GDT: HUGHES BROTHERS Devils @ Canucks 10pm MSGSN

[Emperoreddy]

 

[Whaddagoal]

For a time, Hynes ran an unusual system where the defender, once challenging a puck carrier, would never disengage.

The defender, possibly a defenseman, could pick up a guy in the left corner, follow him to the left point, follow him to the right point, and follow him back down to the right corner.

Hynes did eventually do away with this. Also, other teams do dabble with this concept.

—————-

It does make me wonder if the Devils front office/analytics gets a little enamored with complicated systems that work amazing when everything works perfect but have issues in real life.

The swarm and defender not disengaging both seem to be things teams have in their repertoire for special situations that the Devils turned into core tenets of their systems.

Both Hynes and Ruff seemed to run a complicated system because they didn’t trust the Devils to be effective defensively under a more traditional system. I’m not sure I agree with that with this current Devils roster but we have nothing to compare against so who knows?

Remember sami vatanen up at the blue line? Circling high up .. lol. Oh man that system used to drive me nuts...

 

[OmNomNom]

still can't get over dano's YAAOHH on bratt's winner lol

 

[JK3]

That Siegs play wasn’t a swarm scenario, it was a puck retrieval looking to break out quick. The wingers are already headed up ice. He never should have reversed it with the forechecker on top of McLeod along the wall. He just should have went around the net where there was zero pressure. . Nemec did get caught in no man’s land though.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

The difference is that Demko has good games. Vitek doesn't.

The difference is Demko is a top goalie, Vitek isn't. Your point?

no one here is saying Vitek is a good goalie ffs.

this is seriously getting really old.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Absolutely, but at the same time as someone mentioned last night, last year’s team would’ve never let this happen.

There is something different to Ruff’s coaching this year, because they didn’t suddenly forget how to play?

Might need to ask Lemaire

 

[Devilsfan992]

Need to play Schmid more.

Better numbers both this year and numbers around league average since the start of November.

And much better numbers in the playoffs than Vitek. And younger and more promise.

 

[NjDevsRR]

Is this just the new NHL as a whole? I see this exact game league wide every week multiple times.

Obviously we need better d coverage and goaltending but is this just the new norm?

 

[johnny pierogi]

I think you need to watch the game, or if you're only watching highlights, look at how Demko did. He was just as shitty.

i care about the goalie's on the devils roster

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

Is this just the new NHL in a whole? I see this exact game league wide every week multiple times.

Obviously we need better d coverage and goaltending but is this just the new norm?

In some ways I think it is. I think basically:

1. Goalie equipment is smaller
2. A generation of players using composite sticks from a young age
3. Improved offensive tactics

Have combined to lead to a relative goal scoring explosion. Skating being better I guess increases the number of scoring chances overall as well.

 

[Triumph]

The difference is Demko is a top goalie, Vitek isn't. Your point?

no one here is saying Vitek is a good goalie ffs.

this is seriously getting really old.

When you're making an extremely simplistic point, maybe you should expect a simplistic response. Everybody knows that goalies have bad games and also that goalies can have good games where they give up 5 or more. It's very possible. The trouble is that Vitek just never has good games anymore.

 

[Devs3cups]

It’s not normal for a goalie to never have a good game. I remember 1 game where I could confidently say Vitek was good and that was the Pittsburgh game.

Whether he is or isn’t a good goalie, that simply isn’t enough.

 

[NJDevs26]

Absolutely, but at the same time as someone mentioned last night, last year’s team would’ve never let this happen.

There is something different to Ruff’s coaching this year, because they didn’t suddenly forget how to play?

I keep trying to apply the same logic to the goalies, did they both forget how to play or is their massively declining play a case of other things going on around them? But they really do look like they forgot how to play

 

[guitarguyvic]

And this is where I say this year is too similar to two years ago. I have a hard time believing it’s as simple as subtracting Graves and Sevs has lead to this. I expected some drop off and adjustment but this just doesn’t make sense to me. But I’m just a humble coal miner, what do I know.

The team two years ago would have lost this game 5-3 because they simply didn’t have the same offensive firepower.

That’s literally the only difference I’m seeing right now.

 

[Bcap88]

League average now is 903 save percentage and 2.95 gaa which is in line with last year

No one is saying they need to be the 90’s defensive structure but when your top 5 in goals scored at 3.7 goals a game you should be better than 500

They are currently allowing 3.7 goals a game a number near 3 is acceptable considering the league average

 

[Louskoolaid89]

Kraken, Flames, and Oilers up next. Would love to get 2 of 3 from those. Would be a 3-1 road trip.

4-0 shouldn't at all be out of the question. Might not be easy like last night but, that's fine. Stack some wins and points together!

 

[Bcap88]

4-0 shouldn't at all be out of the question. Might not be easy like last night but, that's fine. Stack some wins and points together!

Last night wasn’t easy lol

 

[Guttersniped]

What the hell happened lastnight?

 

[Louskoolaid89]

Last night wasn’t easy lol

Hahaha my bad. Typo!

 

[bossram]

That Siegs play wasn’t a swarm scenario, it was a puck retrieval looking to break out quick. The wingers are already headed up ice. He never should have reversed it with the forechecker on top of McLeod along the wall. He just should have went around the net where there was zero pressure. . Nemec did get caught in no man’s land though.

Yep. Like, I guess in zone-down-low system, Nemec wouldn't be there anyway. But the proximate cause of that goal was just a straight pizza from Siegs. Horrible decision with almost no pressure. Similar to Haula's goal where Jack just waited for Myers to cough it up the wall.

Despite 5 goals against, I thought their defensive structure was vastly improved. At least 1 forward was above the puck in the OZ and NZ, cutting down pretty much any dangerous rush chances against. There were no Swarm-induced egregious lapses in DZ coverage.

Pretty much all the chances and goals against were either from a freshly served pizza (Siegs and Nemec were quite guilty) or from net front issues (rebounds and deflections). It wouldn't have been close if Vitek didn't handle rebounds like he was juggling 10 bouncy balls.

 

[Hockey Sports Fan]

I keep trying to apply the same logic to the goalies, did they both forget how to play or is their massively declining play a case of other things going on around them? But they really do look like they forgot how to play

I think some of it can be attributed to roster and coaching turnover. We know the system is “complicated” and Ruff doesn’t help the way he shuffles lines and pairings every two games. So new players are taking time to learn their assignments and a new staff is also going through a learning curve.

I also think teams are well aware of what the Devils do, and the “swarm -> quick breakout -> rush chance” strategy is being gameplanned against, at least at a basic level, and we know Ruff is not the quickest to make adjustments.

Combine that with all the injuries (and probably a few guys playing hurt) and you’ve got a recipe for a clusterf*** of a season start.

Ive been a Lindy Ruff critic since well before he was a twinkle in Fitz’s eye, but he proved last year that he can turn a bunch of kids into a wagon with enough time. He deserves at least a couple more months (and IMO Vanecek and Schmid deserve time as well) to see if he can turn things around.

 

[Guttersniped]

4-0 shouldn't at all be out of the question. Might not be easy like last night but, that's fine. Stack some wins and points together!

 

[Whaddagoal]

Do you have a link to the original plot. I remember it being posted here but I cannot find it...

 

[Bleedred]

It’s not normal for a goalie to never have a good game. I remember 1 game where I could confidently say Vitek was good and that was the Pittsburgh game.

Whether he is or isn’t a good goalie, that simply isn’t enough.

I agree with you, only that game for me was his opener against Detroit.

I thought he was really good that night. He kept us in the game, while we were being outshot 20-10 (or something like that) at one point. We were being heavily outshot through the 2nd period from what I remember.

He gave up three that night, but one of them was in garbage time after we already hit the empty net.

He played well in the Pittsburgh game, but I thought that game was one of our better defensive games of the season. Same with the Minnesota game where he only allowed 2 goals.

His game against Chicago was also pretty good, but that's about it.

 

[Bleedred]

Kraken, Flames, and Oilers up next. Would love to get 2 of 3 from those. Would be a 3-1 road trip.

4-0 shouldn't at all be out of the question. Might not be easy like last night but, that's fine. Stack some wins and points together!

Seattle is one of the few teams that Vitek can quite possibly go toe to toe with their shitty goalies. Washed up Grubauer and their late 20s rookie goalie that's for the AHL.

There's not many other teams you can say that about. Usually a goalie needs to have an off night (Demko) or you need someone really shitty or a team that's really struggling for him to be able to win the goalie battle. Or we need to play like we did against Minnesota, Pittsburgh and Buffalo, and even in the Buffalo game one of their two goalies that played that game somehow stopped a better rate of shots than he did.

Flames are also struggling and no Markstrom for that one.

Oilers are the scariest team on this trip for me, but as we've seen to this point, they've had a considerable amount of duds, which is why there was a coaching change.

They've got it together, but they're still prone to some duds.