Is another bad season the best thing?

GoldiFox

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Apr 21, 2014
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Oh and then Eric has an 80 point season....hmmm, that sort of screws that logic. The best time to resign Eric, if that is the organization's intention is right now, based on his current level of performance and the Front Office's experts' opinion of where that performance is heading. Best thing in the world would be to sign him to a limited NMC contract for 4 years for $26-$30 million....hopefully at the lower end of the range.....and don't think he wouldn't get $7-$8 million per on the open market.

Spezza was older, less productive, and generally regarded as a 2C and got $7.5 million. Statsny was younger but had injury concerns, was generally regarded as a 2C and got $7 million.

I think there is zero chance that Eric gets less than $8 million on a shorter term deal. I see little reason he takes a hometown discount. He would get $8-9 million from Toronto in a heartbeat.

I think the Canes would be lucky to sign him for under 8x5. More likely to be (8.5-9)x5. On a longer term maybe 7x8.
 

RodTheBawd

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Oct 16, 2013
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Spezza was older, less productive, and generally regarded as a 2C and got $7.5 million. Statsny was younger but had injury concerns, was generally regarded as a 2C and got $7 million.

I think there is zero chance that Eric gets less than $8 million on a shorter term deal. I see little reason he takes a hometown discount. He would get $8-9 million from Toronto in a heartbeat.

I think the Canes would be lucky to sign him for under 8x5. More likely to be (8.5-9)x5. On a longer term maybe 7x8.

The hometown discount is code named Jordan

I think people are underestimating that aspect. Eric doesn't have anything left to prove to anyone, he's made it clear he wants to be part of the rebuild (granted, no one in his position would say otherwise), and I can't see him jumping ship after getting Jordan down here. I'm leaning towards Eric retiring as a Cane. Small chance he's a rental next season, but either way pretty solid chance he re-signs at a discount.
 

DaveG

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Wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see Eric sign an extension at a bit of a discount that takes him up to being a UFA the same year as Jordan.
 

GoldiFox

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Apr 21, 2014
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I agree he wants to stay in Carolina with Jordan but I don't think the Canes even ask him to take a discount. Eric holds the cards, he is the face of the franchise in a casual market. The Canes are a much worse team without him. Imagine the casual or FB response if they let him walk. Jordan being signed long-term may be a bigger plus on his side than the Canes. This is the "Staal team".

I just think there is a reason that no franchise Canes player has ever taken a hometown discount and I don't think it is JR. Face-of-the-franchise players have a lot of power.

I think he gets locked up for 7-8 years at a minimum of 7 per. I'd be absolutely shocked if it came in lower than that. Better to plan conservatively than bank on a $5-6 million per extension.
 

Swag Surf Aho

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I agree he wants to stay in Carolina with Jordan but I don't think the Canes even ask him to take a discount. Eric holds the cards, he is the face of the franchise in a casual market. The Canes are a much worse team without him. Imagine the casual or FB response if they let him walk. Jordan being signed long-term may be a bigger plus on his side than the Canes. This is the "Staal team".

I just think there is a reason that no franchise Canes player has ever taken a hometown discount and I don't think it is JR. Face-of-the-franchise players have a lot of power.

I think he gets locked up for 7-8 years at a minimum of 7 per. I'd be absolutely shocked if it came in lower than that. Better to plan conservatively than bank on a $5-6 million per extension.

How does Staal "hold all the cards"? He's a UFA that would haul plenty assets if we trade him. It would seem as if mgmt has more negotiation power since his brother came over to play here, not the other way around. However, we aren't obligated to keep him around since Marc hasn't come over yet...

Pitkanen took a hometown discount iirc that was $12 for 3 years because he enjoyed playing here. It's unfortunate what had happened to him because he was one of my favorites. I was at the game when he slid into the boards feet first. That was scary.

You might be right though with 7x7, which I would consider a discount for the face of our franchise.
 

GoldiFox

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How does Staal "hold all the cards"? He's a UFA that would haul plenty assets if we trade him. It would seem as if mgmt has more negotiation power since his brother came over to play here, not the other way around. However, we aren't obligated to keep him around since Marc hasn't come over yet...

Pitkanen took a hometown discount iirc that was $12 for 3 years because he enjoyed playing here. It's unfortunate what had happened to him because he was one of my favorites. I was at the game when he slid into the boards feet first. That was scary.

You might be right though with 7x7, which I would consider a discount for the face of our franchise.

From a pure team-building or common Free Agency standpoint I agre but it seems like a marketing nightmare to me. You propose another failed season followed by the team losing the face of it's franchise and best player. This comes after almost a decade of failure.

Maybe they could try to sell it as a new, exciting Era of Canes hockey focused on building through the Draft but I don't see that being too popular in Raleigh. Hardcore fans like the ones here may prefer the haul from a Staal trade and balk at a spending a ton of money on Staal (me included) but it could be a disaster for the support of casual fans.
 

Swag Surf Aho

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From a pure team-building or common Free Agency standpoint I agre but it seems like a marketing nightmare to me. You propose another failed season followed by the team losing the face of it's franchise and best player. This comes after almost a decade of failure.

Maybe they could try to sell it as a new, exciting Era of Canes hockey focused on building through the Draft but I don't see that being too popular in Raleigh. Hardcore fans like the ones here may prefer the haul from a Staal trade and balk at a spending a ton of money on Staal (me included) but it could be a disaster for the support of casual fans.

Then slap the "C" on Jordan and pretend like nothing happened. :sarcasm:
 

Big Daddy Cane

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Signing a 31 year old with declining production to a 7 year term at that high of a price point doesn't seem like a great idea.

Yup. I like E. Staal and would like to see him re-signed, but if his agent is looking for that kind of term, GMRF should trade him.

3 years would be the sweet spot, imo. Obviously, the Canes would be better protected from greater declines in production. For E. Staal, there are no guarantees that the ship gets righted in Carolina. A 3 year term would allow him the opportunity to get out if things don’t get better. Potentially more importantly, he would be eligible for one more sub-35 contract in July of 2019.

An extension like that is not without precedence. Joe Thornton signed a 3 year extension back in 2010 that took him through his age 32, 33 and 34 seasons. It's worth noting that he took a discount to stay in San Jose with that contract.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/hockey/nhl/sharks/2010-10-16-joe-thornton-extension_N.htm
 

Swag Surf Aho

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Whatever happens, I'll be in the same boat with Francis. He's been in the league and knows what it takes to win. If he wants to sign a declining Staal merely as a mentor, I'm okay with that. Eric said the same thing, that it's ultimately in Francis' hands, but that he would like to be a part of the new direction going forward.
 

Boom Boom Apathy

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Sep 6, 2006
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How does Staal "hold all the cards"? He's a UFA that would haul plenty assets if we trade him. It would seem as if mgmt has more negotiation power since his brother came over to play here, not the other way around. However, we aren't obligated to keep him around since Marc hasn't come over yet..

I disagree. He may not hold all the cards, but he has 3 of the 4 Aces for sure.

1) He has a NMC, so Canes can't trade him unless he agrees to it, so that haul of assets only occurs if he says so.
2) Whether we like it or not, he's been the best forward on the team for much of his career and the face of the franchise for a while. As fans, we can debate how much the Canes really need him (or don't need him), but warts and all, there's no doubt in my mind they need him more than he needs them.
3) He's in better financial shape than the Hurricanes are :laugh:
4) Unless he has an absolute abysmal performance this coming season, there will likely be many suitors lined up to try and sign him, even at 31 YO.
5) The coach and GM have already said they want to re-sign him, so they've put that on the table.

About the only cards the Canes hold is the one mentioned already. He has a brother on the team and wanted to play with Jordan.

Ideally, I wouldn't want to sign him to a really long deal, unless it was a de-escalating type without a NTC.
 

NotOpie

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If Eric signs a shorter term deal it is likely for a substantially higher dollar value and with a limited NMC (list of 8 teams, etc.). So maybe somethng like 3 years, $23 million (8,7.5,7.5) and that even feels like a bit of a hometown discount.

If the Canes offered a little longer term, say 4 or 5 years, then they could likely include a less restricted NTC for the first 2 or 3 years of the deal and get away with less $$$ per year. That might look like 5 years for $35 million (7.5, 7.5, 7, 6.5, 6.5). That feels like an even more significant discount.

If the Hurricanes went for the "we'll take you to the end of Jordan's contract", again offering a less restrictive NTC, the deal could be structured with more real money up front, but a much lower overall cap hit. Let's say something like a 7 years @ $46 million (9, 8, 7.5, 6.5, 5, 5, 5). In that case it certainly is a hometown discount, but Eric would be getting significant term. He certainly would view this as an opportunity to retire as a Cane. And if things didn't work out as planned in Raleigh, his NTC goes away after year 3 or 4 of the deal and he becomes trade bait with a contract that is a modest cap hit and even less in real money terms.

Still don't know if he'd do it as there are about 4 to 6 teams off the top of my head that would come a courtin' if Eric hit the free agent market.
 

What the Faulk

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May 30, 2005
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As much as I think he's not getting Ovechkin money, I do think there's no way he's anything less than the highest paid player on the team throughout his time here. For me, that means I can't see his salary dipping below $7 million, ever, even when Semin moves on. The only way around this is for him to sign a super long deal, and I don't think that's going to happen for multiple reasons.
 

Chan790

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To be fair he is a much, much better player than Jordan.

I'd concede that...but he's also older and much less integral to our rebuild and core going forward. Giving Eric a big deal takes away assets and flexibility needed to go get the pieces to fix this team for the long-haul.

If he's serious about wanting to be here through the rebuild...part of that is not maximizing his paycheck. Taking less means a faster turnaround and a better supporting cast for himself. It's as simple as he can get $8m-per here or he can win here...but probably not both in the short or medium term.

Edit: That said, if I'm Staal...I only agree to take a haircut on pay if the Canes FO agrees to invest the money into the team around him...not Pete's pocket.
 
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NotOpie

"Puck don't lie"
Jun 12, 2006
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I think a guy like Eric Staal can play into his mid-30s and play well. I have no problem giving him a 5 year deal if it means he takes less money. As far as him being the highest paid player on the team throughout his next contract, I just don't see it. I think he'd be far more interested in front-loading the money (assuming he as 2 or 3 years of a NMC) and certainly that might be the case if we went longer in term. In the end I believe (for no reason other than I do) he wants that 2nd Cup. And I think he's the type of guy who will do what it takes.....first trying to get there with his Hurricanes team, but in the end, prior to retirement, any way he can.
 

RodTheBawd

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Oct 16, 2013
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I'd concede that...but he's also older and much less integral to our rebuild and core going forward. Giving Eric a big deal takes away assets and flexibility needed to go get the pieces to fix this team for the long-haul.

If he's serious about wanting to be here through the rebuild...part of that is not maximizing his paycheck. Taking less means a faster turnaround and a better supporting cast for himself. It's as simple as he can get $8m-per here or he can win here...but probably not both in the short or medium term.

Edit: That said, if I'm Staal...I only agree to take a haircut on pay if the Canes FO agrees to invest the money into the team around him...not Pete's pocket.

This post pretty much sums it all up.
 

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