How many points does Hampus Lindholm need to be "elite"?

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by KaseMeOutside, Aug 16, 2017.

  1. KaseMeOutside

    KaseMeOutside Based

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    Most people know about his advanced stats and everyone weighs them differently.

    Many consider him a top tier shutdown dman, he has the ability to contribute more offensively but seems to focus more on defending. He is an elite skater and has become much more physical too.

    How many points does he need to be top 10 or a Norris Trophy contender?
     
  2. Sol

    Sol Seductive God Of Thunder

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    I think if he has 2-3 seasons of 50 points, with close to 20 goals...then I think you can start mixing him in. But he needs to drastically improve his offensive game.
     
  3. ijuka

    ijuka Registered User

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    40-50 would be a good benchmark. And advanced stats are only meaningful if they eventually translate to goals.
     
  4. stempniaksen

    stempniaksen Bunch of Jerks

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    Wut?
     
  5. scallionjj11

    scallionjj11 FOREVERALFIE

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    Well considering he hasn't even hit 35 points yet, I agree with the above poster saying that he'll need 50 plus and i just don't see it happenings. There are just some many other better "elite" D-men out there to pick from.
     
  6. CantLoseWithMatthews

    CantLoseWithMatthews Registered User

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    Imo he already is elite. He'll need at least 60 points to contend for the Norris though
     
  7. Sting

    Sting Registered User

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    I never buy the "he has the ability to put up more points, he just chooses to be more defensive". While I might agree that being placed on a team like Pittsburgh over a defensive team might net you some more points, generally a player plays the style that suits him best.

    From what I've seen, he's not an elite offensive player and probably never will be. As long as you aren't an absolute trainwreck defensively, I think 50 pts minimum should be considered elite territory. I do think he's probably elite in his own zone.
     
  8. JoeThorntonsRooster

    JoeThorntonsRooster San Jose’s Team Defense Is Horrible

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    These types of threads are so stupid because subjective terms like elite cannot be quantified. Two posters could view Hampus Lindholm exactly equally, but poster A could see "elite" as being a perennial Norris contending, top-5 defenseman, while poster B could view "elite" as a top-30 defenseman in the league.

    In my opinion, to be considered elite, a guy should be a perennial contender for the best at his position, or at least close. For a defenseman, this means he needs to be in Norris talk, even if it's just on occasion. I would consider Giordano and Vlasic the cut off for elite, regarding defensemen. Is Lindholm there? Probably not. I think he would need to consistently score at least 45 points, or improve his defensive game to be considered one of the top-5 defensive guys in the league. He scored 20 points in 66 games this year and that is Vlasic territory. He needs to probably double his production or further improve his already stellar defense before I use the term elite for him.
     
  9. Holtbyisms

    Holtbyisms SY-STEM SY-STEM!!

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    This...I view the term elite as generational type skill. 15 years from now I don't expect myself to tell my kids "Man if you could have seen Lindholm!!!"
     
  10. KaseMeOutside

    KaseMeOutside Based

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    How is Lindholm not considered a top 5 defensive D right now. Or atleast very close to it
     
  11. TheFinnishTrap

    TheFinnishTrap Registered User

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    I on the other hand reserve the label generational to players like Crosby and McDavid and maybe Karlsson.
     
  12. Caps8112

    Caps8112 Registered User

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    Very good defensemen but wont ever be elite. there are maybe 3 or 4 elite players in the league. He may become a top 10 dman or something
     
  13. Halla

    Halla Registered User

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    40+ minumum to be considered top 10

    50+ to get Norris consideration.

    not sure he has it in him after two straight sub 30pt years.
    seems more like a 30ish pt guy
     
  14. Halla

    Halla Registered User

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    I wouldn't even have him top 10

    in no particular order

    Doughty,Keith,Suter,Tanev,Hjalmarsson,Vlasic,Hedman,Stralman,Mcdonaugh, Pietrangelo
     
  15. DominikBokkFan

    DominikBokkFan It's happening!

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    Or preventing goals against? You know that's a great thing as well.
     
  16. Arthuros

    Arthuros Registered Snoozer

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    Yeah, gonna need to hit 45+ consistently while being great defensively.

    The kid's had a bum arm this past year, and I don't think the last two seasons are great indicators of his true offensive abilities. That being said, I see 45 as being his maximum.
     
  17. The Macho Man

    The Macho Man Lusty Bodychecker

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    I don't think he's going to be in the Norris conversation in his career if he doesn't at least break 40 points, and I don't think he is *quite* good enough defensively to be considered a Norris contender if he hits the mid 40s (although he's young enough that I wouldn't be surprised if that improves).

    And yeah - I think "elite" Dmen are Dmen who, in a given year, you'd think have a realistic shot at the Norris.
     
  18. HanSolo

    HanSolo Vegas Strong

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    Probably won't ever win a Norris but he is excellent defensively. So personally I don't care if he doesn't meet the offensive standards of an elite player.
     
  19. Curufinwe

    Curufinwe Registered User

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    Yes. Being elite, and being a Norris contender when Burns and Karlsson are putting up 70 points are two different things.
     
  20. VoynovsParoleOfficer

    VoynovsParoleOfficer Registered User

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    seriously? maybe top 5 amongst his peers but even then its dicey....


    Karlsson, Doughty, letang, Hedman, Pietrangelo, Mcdonagh, Suter, Burns, Subban, Weber and then about 10 more guys that are in same catgory as Hampus with much better Resumes .....
     
  21. Boom Boom Apathy

    Boom Boom Apathy Eat cookies, get fat, watch from the couch

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    Media, and even fans put a lot of emphasis on points.

    Top 5 in Norris voting this year:

    Burns: 76 points
    Karlsson: 71 points
    Hedman: 72 points
    Keith: 53 points
    Suter: 40 points (but had 51 the season prior)
    Weber: 42 points (but had 51 the season prior and multiple 50 point seasons)
    Doughty: 44 points (but had 51 the season prior)

    I think Lindholm would have to be a 45-50 point player for more than one season to be considered top 10. Would need to be 50+ to be a norris candidate.
     
  22. rhinoshawarma

    rhinoshawarma Registered User

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    Points don't make you elite. He's a tremendous defensemen and yes maybe he needs more offensive impact to be in the Norris discussion in the future but you don't need 50+ pts to be an elite defensemen. Vlasic is an example, but then again depends on your definition of elite.
     
  23. Original Rob

    Original Rob Registered User

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    Fifty three.
     
  24. VoynovsParoleOfficer

    VoynovsParoleOfficer Registered User

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    the loch ness monster stole TREE FIDDY from me
     
  25. InAbsensia

    InAbsensia OMG Boro is going to be our captain isn't he?

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    No fixed amount is necessary, nor is a Norris finalist approach.
    Simply being excellent positionally and a good contributor for his team will lead the Ducks to excellent results. Individual note is not to be sought, only shunned. :)
     

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