How hot is Lou's seat?

[Zippy316]

oh I agree we won't see the results for a season or two. I just meant they have to draft well with at least 2 of these 3 early picks to have success down the road. I fully expect to be in the Austin Mathews lottery next season.

I am too.

I just hope that some of the dead weight is moved and some youth comes in. It would be another rough year if we have to watch the offense fail miserably just to know it's a bunch of overpaid, washed-up older guys who are playing bigger roles than they should be.

An emergence of a guy like Boucher, Matteau, Josefson, a trade candidate like Namestnikov, or a UFA like Paajarvi would give some silver lining to watching this team stumble to a terrible record. But I'm not getting my hopes up for that to happen either.

 

[MullerBrotenVerbeek]

The foundation still would've been terrible. But Kovalchuk or Parise would've helped keep it up while we tried to rebuild the forward position.

Without either, we were truly exposed.

I don't know if it would be possible under the cap, but if you were to add Parise and Kovy to the current team...

Cammy-Henrique-Kovalchuk
Paris-Zajac-FA Signing
Elias-Gomez-Bernier
Rutuu-Josefson-Tootoo

Greene-Lars
Merrill-Sevs
Gely-Vet signing or Hrabarenka/Hulk

Schneider
Kinkaid

looks pretty solif

 

[NJDevs26]

I'm just wondering how many more years of no playoff revenue will it take for changes to happen because most, if not every, GM shouldn't survive missing the playoffs in four out of five and possibly five out of six seasons. And the rebuild excuse really isn't valid anymore after what Calgary, Vancouver, and Ottawa did this year. Making the playoffs in a rebuild is still very possible when half the teams in the league qualify.

How many comparables are there really to a guy with Lou's history as a GM falling on hard times? The only one I can think of is Bill Torrey, who won four Cups in the '80's but was eventually forced out after missing the playoffs three of four seasons in 1992...but in the be careful what you wish for box, within three years the Milbury era began and they STILL haven't won a playoff series since the year after Torrey left.

 

[JimEIV]

How many comparables are there really to a guy with Lou's history as a GM falling on hard times? The only one I can think of is Bill Torrey, who won four Cups in the '80's but was eventually forced out after missing the playoffs three of four seasons in 1992...but in the be careful what you wish for box, within three years the Milbury era began and they STILL haven't won a playoff series since the year after Torrey left.

Maybe Harry Sinden.

 

[glenwo2]

oh I agree we won't see the results for a season or two. I just meant they have to draft well with at least 2 of these 3 early picks to have success down the road. I fully expect to be in the Austin Mathews lottery next season.

Who is this Austin Mathews you're speaking of?

 

[NJDevs26]

Who is this Austin Mathews you're speaking of?

Presumably next year's #1 pick

Yep: http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=199898

 

[glenwo2]

Presumably next year's #1 pick

Yep: http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=199898

Watch Edmonton draft him at #1, too.

 

[Burner Account]

Why do all those Division championships, 40+ win/100 point seasons, teams allowing the fewest goals against in the league as recently as 2010, those Vezina winning years, those 40+ goal seasons by Parise and Gionta get swept under the rug? All post lockout...

It makes no sense...

A person will say "because no playoff success"...Then someone will say we were in the finals in 2012 and that is called Cinderella -- The criticism here is a lot like the arguments I used to have with Ranger fans in the 1990's, circular and irrational.

Now that is something a Ranger fan would say

 

[JimEIV]

Now that is something a Ranger fan would say

One in a row...vs 20 years of it

 

[HBK27]

Also lest we forget this is the second time we lost 2 franchise players in a matter of year with Stevens retiring and Niedermayer signing in Anaheim and Lou actually kept us a playoff team for several years after that. Think about that, 2 HOF dmen leave at the same time and your team didn't totally collapse.

This has always been my biggest problem with Lou – not locking up top players long-term before they hit free agency or at least getting something of value for them if they’re going to bolt. The top teams in the league in recent years have all locked up their star players, even if that means overpaying them a bit vs. losing them for nothing.

I know Lou made solid offers and came close to keeping Niedermayer and Parise, but ultimately it never should’ve gotten to that point. He also let Elias test the free agent market and we were lucky to keep him. Paul Martin was a valuable asset lost for nothing. Same with Rafalski. We knew Gomez was gone, but Lou stubbornly held on to him to the end. Same with Clarkson. Maybe if the NHL had some type of compensation for losing these guys it wouldn’t have been so bad, but losing them all for absolutely nothing is tough to recover from.

Lou at least seems to be learning from this by locking up Greene & Schneider long-term – hopefully that continues.

I don’t know what to expect from this team for next season. It will be interesting to see what Lou does as I’m sure he feels pressure to make the playoffs, but I just don’t know how you do that with the glaring lack of offense and unimpressive free agent market. Can’t even go into full tank mode as Schneider will keep the team competitive. Have to wonder if some mid/lower tier free agents might even second guess coming to NJ after seeing how Ryder & Havlat were scratched so much down the stretch (and not even trading for anything at the deadline).

I don’t think Lou needs to go if they miss the playoffs again, as long as the team is heading in the right direction. There will likely need to be a couple of trades made – either dealing with teams that are up against the cap or trading some younger D or picks for scoring. The coaching hire will also be big this offseason. Can’t go into next season with a similar group of old, stale forwards – at least needs to be some youth in there to get a bit excited about.

 

[GhostofKenKlee]

Just looking at what Harris/Blitzer are doing in Philly they would "cleaned house" by now ie when they bought the sixers. They actually believe in LL and the fetish dream that some here of a hot seat is some empty void that won't be filled by it actually happening.

 

[217 Forever]

Just looking at what Harris/Blitzer are doing in Philly they would "cleaned house" by now ie when they bought the sixers. They actually believe in LL and the fetish dream that some here of a hot seat is some empty void that won't be filled by it actually happening.

I think Lou's track record was slightly better than whatever was masquerading as the Sixers management, but going forward who knows what they are expecting. They may believe in Lou, but they believe in profit from playoff games more I'd bet my life on that.

 

[NJDevs26]

If they were that set on playoff games profit they wouldn't be banking a multi year Sixers tank.

 

[217 Forever]

If they were that set on playoff games profit they wouldn't be banking a multi year Sixers tank.

Completely different business models between the two sports and it's been pretty well proven that the only way to improve in basketball is to purge salaries, get numerous high draft picks and/or pray that the Lebron James of the world sign as a free agent.

 

[Marv4Life]

It's not just the idea of losing Kovy and Parise. It's the fact of losing both of them for nothing and not having a plan B in place just in case something like this would occur. 4/5 years of missing the postseason. Lack of playoff revenue. Team still carrying a stigma. Dude in his 70s. At some point ownership is gonna get it together and realize this despite quotes. Chia got canned despite leading them the the Finals twice with 1 Cup yet Lou still has his. Something ain't right.

 

[Wingman77]

It's not just the idea of losing Kovy and Parise. It's the fact of losing both of them for nothing and not having a plan B in place just in case something like this would occur. 4/5 years of missing the postseason. Lack of playoff revenue. Team still carrying a stigma. Dude in his 70s. At some point ownership is gonna get it together and realize this despite quotes. Chia got canned despite leading them the the Finals twice with 1 Cup yet Lou still has his. Something ain't right.

Unless it is part of a plan to rebuild or transition, how does one plan for the event where they will lose their top two players in a 1 year span? When else has that ever happened in all of professional sports?

How would you have planned differently so that when both of our top players left, there would be 2 answers right back that would be able to slot right in and do as good of a job as those guys did? That takes the team financial situation and all that good stuff into account. I'm pretty intrigued to hear this.

 

[Burner Account]

To be fair I don't blame Lou for not having a plan in place for a guy opting out of a 15-year deal.

 

[NJDevs26]

Parise is one thing, he was an impending UFA but they were really supposed to plan on the Russian walking out three years into a fifteen year contract?

 

[Cowbell232]

I still firmly believe that the new ownership bought an arena and the hockey team is secondary.

If you see them keeping their hands off hockey ops, it's a sign I'm probably right.

 

[217 Forever]

I still firmly believe that the new ownership bought an arena and the hockey team is secondary.

If you see them keeping their hands off hockey ops, it's a sign I'm probably right.

I think you're right, plus they were probably told that Lou is the best in the business, etc. But they are wealthy businessmen, and losing money in any way shape or form just isn't usually tolerated. Guys don't get into the position they are in by operating that way. Eventually, and I can't say when, the hockey team turning a profit will be expected. It's not like they've been lowering ticket prices right?

 

[Cowbell232]

I think you're right, plus they were probably told that Lou is the best in the business, etc. But they are wealthy businessmen, and losing money in any way shape or form just isn't usually tolerated. Guys don't get into the position they are in by operating that way. Eventually, and I can't say when, the hockey team turning a profit will be expected. It's not like they've been lowering ticket prices right?

I disagree fully. Most sports teams are loss leaders for an eccentric group of super-duper-filthy-stinking-rich.

The arena makes money, and as long as that number is more than the NJD loss is... what do they care?

 

[217 Forever]

I disagree fully. Most sports teams are loss leaders for an eccentric group of super-duper-filthy-stinking-rich.

The arena makes money, and as long as that number is more than the NJD loss is... what do they care?

You can do the research yourself, but according to Forbes, in the 4 major sports I counted 97 teams that made money last year and 25 that did not (the link is to the NHL but you can view it for any sport).

http://www.forbes.com/nhl-valuations/list/

I think more teams used to lose money when they were owned more by people than corporations, combined with CBA's that were more favorable to the players than owners.

 

[Drewr15]

I disagree fully. Most sports teams are loss leaders for an eccentric group of super-duper-filthy-stinking-rich.

The arena makes money, and as long as that number is more than the NJD loss is... what do they care?

Heck I remember Forbes in the 90's had an article basically stating NHL teams at best break even. The way to make money was to own the arena and that most NHL teams that don't will never make money. And you saw the trend changing of teams either owning the arena or being part of a group that owned the arena and the team. There is no doubt in my mind they bought in for the Prudential Center.

 

[Sascha Goc]

I disagree fully. Most sports teams are loss leaders for an eccentric group of super-duper-filthy-stinking-rich.

The arena makes money, and as long as that number is more than the NJD loss is... what do they care?

The one flaw in this thinking is that they own the Sixers but don't own Wells Fargo Center so in that case wouldn't they be in it to win it there?

The arena is a nice perk for these guys I think, but they still want to win. Most of these owners buy teams as a really expensive ego driven play thing. Harris is also noted to be an extremely competitive athlete and you don't become that successful in business without a little competitive fire in you. Im not buying that these guys don't care about the results at all even though they weren't actual fans of the team like Vanderbeek.

 

[Cowbell232]

You can do the research yourself, but according to Forbes, in the 4 major sports I counted 97 teams that made money last year and 25 that did not (the link is to the NHL but you can view it for any sport).

http://www.forbes.com/nhl-valuations/list/

I think more teams used to lose money when they were owned more by people than corporations, combined with CBA's that were more favorable to the players than owners.

They're mostly privately held corporations. That list is pure speculation really, right?

Plus, especially for a team like the Devils that cannot ever get a damn penny out of revenue sharing, why on earth would they want to make even a cent? Wouldn't it make more sense to "pay" the arena a ton of money for the rights to play there? It's all loopholes.

Heck I remember Forbes in the 90's had an article basically stating NHL teams at best break even. The way to make money was to own the arena and that most NHL teams that don't will never make money. And you saw the trend changing of teams either owning the arena or being part of a group that owned the arena and the team. There is no doubt in my mind they bought in for the Prudential Center.

Yup, that's why we've had so many work stoppages.