News Article: "IF our team is competitive" (2015 onward talk)

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

With all due respect I have no idea how you can say that. Do you know what the Oilers need right now?

Nelson deserves a chance. Its possible that the Oilers may have had a diamond sitting at their feet the whole time and never bothered to give it a look.

I know its fashionable to complain about coaching in Edmonton, but how about we wait until Nelson actually does something worth complaining about before we throw him out with the bathwater.

Its my humble opinion that he's accomplished more in a month than any other coach we've had since Renney.

Give him a chance GK.

The Oilers need experience everywhere. The lack of experience has absolutely killed this team in every regard. I agree Nelson should be given a chance, but either make him an assistant (like Eakins should have been) or let him get picked up by another team.

 

[harpoon]

The Oilers need experience everywhere. The lack of experience has absolutely killed this team in every regard. I agree Nelson should be given a chance, but either make him an assistant (like Eakins should have been) or let him get picked up by another team.

And what great coach are we going to get to lead the team instead? Nobody good is ever going to come to this gong show.

Nelson has experience. More than ten years as a coach starting in USL and including stints as Thrashers (NHL) assistant coach, Griffins and Wolves (AHL) assistant coach, and OKC (AHL) head coach.

More to the point he is not an OB. He came from another organization and has earned every step he made in his coaching career by providing wins and championships. This in contrast to say Buchbergerwho holds down a job because of his personal relationship with the boss.

I'm far from totally convinced, but I think this guy could be a winner ....

 

[Tarus]

those who supported Arco were not apologists but were just trying to give the guy a little support since he was the center we were going with. Most arguments centered around Gagner vs Arco, so I don't see the issue there since Gagner would have fared no better than Arco based on his previous time here. He's doing a bit better in Arizona, but that team has better defensive support and lacks some puck skills that Gagner brings. We have a lot of Gagner, ie good puck skills but not much ability away from the puck.

So yeah I was an Arco supporter, but I have no problem with anything I wrote in the least. I wanted a veteran center for more certainty. Arco was a risk considering he needed to improve his offense for him to be useful to us, and that risk flubbed. There are other risks that did pan out. I suppose you are a skeptic and so you must have hated everything about the Pouliot contract, and yet today it is the 'apologists' that are right about that one. In truth, your choice of the word 'apologist' exposes your bias.

I think someone protests too much, a quick glance back confirms a few reasons why that might be

Relax though, it was a hasty post on my part due to a busy afternoon and came off harsher than I intended. Was shooting for more for genuine sympathy for the apologists, rather than "haha, look at those idiots". Optimists is actually probably more of a suitable word than apologists, but the first thing that came to mind was how polarized these forums get in the summer months.

Wouldn't be too quick to declare victory in the Pouliot contract either. It's still very early, and this is the Oilers after all - they have a way of making sure things end badly

 

[I am the Liquor]

I don't doubt that Nelson can be a good coach, he's just simply not what the Oilers need right now.

You're right for once. All their wins are gonna cost us McDavid.

 

[I am the Liquor]

I think someone protests too much, a quick glance back confirms a few reasons why that might be

Relax though, it was a hasty post on my part due to a busy afternoon and came off harsher than I intended. Was shooting for more for genuine sympathy for the apologists, rather than "haha, look at those idiots". Optimists is actually probably more of a suitable word than apologists, but the first thing that came to mind was how polarized these forums get in the summer months.

Wouldn't be too quick to declare victory in the Pouliot contract either. It's still very early, and this is the Oilers after all - they have a way of making sure things end badly

Optipologists?

 

[McShogun99]

I'm fine going with Nelson next season unless a coach like Babcock, Tippet or Hitchcock become available.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

You're right for once. All their wins are gonna cost us McDavid.

The Oilers overall incompetence will even things out.

The Caps let off the gas last game otherwise the score could've been pretty lopsided.

 

[Approved Variety]

I'm fine going with Nelson next season unless a coach like Babcock, Tippet or Hitchcock become available.

Nelson needs to be MacT's backup plan. If he absolutely can not sign a high-profile coach, then Nelson stays on.

But knowing MacT, he's going to be relieved that Nelson turned out decent, and not bother trying to get a seasoned veteran coach into this city. He strikes me as lazy, and I should know - I am too. I get the feeling that if he doesn't have to go out and do the extra work, he won't, so if he thinks Nelson is fine...he'll just leave it at that and spend more time on his putting.

 

[Oilers10]

I think going into next year, what this team needs is to pair Todd Nelson with an associate coach and by george it should be Craig MacTavish's job to go out and find this associate coach!

 

[Mr Positive]

I think someone protests too much, a quick glance back confirms a few reasons why that might be

Relax though, it was a hasty post on my part due to a busy afternoon and came off harsher than I intended. Was shooting for more for genuine sympathy for the apologists, rather than "haha, look at those idiots". Optimists is actually probably more of a suitable word than apologists, but the first thing that came to mind was how polarized these forums get in the summer months.

Wouldn't be too quick to declare victory in the Pouliot contract either. It's still very early, and this is the Oilers after all - they have a way of making sure things end badly

no prob, it's just that it seems a lot of time there's been resurrecting threads in order to claim ownage and it's irksome. I will definitely say that the negative nancies have generally correct on most things, the most important things, although I think we have a gem in Pouliot. I stood up for Gagner, and I was wrong. I stood up for Arco and I was wrong. I stood up for Eakins and I was wrong. And now I'm standing up for MacT (I think he's okay as GM though)

 

[MarkGio]

"said". I don't think he tried very hard when Jokinen signed for 2.5 x 1 and Legwand signed for 2.5 and 3.5 x 2.

I don't think he is planning for a tank, but he is very much prepared to have another bad season. I think he still has a list of untouchable assets that reaches double digits, and will not trade any until next year. He is more than comfortable waiting for Draisaitl and Nurse to fill the roster.

Or, on the other, I could be completely wrong, and he's just waiting to see if Klefbom can replace Petry, then trade Petry+ for a C, which would possibly qualify as bold.

I agree. There was a lot Centremen available this past off season. Jokinen, Roy, Legwand, B.Richards, Grabovski, Boyle, Statsny, Bolland, Ott, Morrow, and to a lesser extent Goc, Byron, and Conacher

Maybe tanking was in fact the plan?

 

[Aerchon]

I agree. There was a lot Centremen available this past off season. Jokinen, Roy, Legwand, B.Richards, Grabovski, Boyle, Statsny, Bolland, Ott, Morrow, and to a lesser extent Goc, Byron, and Conacher

Maybe tanking was in fact the plan?

The way they handled the center situation and the way they insisted on sending Marcincin down for guys like Hunt, Aulie, and even Klefbom to a lesser extent makes me think this way as well.

Arco statistically is a very solid forward and was one of the few consistent players on this team. Traded to Nashville (tops in the league?) and then picked up by Pittsburgh (right up there). Getting rid of him seems to have improved us but I don't think that was the intent. Trading away our third best scorer at the time for a guy with one goal is curious indeed.

Then we trade Perron who is a great asset and also one of our most consistent.

The way they play Schultz no matter how hard he struggles.

Not naming a permanent replacement coach or even interviewing for one.

Keeping Eakins a full year past his best before date...

I don't know if I really believe they intentionally tanked but there certainly seems to be some solid basis for that line of thinking.

 

[Mc5RingsAndABeer]

I don't think they intentionally tanked. They failed at their jobs in the summer and then told themselves it would be OK even though it was obvious it wouldn't. Then the oilers were terrible and they threw in the towel

 

[MarkGio]

The way they handled the center situation and the way they insisted on sending Marcincin down for guys like Hunt, Aulie, and even Klefbom to a lesser extent makes me think this way as well.

Arco statistically is a very solid forward and was one of the few consistent players on this team. Traded to Nashville (tops in the league?) and then picked up by Pittsburgh (right up there). Getting rid of him seems to have improved us but I don't think that was the intent. Trading away our third best scorer at the time for a guy with one goal is curious indeed.

Then we trade Perron who is a great asset and also one of our most consistent.

The way they play Schultz no matter how hard he struggles.

Not naming a permanent replacement coach or even interviewing for one.

Keeping Eakins a full year past his best before date...

I don't know if I really believe they intentionally tanked but there certainly seems to be some solid basis for that line of thinking.

They knew Eakins was garbage going into the season. And the very instance they fire him (and potentially improve), Perron gets traded and Arco gets swapped for Roy.

 

[Faelko]

I agree. There was a lot Centremen available this past off season. Jokinen, Roy, Legwand, B.Richards, Grabovski, Boyle, Statsny, Bolland, Ott, Morrow, and to a lesser extent Goc, Byron, and Conacher

Maybe tanking was in fact the plan?

How many of those C's would honestly sign here. Most want to win, not come rebuild.

And "lesser extent", those guys are just more of what we have.

 

[MarkGio]

How many of those C's would honestly sign here. Most want to win, not come rebuild.

And "lesser extent", those guys are just more of what we have.

Some of those guys were only making 1 or 2 million. Hell, the Oilers could've handed out 4.5 million to replace Gagne and not take on the Purcell contract.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

How many of those C's would honestly sign here. Most want to win, not come rebuild.

And "lesser extent", those guys are just more of what we have.

Maybe not many would have signed here, but it's still better than trading Gagner away and replacing him with nothing.

If the Oilers had traded Gagner away and replaced him with Roy, I doubt many of us would have complained too much.

They left Drai out to... well, dry. And it took them months to make the right decision.

 

[Up the Irons]

The way they handled the center situation and the way they insisted on sending Marcincin down for guys like Hunt, Aulie, and even Klefbom to a lesser extent makes me think this way as well.

Arco statistically is a very solid forward and was one of the few consistent players on this team. Traded to Nashville (tops in the league?) and then picked up by Pittsburgh (right up there). Getting rid of him seems to have improved us but I don't think that was the intent. Trading away our third best scorer at the time for a guy with one goal is curious indeed.

Then we trade Perron who is a great asset and also one of our most consistent.

The way they play Schultz no matter how hard he struggles.

Not naming a permanent replacement coach or even interviewing for one.

Keeping Eakins a full year past his best before date...

I don't know if I really believe they intentionally tanked but there certainly seems to be some solid basis for that line of thinking.

They certainly allow the bleeding to continue a lot longer then seems necessary.

Eakins was kept out of ... Stubbornness and pride.

The C situation was .... Just plain dumb.

The are not here by design, with the exception of overplaying Schulz, knowing he isn't ready for top pairing minutes, but think this will get him there sooner.

 

[Throttlehead]

PP is still a mess. Last game Nikitin scored on a PP bomb.. and then I don't recall him getting much PP time in the third, despite the fact that bombs from the point are an effective strategy.

Defensive coverage, while I don't expect it to be airtight is still very sloppy. Ovechkin could've had a few more goals last game with how wide open they were leaving him. Not to mention two more goals off deflections right in front of the goalie with no one taking the man. The Blues or Hawks would've made mincemeat of that porous defensive coverage.

Lack of accountability. The top line has been dreadful (and was against the Caps) but they continue to be spoonfed minutes whereas hard workers are shunned. Nikitin and Schultz are still dreadful and will always be given a large amount of minutes.

Not even trying to stand up for each other. The Oilers will never be a goony team (like say the Blues) but there were a number of occasions during the road trip where individual players were ganged up on or were dragged into a scrum without the help of any teammate. Last game the Caps delivered a few questionable hits and nobody so much as even spoke to one of the Caps. In the game against the Blues Pouliot was ganged up on as time expired and again the Oilers did nothing about it.

The team visually looks better but they're still making a lot of the same errors that they made under Eakins. The only real difference is that they're trying harder. And while that's great, that's not enough to warrant keeping Nelson around after the season is done.

The power play has been better since Nelson took over, Nikitin played every power play in the 3rd period and didn’t get one bomb off.

Alex Ovechkin has made a living off the PP in the NHL, he has been top dog in PP goals for over 1/2 his career, or always close for entire career. There is no shame in Ovechkin scoring a few power play goals, and quite honestly one of those was very stoppable since it was above the circle, but hey its only a 100+ MPH one timer. If you want to blame that on a inexperienced Todd Nelson, I assume you are also going to blame experienced Capuano and experienced McLellan, because he did the same thing to those teams and coaches this year. Ovi has done it to many teams in the past. Its always easy to say something like “Ovechkin could’ve”, well there are a whole bunch of could’ve in a game, in reality it didn’t happen. Its kind of funny you would try and discredit Nelson over the Caps game, in previous years after being 2 down that early in the game, it was game-set-match, over and done. He has this team believing they actually can come back now, complaining about wins is, well just complaining. The Backstrom deflection was a very good play, sometimes you just get beat by a better play, I don’t see anyone at fault for that.

Ah, the old lack of accountability routine. The top line while being dreadful in your opinion still are the top players and the best players on the team, and are top 3 in scoring. I’m not sure you can call it “spoon-fed” minutes when its against other top lines. With the way this team and players were destroyed under Eakins, its going to take some time to build most of these guys back up, they are all at career lows, sitting them out or benching them at this point is not going to help. I also don’t think they have been that dreadful. You now say Nikitin is dreadful but previous paragraph you were asking for more PP time for him, make up your mind. Its obvious when you get that many PP Nikitin and Schultz will get that ice. I also prefer Nikitin to be gone, but it is what it is.

You are not going to change the DNA of the team over night, and it was painfully obvious that there was a huge divide in that room and still is. For example,I don’t understand why guys like Fasth go out of their way to rip on Yakupov on TV for making a mistake. Does anyone think Yalupov didn’t know he made a mistake? If you want to say something like that, save it for the room. There are many examples of this kind of crap, so I can see why they still aren’t fighting for each other, along with the makeup of team. I really don’t know how you blame a coach that has coached these guys 12 games so far.

Ok, enough of the visually, the joke was good for a few days. The team has looked better under Nelson because they are better, and so is the record. There is no question they are playing harder under him, they actually look like a real team again. The best quality a coach can have is getting his players to play hard, so far that is happening.

I see in a later post you said the Caps took their foot off the gas, that would be the reason the Oilers won. So is that loss on the feet of super experienced coach Barry Trotz?

 

[Tyrolean]

The power play has been better since Nelson took over, Nikitin played every power play in the 3rd period and didn’t get one bomb off.

Alex Ovechkin has made a living off the PP in the NHL, he has been top dog in PP goals for over 1/2 his career, or always close for entire career. There is no shame in Ovechkin scoring a few power play goals, and quite honestly one of those was very stoppable since it was above the circle, but hey its only a 100+ MPH one timer. If you want to blame that on a inexperienced Toff Nelson, I assume you are also going to blame experienced Capuano and experienced McLellan, because he did the same thing to those teams and coaches this year. Ovi has done it to many teams in the past. Its always easy to say something like “Ovechkin could’veâ€, well there are a whole bunch of could’ve in a game, in reality it didn’t happen. Its kind of funny you would try and discredit Nelson over the Caps game, in previous years after being 2 down that early in the game, it was game-set-match, over and done. He has this team believing they actually can come back now, complaining about wins is, well just complaining. The Backstrom deflection was a very good play, sometimes you just get beat by a better play, I don’t see anyone at fault for that.

Ah, the old lack of accountability routine. The top line while being dreadful in your opinion still are the top players and the best players on the team, and are top 3 in scoring. I’m not sure you can call it “spoon-fed†minutes when its against other top lines. With the way this team and players were destroyed under Eakins, its going to take some time to build most of these guys back up, they are all at career lows, sitting them out or benching them at this point is not going to help. I also don’t think they have been that dreadful. You now say Nikitin is dreadful but previous paragraph you were asking for more PP time for him, make up your mind. Its obvious when you get that many PP Nikitin and Schultz will get that ice. I also prefer Nikitin to be gone, but it is what it is.

You are not going to change the DNA of the team over night, and it was painfully obvious that there was a huge divide in that room and still is. For example,I don’t understand why guys like Fasth go out of their way to rip on Yakupov on TV for making a mistake. Does anyone think Yalupov didn’t know he made a mistake? If you want to say something like that, save it for the room. There are many examples of this kind of crap, so I can see why they still aren’t fighting for each other, along with the makeup of team. I really don’t know how you blame a coach that has coached these guys 12 games so far.

Ok, enough of the visually, the joke was good for a few days. The team has looked better under Nelson because they are better, and so is the record. There is no question they are playing harder under him, they actually look like a real team again. The best quality a coach can have is getting his players to play hard, so far that is happening.

I see in a later post you said the Caps took their foot off the gas, that would be the reason the Oilers won. So is that loss on the feet of super experienced coach Barry Trotz?

Often teams respond for a short time after a coaching change. I'd reserve judgement on Nelson until there is more of a sample size. having said that, the team has improved, but they are still a long ways from being a contender. Critical gutsy player movements still have to be made and I am in doubt this organization can do it.

 

[Throttlehead]

Often teams respond for a short time after a coaching change. I'd reserve judgement on Nelson until there is more of a sample size. having said that, the team has improved, but they are still a long ways from being a contender. Critical gutsy player movements still have to be made and I am in doubt this organization can do it.

I agree with that. I think what Keith was saying is Nelson can't be a good coach because he doesn't have NHL experience, or that we need a coach with NHL experience instead of Nelson. I am not seeing any big deficiencies in his coaching, in fact the opposite. I didn't expect him to turn the team into a contender this year, hopefully he builds the players back up and moves forward.

 

[McShogun99]

Often teams respond for a short time after a coaching change. I'd reserve judgement on Nelson until there is more of a sample size. having said that, the team has improved, but they are still a long ways from being a contender. Critical gutsy player movements still have to be made and I am in doubt this organization can do it.

They didn't respond positively after Eakins replaced Kruger...

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I agree with that. I think what Keith was saying is Nelson can't be a good coach because he doesn't have NHL experience, or that we need a coach with NHL experience instead of Nelson. I am not seeing any big deficiencies in his coaching, in fact the opposite. I didn't expect him to turn the team into a contender this year, hopefully he builds the players back up and moves forward.

I'm not saying he CAN'T be a good coach, he's just not the one the Oilers need.

Think of when the Blackhawks became the elite team they are today. They fired Savard and brought in Quenville and the rest is history. The Kings brought in Sutter and he elevated them to elite status.

Now the Oilers are nowhere near as good as either of those two teams before they became elite, but that winning experience helped those teams tremendously. The Oilers aren't in a position to gamble on "maybes". They gambled on Eakins and lost horrendously.

The worst thing that can happen here is that Nelson performs well, the Oilers miss McEichel, and the team is still trash next year with Nelson at the helm. Management will escape once again, they'll fire Nelson and rehire another AHLer and the process repeats.

 

[Broilers]

I'm not saying he CAN'T be a good coach, he's just not the one the Oilers need.

Think of when the Blackhawks became the elite team they are today. They fired Savard and brought in Quenville and the rest is history. The Kings brought in Sutter and he elevated them to elite status.

Now the Oilers are nowhere near as good as either of those two teams before they became elite, but that winning experience helped those teams tremendously. The Oilers aren't in a position to gamble on "maybes". They gambled on Eakins and lost horrendously.

The worst thing that can happen here is that Nelson performs well, the Oilers miss McEichel, and the team is still trash next year with Nelson at the helm. Management will escape once again, they'll fire Nelson and rehire another AHLer and the process repeats.

If Hall is not long time in IR we have small small chance to land McEichel

 

[Approved Variety]

Nikitin got a couple bombs off in the 3rd, they just didn't go in. He got a one-timer off with 4 seconds left.

If the Oilers can sign a high profile coach, and manage to keep Nelson as an assistant coach, that would be the best case scenario. If they can't land a big name coach, Nelson has a head coaching job next season, and that's the best we've had since Renney.

If we manage to land a big name coach, but can't keep Nelson...sorry to see him go.