Is placing an expansion team in Beijing possible? (Mod Note Post #32)

[LadyStanley]

Mirtle: Why the NBA's issues in China could soon become the...
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Asked in recent days by The Athletic if the NHL had rethought that stance, in light of the recent firestorm involving the NBA, Daly said no.

Not yet, anyway.

“We are obviously monitoring with interest,” Daly said. “But, no, there has been no thought given to changing course at this point in time.”

NHL gets a pittance of league revenue from international, including China, so wouldn't take as bit a hit should they walk away. But they've committed to future pre/early season games.

And China's emphasis on winter sports, a growing middle class has expanded opportunities for new ice rinks around the country.

What those folks see there is fertile ground for something unexpected: China becoming capable of producing pro-level hockey players and making an impact in the international game, perhaps even in the medium term.

Chinese kids moving to Canada and joining CHL, etc.

Definitely a different slant on development of hockey in the country. (Still the political issues that fill the airways as well.)

 

[GuelphStormer]

Per Alexa, it's 12:30 Beijing-San Jose and 11:30 Beijing-Seattle. YMMV (Polar route for the win )


While most (intercontinental) NHL charters are very nice, they don't have a huge amount of room for guys to get up and move during a long flight. When the Sharks flew to Europe, they chartered a (small) 747 for the team (ended up using their same charter company, just upgraded to the larger bird). Even going the polar route, it's an 11 hour+ flight from San Jose to Berlin. (6 years ago, I took a non-stop 16:30 flight from Atlanta to Johannesburg, South Africa. Fortunately, mom upgraded us to the cocoon, so we had seats that adjusted to flat for sleeping.

On top of that, players have to deal with jet lag (7pm Beijing time = 4am PT/7am ET) unless the game is played in the afternoon (and players deal with it like a late North American game?). ("They say" that you need 1 day per time zone change to adjust circadian rhythms. Yes, you can do some things to counteract jet lag, but teams would have to adjust to go and then adjust back on return.)


That doesn't even factor in the logistics of scheduling (and giving teams 3+ days either side of games for travel), nor scheduling officials to work the games.

I don't understand why you are even arguing the logistics of this, LS. By doing so, you are lending credibility to an offensive partnership with a brutal regime.

 

[LadyStanley]

Nope, @GuelphStormer. Just proving that there are closer teams than LA.

A few preseason games per decade, the BOG might be able to stomach in the current political environment. However, I don't know if the players would be satisfied with skipping another Olympics for political reasons.

But as for a permanent team/division, I don't think there's much interest (and shrinking with every negative headline) for the BOG to proceed.

 

[HugoSimon]

They moved in the practice facility full time only because 2510 looked absolutely pathetic in the big building. It remains a pathetic number though, in fact lower than the DEL2 (German second league) average. And these German teams come from towns like Kaufbeuren, not Beijing with over 20 million people.

There is a radical difference in value between an American Major league sports franchises and the KHL.

The ECHL out performs the KHL from time to time.

 

[Albatros]

Yes and no, last year the order in attendance was:

NHL (17,414)
NLA (6,833)
DEL (6,267)
KHL (6,234)
AHL (5,817)
SHL (5,669)
...
ECHL (4,323)

So the AHL does come close, but the ECHL is closer to lesser European leagues. In China no league would do particularly well.

 

[vorky]

Yes and no, last year the order in attendance was:

NHL (17,414)
NLA (6,833)
DEL (6,267)
KHL (6,234)
AHL (5,817)
SHL (5,669)
...
ECHL (4,323)

So the AHL does come close, but the ECHL is closer to lesser European leagues. In China no league would do particularly well.

If you mean by "last year" the 2018/2019 season, your numbers and order for European leagues are wrong.

regular seson 2018/2019
NLA, 6949
KHL, 6392
DEL, 6215
SHL, 5827
CZ, 5401
Liiga, 4232

This season the NLA is around 6900 and the KHL is around 6700.

 

[Albatros]

I mean the year before, for the most recent season I don't have reliable numbers for all leagues. There's no significant change, however.

 

[vorky]

I mean the year before, for the most recent season I don't have reliable numbers for all leagues. There's no significant change, however.

Then fine. You meant another season than myself. That is ok. I would just want to point out that the IIHF does not use correct data for the KHL attendance. They almost always show lower attendance for the KHL than it is actually is.

 

[HugoSimon]

Yes and no, last year the order in attendance was:

NHL (17,414)
NLA (6,833)
DEL (6,267)
KHL (6,234)
AHL (5,817)
SHL (5,669)
...
ECHL (4,323)

So the AHL does come close, but the ECHL is closer to lesser European leagues. In China no league would do particularly well.

>The ECHL out performs the KHL from time to time.


Note from time to time.

My point wasn't that they were directly comparable just that they shouldn't be remotely comparable.

In either scenario it is no surprise that Chinese people aren't jumping at the Russian league.

It isn't whether or not the Chinese like hockey but if they like American media.

 

[Albatros]

>The ECHL out performs the KHL from time to time.

Note from time to time.

My point wasn't that they were directly comparable just that they shouldn't be remotely comparable.

Not as a league, there are two ECHL franchises that reach the KHL average and that's good for them. But there's also the other end of the spectrum that is even worse than KHL in China meaning empty old barns.

 

[Jumptheshark]

can not believe this is being discussed in a serious form in any way shape or form

most of you guys are just seeing the population and thinking--oh they will love hockey

I am willing to bet there are more serious fans here in the UK than in China (this excludes any expat living in China)

Went to a few Red star games last year that it was like a Ghost town in that arena

The biggest issus facing a team would be how to make money--wages in China are very low and 99% of the population would not be able to afford to go to the game

 

[WildGopher]

'Think of your family': China threatens European citizens over Xinjiang protests

We must respect the CCP.

Yeah, there are bigger issues here than markets, or money, or potential new fans. We teach kids in hockey about respect - for the game, for opponents, for your coach, for the fans. I don't want a message sent to anyone that it's OK to deal for money or markets and ignore the reality of what's happening to a lot of people there. Hockey's a great sport, and it's great that it's been expanding. But read the article above, and you have to say it's not THAT important.

 

[mouser]

I think we can safely close this.