricky

I would go Potvin then Lidstrom

5???? Robinson

I’m about balance here Coffey & EK drop

Park with knees seriously could have been 3

Stevens was a beast

 

[Mad-Marcus]

Top 10 Defenseman ever, possibly if not probably. Top 10 player overall, no.

 

[goldnblack]

Top 10 hair though?

 

[The don godfather]

Anytime there's a game 7 in the Stanley cup finals someone is going to get credit for scoring the winning goal. Cool accomplishment but it has happened plenty of times for plenty of other players. Not something that puts him in rare company.

Max Talbot has 2 goals in a game 7 scf game.

And if Bergeron was a top 10 player of all time there would be no could've or should'ves

Bergy all time great Bruin. But far down the list of all time NHLers

6 selke mr playoffs hes up there. He has the credentials to be even one of the best all time. Gretzky cant play his type of game even if he tried. He was one dimensional. Bergy paid the price playing the right way. These type of players are impossible to find so unique and to top it off his leadership skills are off the charts. Bergy should have a statue outside td garden right beside orr. Will miss him lots.

 

[DKH]

Who are the top 10 since 50’s TV/colorization- people actually saw ?

No order

Orr
Gretzky
Lemieux
Howe
Bobby Hull
Rocket Richard
Esposito
McDavid
Crosby
Ovechkin
Jagr
Messier
Bourque
Bossy
Yzerman

That’s 15 who my missing

I thought LaFontaine was headed there

Brett Hull?
Lidstrom
Mikita
Trottier

Bobby Clarke super underrated

Btw - Bruins 1969 draft
Round 1
3. Frank Spring- bust
4. Don Tannahill - bust (liked him)
11. Ivan Boldeliev (really good but he was traded)

Round 2
17 Bobby Clarke - and I believe he was a Bruins fan and was hoping they take him with one of 3 picks; huge Orr guy

Bonvie ? Fenway?

 

[sarge88]

Who are the top 10 since 50’s TV/colorization- people actually saw ?

No order

Orr
Gretzky
Lemieux
Howe
Bobby Hull
Rocket Richard
Esposito
McDavid
Crosby
Ovechkin
Jagr
Messier
Bourque
Bossy
Yzerman

That’s 15 who my missing

I thought LaFontaine was headed there

Brett Hull?
Lidstrom
Mikita
Trottier

Bobby Clarke super underrated

Btw - Bruins 1969 draft
Round 1
3. Frank Spring- bust
4. Don Tannahill - bust (liked him)
11. Ivan Boldeliev (really good but he was traded)

Round 2
17 Bobby Clarke - and I believe he was a Bruins fan and was hoping they take him with one of 3 picks; huge Orr guy

Bonvie ? Fenway?

Won’t argue with anyone mentioned above.

I will say that if he wanted to be, Malkin probably could have forced his way into the top 10-15.

I never got the feeling that he gave it his “all” consistently enough.

If he played every game with 1/2 the intensity or effort of a Clarke or O’Reilly, I think he’d be in that category.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Who are the top 10 since 50’s TV/colorization- people actually saw ?

No order

Orr
Gretzky
Lemieux
Howe
Bobby Hull
Rocket Richard
Esposito
McDavid
Crosby
Ovechkin
Jagr
Messier
Bourque
Bossy
Yzerman

That’s 15 who my missing

I thought LaFontaine was headed there

Brett Hull?
Lidstrom
Mikita
Trottier

Bobby Clarke super underrated

Btw - Bruins 1969 draft
Round 1
3. Frank Spring- bust
4. Don Tannahill - bust (liked him)
11. Ivan Boldeliev (really good but he was traded)

Round 2
17 Bobby Clarke - and I believe he was a Bruins fan and was hoping they take him with one of 3 picks; huge Orr guy

Bonvie ? Fenway?

Yes, Bobby Clarke very underrated. Would have him ahead of Espo, Messier and Yzerman.

Beliveau ahead of all of the above.

Lafleur could be in there.

Joe Sakic (pretty much = Yzerman)

If not for injuries, Forsberg & Lindros.

If not for being commies, Makarov and Fetisov.

Goalies as possible top 10; Roy, Hasek and Plante.

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

Who are the top 10 since 50’s TV/colorization- people actually saw ?

No order

Orr
Gretzky
Lemieux
Howe
Bobby Hull
Rocket Richard
Esposito
McDavid
Crosby
Ovechkin
Jagr
Messier
Bourque
Bossy
Yzerman

That’s 15 who my missing

I thought LaFontaine was headed there

Brett Hull?
Lidstrom
Mikita
Trottier

Bobby Clarke super underrated

Btw - Bruins 1969 draft
Round 1
3. Frank Spring- bust
4. Don Tannahill - bust (liked him)
11. Ivan Boldeliev (really good but he was traded)

Round 2
17 Bobby Clarke - and I believe he was a Bruins fan and was hoping they take him with one of 3 picks; huge Orr guy

Bonvie ? Fenway?

I was at the parade for the 1974 Flyers. I was six months old. My whole family from Philly. I have a Bobby Clarke Flin Flon Bombers jersey (look up how Flin Flon got it’s name if you want a kick).

Bobby Clarke did not grow up a Bruins fan.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

If Bourque in 1979 went to Montreal they probably win 4 Cups minimum

Orr
Bourque

To me it gets tricky

I would go Potvin then Lidstrom

5???? Robinson

I’m about balance here Coffey & EK drop

Park with knees seriously could have been 3

Stevens was a beast

Luckily Montreal didn't have a first-round pick in 1979.

Still, they managed to draft Gaston Gingras (great name), Mats Naslund and Guy Carbonneau.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

I can go to 1966 and sat in defensive zone 1&3 where he patrolled and he was fantastic
I don’t count Orr he stands alone
Bourque would be my first pick if I could have any defensemen since League went To 12 teams (Orr was 6 league to start)
I don’t even think close - he was perfectly balanced like Stan Musial hit totals home and away both incredibly 1830

Talk about underrated players?

Could be top 15 all-time.

 

[DKH]

I was at the parade for the 1974 Flyers. I was six months old. My whole family from Philly. I have a Bobby Clarke Flin Flon Bombers jersey (look up how Flin Flon got it’s name if you want a kick).

Bobby Clarke did not grow up a Bruins fan.

Orr fan

Yes, Bobby Clarke very underrated. Would have him ahead of Espo, Messier and Yzerman.

Beliveau ahead of all of the above.

Lafleur could be in there.

Joe Sakic (pretty much = Yzerman)

If not for injuries, Forsberg & Lindros.

If not for being commies, Makarov and Fetisov.

Goalies as possible top 10; Roy, Hasek and Plante.

yup on Belliveau & LaFleur

Can’t put Clarke ahead of Espo

Yzerman and Sakic yes

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Bourque, loved his game and watching him play. Top 10 though, I don't believe so.
It's tough just to rate where he falls just amongst Bruins players nevermind historically league wide. Great player.

I've seen Orr, Park, Bourque, Chara all play and just my top five Bruins defenseman are:
1. Orr
2. Shore
3. Bourque
4. Park
5. Chara
I firmly believe just within the Bruins organization arguments could be made for the rankings for defenseman of 2 through 4 as being somewhat interchangeable and it's all subjective. Bourque could be rated as high as 2 and Shore as low as 4 and I think Park falls 3 or 4 either way. Was Park the best defenseman to never win a cup or Norris - 8 time runner up to Orr? Shore 4 league MVPs before there was a Norris. Bourque has 5 Norris/5 runner ups, longevity and prolonged high level of play setting him a part, but won his cup elsewhere. I do think Bourque should have also won an MVP one year as well.

Bourque is outside top 10 historically league wide; most likely depending on preferences he falls somewhere in the 12 - 25 range.

No way Park breaks into the top 4 Boston D. He had 3 elite seasons with Boston.
1975-76 thru 1977-78. Its Orr, Shore, Bourque and Chara, AINEC for anyone else, Park included.

 

[DKH]

No way Park breaks into the top 4 Boston D. He had 3 elite seasons with Boston.
1975-76 thru 1977-78. It’s Orr, Shore, Bourque and Chara, AINEC for anyone else, Park included.

I take Park over Chara on all time list covering Rangers and Bruins part

My top 6 is easy going back to 1950’s

Shore could be inserted anywhere after Orr and how can you argue but who saw him

1. Orr
2. Harvey (saw but not with Montreal )
3. Bourque
4. Lidstrom
5. Potvin
6. Robinson

4-6 could be flipped any way
Harvey going by actual accounts since my father watched his entire career

7-12 would be interesting- Park & Chara definitely in conversation

 

[KillerMillerTime]

I take Park over Chara on all time list covering Rangers and Bruins part

My top 6 is easy going back to 1950’s

Shore could be inserted anywhere after Orr and how can you argue but who saw him

1. Orr
2. Harvey (saw but not with Montreal )
3. Bourque
4. Lidstrom
5. Potvin
6. Robinson

4-6 could be flipped any way
Harvey going by actual accounts since my father watched his entire career

7-12 would be interesting- Park & Chara definitely in conversation

Yeah, I would take Park over Chara for their entire careers also but not just their Boston parts. I definitely get the sense some people are merging Park's Ranger career and including it when ranking Boston's D men which is unfair to Chara for certain.

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

I take Park over Chara on all time list covering Rangers and Bruins part

My top 6 is easy going back to 1950’s

Shore could be inserted anywhere after Orr and how can you argue but who saw him

1. Orr
2. Harvey (saw but not with Montreal )
3. Bourque
4. Lidstrom
5. Potvin
6. Robinson

4-6 could be flipped any way
Harvey going by actual accounts since my father watched his entire career

7-12 would be interesting- Park & Chara definitely in conversation

Robinson at 6? Over Chara? Pronger? Coffey? Come on.

 

[DKH]

Robinson at 6? Over Chara? Pronger? Coffey? Come on.

I’d take Robinson unbelievable combo skill winner leadership toughness - his beatdown of Dave Schultz is right there with Buster Douglas on Mike Tyson. National TV Sunday, Peter Puck, Dan Kelly - it was a brawl but it was the single biggest shift moment in hockey history to me. The Canadiens and their way of grace and beauty were bsck and those bullies from Philadelphia were never the same (full disclosure I loved those Flyers in a way but those pricks had it coming) we ever get to time travel it’s 1976 Montreal Forum - greatest brawl in history between everything you hate or love about hockey depending on your preference

After 6 it gets interesting

Obviously I’m not up on anything prior to 50’s so would have to can of designate a tier

Orr is like Thor he’s from another realm

2-6 is Tier 2

I only saw Harvey cause he came back at 40 in 1968-69 and I was a yute

Pilotte & Horton I saw live a bunch and had their cards etc but there best days were before me

Gotta take a deep dive

No order
Chara
Park
Coffey
Stevens
Nedemayer
Pronger
Chelios
Howe
McInnis
Leetch
EK

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

I’d take Robinson unbelievable combo skill winner leadership toughness - his beatdown of Dave Schultz is right there with Buster Douglas on Mike Tyson. National TV Sunday, Peter Puck, Dan Kelly - it was a brawl but it was the single biggest shift moment in hockey history to me. The Canadiens and their way of grace and beauty were bsck and those bullies from Philadelphia were never the same (full disclosure I loved those Flyers in a way but those pricks had it coming) we ever get to time travel it’s 1976 Montreal Forum - greatest brawl in history between everything you hate or love about hockey depending on your preference

After 6 it gets interesting

Obviously I’m not up on anything prior to 50’s so would have to can of designate a tier

Orr is like Thor he’s from another realm

2-6 is Tier 2

I only saw Harvey cause he came back at 40 in 1968-69 and I was a yute

Pilotte & Horton I saw live a bunch and had their cards etc but there best days were before me

Gotta take a deep dive

No order
Chara
Park
Coffey
Stevens
Nedemayer
Pronger
Chelios
Howe
McInnis
Leetch
EK

Yeah Robinson was great can’t believe you have him above half those guys. But hockey is your eighth sport so I get it.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Robinson at 6? Over Chara? Pronger? Coffey? Come on.

Absolutely.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Orr fan

yup on Belliveau & LaFleur

Can’t put Clarke ahead of Espo

Yzerman and Sakic yes

Its close.

They played at the same time. Both won a couple of Cups. 3 Hart trophies for Clarke, 2 for Espo. Clarke may have been the best defensive forward ever and a two-time runner-up for the Art Ross trophy. 5th all-time in plus/minus (+507).

I’d take Robinson unbelievable combo skill winner leadership toughness - his beatdown of Dave Schultz is right there with Buster Douglas on Mike Tyson. National TV Sunday, Peter Puck, Dan Kelly - it was a brawl but it was the single biggest shift moment in hockey history to me. The Canadiens and their way of grace and beauty were bsck and those bullies from Philadelphia were never the same (full disclosure I loved those Flyers in a way but those pricks had it coming) we ever get to time travel it’s 1976 Montreal Forum - greatest brawl in history between everything you hate or love about hockey depending on your preference

After 6 it gets interesting

Obviously I’m not up on anything prior to 50’s so would have to can of designate a tier

Orr is like Thor he’s from another realm

2-6 is Tier 2

I only saw Harvey cause he came back at 40 in 1968-69 and I was a yute

Pilotte & Horton I saw live a bunch and had their cards etc but there best days were before me

Gotta take a deep dive

No order
Chara
Park
Coffey
Stevens
Nedemayer
Pronger
Chelios
Howe
McInnis
Leetch
EK

I'd add Red Kelly to that list.

I’d take Robinson unbelievable combo skill winner leadership toughness - his beatdown of Dave Schultz is right there with Buster Douglas on Mike Tyson. National TV Sunday, Peter Puck, Dan Kelly - it was a brawl but it was the single biggest shift moment in hockey history to me. The Canadiens and their way of grace and beauty were bsck and those bullies from Philadelphia were never the same (full disclosure I loved those Flyers in a way but those pricks had it coming) we ever get to time travel it’s 1976 Montreal Forum - greatest brawl in history between everything you hate or love about hockey depending on your preference

After 6 it gets interesting

Obviously I’m not up on anything prior to 50’s so would have to can of designate a tier

Orr is like Thor he’s from another realm

2-6 is Tier 2

I only saw Harvey cause he came back at 40 in 1968-69 and I was a yute

Pilotte & Horton I saw live a bunch and had their cards etc but there best days were before me

Gotta take a deep dive

No order
Chara
Park
Coffey
Stevens
Nedemayer
Pronger
Chelios
Howe
McInnis
Leetch
EK

I'd add Red Kelly to that list.

 

[DKH]

Yeah Robinson was great can’t believe you have him above half those guys. But hockey is your eighth sport so I get it.

I’m focused on 3 sports these days - baseball, football and my third sport hockey

Although I could name the 76ers and Bulls and Knicks lineups of the 1970’s, know the difference between the Van Arsdsle twins these days I couldn’t name a player on every team - although I could name all the Celtics - I only watch them

Larry Robinson I remember him coming up and the Habs fans were brutal on him early on but he blossomed into a star. Chara maybe best defensive defenseman and most intimidating but Robinson to me was an entire level or rung above him. And he was tough and intimidating if you were crazy enough to bother with him.

Park had bad timing and knees otherwise he would be in that tier below Orr

But Robinson, Potvin, and Lidstrom were synonymous with their teams and all a bit different but they are the best and slot in after Bourque and likely Harvey

I was fortunate to see them all so many times other than Harvey - but no one stood out every game as the most talented player as Orr- it took 5 minutes for a first time viewer to see someone that dominant

McDavid is closest- but he’s a forward and Orr controlled the puck more easily - and there was a wider skating discrepancy between Orr & his peers

 

[smithformeragent]

 

[DKH]

My Mount Rushmore D of post expansion hockey is Bourque, Potvin, Robinson, and Lidstrom

Orr gets Mount Everest (if you go to museum of science check out the film in Mugar theatre- unreal)

I love how people say players 50 years ago couldn’t play today - a 22 year old Rangers Brad Park would be number 1 defenseman on New York not Adam Fox

 

[smithformeragent]

 

[DKH]

Bourque got screwed here- they didn’t give him enough and when they had it if the player was a bit enjoyable’ and hung with Cam’s binkies Ray & Cam they were sent to his BF Glen Sather in Siberia aka Edmonton or another place they couldn’t do damage

Sinden positive ledger was long and glowing but his negative side showed vindictiveness and cheap- and overreact at times (hello Tom Fergus trade)

He was a genius as a coach and the players respected him and overall liked him especially early on - him leaving was brutal

There is no way they lose in 1971 if he’s there

Also the greatest collection of bad trades took place at that time - the Bruins were sitting with the most powerful team in the league and a top farm system that was so good they could have recovered taking mediocre Barry Gibbs over Brad Park first in the 1967 draft - and passing 3 times on Bobby Clarke in round 1 of the 1969

Oh if only this place was around 35 years earlier