Speculation: How has Ryan Graves looked?

[Ivan13]

He's going to score 30 points and suddenly the Avs are going to have to pay the guy.

I'd pass on that.

 

[Murzu]

He's going to score 30 points and suddenly the Avs are going to have to pay the guy.

And that's when we say "bye bye!"

 

[Jayevs]

He's going to score 30 points and suddenly the Avs are going to have to pay the guy.

Meh he’ll get 1.7-2.2 like Holden

 

[Cousin Eddie]

This guy is on pace for 34 points over 82 games and he drives me absolutely bananas lol.

 

[henchman21]

Graves seems like the guy that would value security over an arbitration case to get the most cash. I think the board will probably have a fit when he signs a 3 or 4 year deal in the 1.7-2 range, but that seems fair for what he's done. Even if I don't like it.

 

[Pokecheque]

Always interesting that it's these guys who end up getting some obscene plus-minus ratings on their respective teams. Last year it was Nemeth, right?

If nothing else, I like having a good offensive guy with a heavy shot in that 6/7 slot than a guy like Nemeth who might be a little more reliable defensively, but did absolutely nothing when the puck landed on his stick.

 

[The Shermanator]

On Tim and Sid just now: "Ryan Graves is one of the best defensemen in the game of hockey. He's phenomenal."

 

[henchman21]

On Tim and Sid just now: "Ryan Graves is one of the best defensemen in the game of hockey. He's phenomenal."

Sell

Six months from now:

 

[McMetal]

On Tim and Sid just now: "Ryan Graves is one of the best defensemen in the game of hockey. He's phenomenal."

It's so obvious those two don't watch any non-Canadian teams. I guarantee that opinion is mostly based on stat watching with a dash of recency bias. He's playing quite well for what he is, but leading the league in +/- on a team that has the Avs goal differential isn't as impressive as it sounds.

 

[Pokecheque]

Sell

Six months from now:

Graves for Pageau! One for one!!!!

 

[Foppberg]

It's so obvious those two don't watch any non-Canadian teams. I guarantee that opinion is mostly based on stat watching with a dash of recency bias. He's playing quite well for what he is, but leading the league in +/- on a team that has the Avs goal differential isn't as impressive as it sounds.

Tim and Sid are also morons, so.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I mean.... I actually think maybe our board has been a touch too harsh with Graves this season, myself included at times.


But he really has put together a pretty fantastic stretch of games right now. I mean for all the love Zadorov has gotten over the last 2 weeks, Graves has been even better. But Zadorov is one of those "favorites" around here while Graves has been a whipping boy most of his time. And Graves has been criticized a lot for taking penalties... But he's only taken 11 minors in 30 games now. While Zadorov has taken 13 in 26 games and Cole has taken 12 in 25 games. 5 of Graves 11 minors also came in that 2 game stretch in Edmonton and Vancouver, probably his 2 worst games of the season.


+/- is a flawed stat but when you're a +22 over 30 games, you're doing something right. He has his warts, but basically every Dman in the league has his warts as well.


He's had rough stretches and some deserved criticism but overall I think he's been one of our better Dmen this year to be honest. I've certainly liked him more than EJ, Cole, and Baberio. And I'm probably in the minority for this one also but looking at the full body of work on the season for the two guys, I would probably prefer Graves to Zadorov right now also.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

I just hate the fact that it seems like Graves takes the same high stick penalties that should be avoidable. I mean.. you're 6'5.. why are you taking high stick penalties.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I just hate the fact that it seems like Graves takes the same high stick penalties that should be avoidable. I mean.. you're 6'5.. why are you taking high stick penalties.

That's exactly why.

He's 6'5. He has a longer stick, and he's significantly taller than most forwards in the league. It's a combination that is naturally going to lead to more accidental high stick infractions.

 

[Foppa2118]

I think the board has treated Graves pretty fair. He had a good start. Then a really poor month or so. Then he upped his game a lot along with Zadorov and Girard when EJ went down.

Last game though he and Girard came back down to earth a bit. Graves wasn't terrible but he was leaving his assignments a bit too open in the D zone. Gave them a little too much time and space to work with.

He's falling into that Nick Holden role IMO where he brings some good things to the table, and he's really good in spurts, but you don't want to rely on him to be a regular top 4 guy on a playoff team.

 

[Balthazar]

He's falling into that Nick Holden role IMO where he brings some good things to the table, and he's really good in spurts, but you don't want to rely on him to be a regular top 4 guy on a playoff team.

Exactly. He doesn't have the talent to play the game that he plays in the NHL. Currently he's playing top 4 minutes and asked to be responsible defensively, play on the PK AND pitch offensively at the right time. It's destined to crash and burn everywhere at the same time, Nick Holden style.

 

[McMetal]

I wouldn't say it's a sure thing that he's going to crash down to earth. The biggest knock I had against him, and what I thought would surely prevent him from ever being a top 4 guy, was how many risks he took offensively and on breakouts. Eventually, those low percentage plays would catch up to him, because he doesn't have the talent of a guy like Subban who can consistently pull those off. But one thing that he's really cleaned up lately is his decision making in that regard. He's still jumping into the play at times, but he's way smarter about when to do so, and it's contributed to his recent goal outburst. He's also playing it simpler on the breakout.

It's possible that he's adapting to the NHL game and we'll see more consistency from him that would enable him to be a solid #4. I'm not going to crown him that based on 8 games, but I won't discount it either.

 

[Pokecheque]

I wouldn't say it's a sure thing that he's going to crash down to earth. The biggest knock I had against him, and what I thought would surely prevent him from ever being a top 4 guy, was how many risks he took offensively and on breakouts. Eventually, those low percentage plays would catch up to him, because he doesn't have the talent of a guy like Subban who can consistently pull those off. But one thing that he's really cleaned up lately is his decision making in that regard. He's still jumping into the play at times, but he's way smarter about when to do so, and it's contributed to his recent goal outburst. He's also playing it simpler on the breakout.

It's possible that he's adapting to the NHL game and we'll see more consistency from him that would enable him to be a solid #4. I'm not going to crown him that based on 8 games, but I won't discount it either.

Frankly I want him to be that high-risk player. When he tries to be more conservative/passive, that's when he looks really bad. Case in point: That feeble-as-hell attempt to block the shot from Tkachuk on the PK. He wasn't even close to it. They should just quit trying to get him to do that, because he's just not good at it. He's much better when he goes into the corners and battles for the puck, and when he jumps into the play. Just be aggressive and, well, accept the consequences when and where they happen. I think one reason why he plays reasonably well with Cale is that he skates pretty well for a big guy and has more puck skill than Z. He also keeps the opposition honest with his scoring ability. They can't just key in on #8 when he's on the ice.

Also, while he's not great at getting his shot through traffic, he appears to be pretty good at wrecking the cars that get in his way.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

I don’t think he’s awful, but if I was looking to make a big trade and he was a piece in the deal, I wouldn’t hesitate to pull the trigger.

 

[PAZ]

I was definitely harsh on Graves at the beginning of the season, but he definitely put together a nice stretch of games. I think he's an ideal #5/6 on a healthy roster, and while he isn't exceptional at anything, he does just enough right in most aspects to be a good fit for us.

 

[Balthazar]

Frankly I want him to be that high-risk player. When he tries to be more conservative/passive, that's when he looks really bad. Case in point: That feeble-as-hell attempt to block the shot from Tkachuk on the PK. He wasn't even close to it. They should just quit trying to get him to do that, because he's just not good at it. He's much better when he goes into the corners and battles for the puck, and when he jumps into the play. Just be aggressive and, well, accept the consequences when and where they happen. I think one reason why he plays reasonably well with Cale is that he skates pretty well for a big guy and has more puck skill than Z. He also keeps the opposition honest with his scoring ability. They can't just key in on #8 when he's on the ice.

Also, while he's not great at getting his shot through traffic, he appears to be pretty good at wrecking the cars that get in his way.

Interesting because I'd go in the complete opposite direction. I'd tell him to forget about pinching to score goals for now but to work on those horrible turnovers in his own zone. He's also surprisingly effective when he's using that big 6'5 body to play a more physical game so I'd make him use that more as well. He's got a decent shot from the blue line so he can work on accuracy.

If he can become a meat and potato classic defenseman I can see him possibly having a long career in the NHL. He's got the tools for that. If he plays a poor man's Tyson Barrie like you suggested he's doomed.

 

[AvsRobin]

+/- is all you need to look at

 

[JoeSakic13]

#BringBackBigras

 

[TruePowerSlave]

Great trade, Bigras is a nobody

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Graves is a far, far better skater than Holden. I think that alone will separate the two in my books.


I also think Graves is a better PKer than Holden. I can't even remember if Holden actually PKd or not. But I find Graves to be a good shot blocker and generally good positioning on the PK. His frustrations for me on the PK stem from his clearing ability.


As for the offense. I'm not convinced hes capable of 30-35 points yet but of he does put up those numbers over the course of the year.... That's honestly not a bad defender at all.

I'll say it again but I'd take a 30-35 point Graves who plays a decent PK, over Zadorov for that 3LD slot and especially if Graves can get signed for 2M while Zadorov is looking for 4M+