Is OV a playoff choker?

[Varan]

I was talking about this with some friends and decided to discuss here:

Let's compare his game 7 stats to Crosby and Malkin because these 3 are the 3 best players of their generation:

Ovechkin: 6 points in 10 game 7s (0.6 PPG)
Crosby: 5 points in 7 game 7s (0.71 PPG)
Malkin: 6 points in 7 game 7s (0.86 PPG)
Let's look at their points in potential elimination games (where only they could be eliminated)
Malkin: 14 points in 17 career elimination games (0.82 PPG)
Ovechkin: 20 points in 21 career elimination games (0.95 PPG)
Crosby: 14 points in 17 career elimination games (0.82 PPG)
All three of their stats are very comparable, the only difference is that 2 of the three superstars are on one team. Is he a choker? Or does he not get enough help?

I'd say he is not, however, for a player possessing his talent, he definitely needs to get it done.

Click to read more...

 

[puckIuck]

He cares more about international competitions than the cup. It was a mistake giving him the C

 

[Frank the Tank]

If there's ever been a topic beaten to death on HFBoards over the past decade, this is it.

 

[tacogeoff]

Its a team sport. It takes a team to win.

 

[crowi]

I've never considered him a choker. I think it's a bit unfair to label him as such.
It's not his fault Caps just can't seem to get it done.

 

[Varan]

If there's ever been a topic beaten to death on HFBoards over the past decade, this is it.

i'd say the "who is generational" topic

 

[winnipegger]

Yes if Ovechkin had .1 PPG more in game 7's Washington would have won a cup.

/s

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Not a choker but it's def lacking on his resume in contrast to his regular season play.

 

[Fatty McLardy]

he definitely chocked last year, that's for sure. Guy was a liability in a D-zone in game 7 last year..

 

[Hischier and Hughes]

He can choke his way into the dirty jerz if he wants, Hischier would love setting him up.

Sorry Hall but meet the second line!

 

[ESH]

In 2009 when the Capitals lost against the Penguins in the 2nd round, Ovechkin had 14 points in 7 games. The most of any player in that series.

In 2016 when the Capitals lost against the Penguins in the 2nd round, Ovechkin had 8 points. Again, the most of any player in that series.

There’s only so much that one single player can do, and if leading the series in scoring isn’t enough to convince people that it’s not his fault his team didn’t advance then I’m not sure what is.

 

[Beau Knows]

No, he's been good to very good most of the time.

I don't really see how those stats prove that though. Only games where you can be eliminated are important games? What about games where you can win a series? What about game 3 in a series where you're down 2 games to none, facing a 3-0 deficit - surely that is a huge moment to have a great game? I personally don't put much stock in these type of numbers. What matters to me are the overall numbers, and Ovechkin's playoff numbers over the years are excellent: 90 points in 97 games.

 

[Fantomas]

A little bit. He needs to prove 'em or else this will haunt him forever. Still has time to do so.

 

[983 others]

No, see the excuse is that it’s a team game unless the Caps actually win a cup, then he gets credit for it.

 

[hockeykicker]

omg for the one hundred billionth time
take 2015-16 for example: (56-18-0-8) regular season record and then

this is the answer:
Washington Capitals 2015-16 roster and scoring statistics at hockeydb.com

how can you win if the rest of your team does this
ovechkin 12 games and 12 points
carlson 12 games and 12 points
backstrom 12 games and 11 points
oshie 12 games and 10 points
williams 12 games and 7 points
johansson 12 games 7 points

then the wtf begins
beagle 3 points in 12 games
niskanen 3 points in 12 games
kuznetsov 2 points in 12 games
alzner 2 points in 12 games
chimera 2 points in 12 games
schmidt 1 point in 10 games

hold on we arent done yet
orlov 1 point in 11 games
wilson 1 point in 12 games
burakovsky 1 point in 12 games
winnik 0 points in 12 games
richards 0 points in 12 games
chorney 1 point in 7 games
orpik 0 points in 6 games

so lets see 6 of 20 skaters had more then 3 points in 12 games and 3 of them were on one line

 

[Connor McConnor]

Ovi isn't a choker he just doesn't get help outside of Holtby

 

[Nick Hansen]

Backstrom needs more criticism.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

Ovechkin doesn't have trouble scoring in the playoffs, he has trouble playing at both ends of the rink. One shift, he's channeling Wayne Gretzky, the next shift, he's channeling Brent Gretzky. He's just not consistent throughout a full-60.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Every superstar has bad games, the primary difference between Ovechkin and guys like Crosby, Toews, Malkin, is that the other guys get the support of their teammates in big games. Do you think Ovechkin could ever win a Stanley Cup with 3 goals and 11 assists in 23 games? Or 6 goals and 13 assists in 24 games, or 6 goals and 12 assists in 23 games?

Fun fact: Ovechkin's 11 goals and 10 assists in 14 games in 08-09 are more goals and more points than Crosby and Malkin in their 2016 Cup win where Crosby won a Conn Smythe, more goals and more points than both Kane and Toews in their 2013 Cup win where Kane won a Conn Smythe, more than Kopitar in his 2012 Cup win, more goals and assists than Patrice Bergeron in his 2011 Cup win, and more goals and assists than Getzlaf in his 2007 Cup win.

His 11 goals and 10 assists in 14 games would be a career high in playoff goals and points for the following players:

Ryan Getzlaf
Patrice Bergeron
Steven Stamkos
Connor McDavid
Patrick Marleau
Tyler Seguin
Every single player in Washington Capitals history (except for John Druce, who had 14 goals and 3 assists in 15 games in 1990. Outside of Ovechkin's 21 points, the most points by a Washington Capital in the playoffs is 17.)

I only included guys who have made it to the SCF at least.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Ovechkin doesn't have trouble scoring in the playoffs, he has trouble playing at both ends of the rink. One shift, he's channeling Wayne Gretzky, the next shift, he's channeling Brent Gretzky. He's just not consistent throughout a full-60.

There’s only so much a left winger can do in the d-zone.

 

[Michael Farkas]

This may not necessarily be responsive to the OP, but...games and series are not won on averages or percentages or ratios...

Additionally, worth considering goals prevented (see: even a simple metric like Pythagorean's Expected Win% formula from a team perspective, if the desire is there to make tenths and hundredths valuable)

 

[Clode]

No. Next!

 

[The Grim Reaper]

There’s only so much a left winger can do in the d-zone.

It's not just his defensive play though. He'll have an amazing shift followed by 3-4 shitty ones. It's insane. Having read the Capitals board plenty of times in the past, I know many of their fans have also recognized this.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

[MOD]What that fact shows is that teams have won the Cup with production from their "clutch heroes" and top forwards that are lower than what Ovechkin produced in 2 rounds in 2009. It shows that those forwards, who have won Stanley Cups and are not considered chokers, were able to win Stanley Cups in seasons where their overall production over the course of 4 rounds was inferior to Ovechkin's in just two rounds.

 

[983 others]

Why has this all-time great never once elevated his play and lifted his team past the second round? Not even talking about winning the Stanley Cup, but just getting past the second round. Don't act like the Caps are getting blown out 8-0 every game and Ovechkin is completely helpless.