Friedman: Horvat Talks Intensifying [Update: Jan 20, 2023 - #679]

[KingBogo]

You realize these teams are probably only gonna trade for Horvat if he agrees to an extension. So Horvat gonna say no to an extension and basically nix a deal to a team posied for a cup run because he wants to rot away the rest of the season in Vancouver to sign in Detroit in free agency. . If Detroit sits on Horvat they'll more than likely never ever see Horvat

You think Horvat still won’t be traded as a rental? Every single season all the top UFAs and most of the lesser UFAs get moved as rentals. It happens year after year. For a Horvat quality player it will be a first and a good but not best prospect and probably another pick based on team success. You think Vancouver won’t take this and instead make him rot and lose him for nothing. And what does letting him rot mean? He makes big coin with the team of his choice come July 1st.

 

[CheerstoBeers]

You think Horvat still won’t be traded as a rental? Every single season all the top UFAs and most of the lesser UFAs get moved as rentals. It happens year after year. For a Horvat quality player it will be a first and a good but not best prospect and probably another pick based on team success. You think Vancouver won’t take this and instead make him rot and lose him for nothing. And what does letting him rot mean? He makes big coin with the team of his choice come July 1st.

It won't be up to Vancouver, it'll be up to the team trading for him. I don't think any top contender this season is gonna trade for Horvat with a package the Canucks want without an extension in place.

 

[KingBogo]

It won't be up to Vancouver, it'll be up to the team trading for him. I don't think any top contender this season is gonna trade for Horvat with a package the Canucks want without an extension in place.

I bet you’re wrong. When everything was said and done last season the Jets got a 1st and a 2nd and a young player who is now a LW on the 3rd line (Barron) for a pure rental in Copp. If Vancouver can’t do at least that for a top 6 center and a better player in Horvat I’d be shocked.

 

[CheerstoBeers]

I bet you’re wrong. When everything was said and done last season the Jets got a 1st and a 2nd and a young player who is now a LW on the 3rd line (Barron) for a pure rental in Copp. If Vancouver can’t do at least that for a top 6 center and a better player in Horvat I’d be shocked.

I just can't see Horvat not wanting to sign an extension with a contender if it means facilitating a trade for a cup run this season. Horvat isn't Copp, he's a #1 C that teams are wanting to secure long term because guys like him dont come available often. He's not gonna say, hey I don't wanna sign with x team this deadline so x team says no thanks on that price tag for a rental so he can sign with Detroit in the off season. I just don't see it.

 

[KingBogo]

I just can't see Horvat not wanting to sign an extension with a contender if it means facilitating a trade for a cup run this season. Horvat isn't Copp, he's a #1 C that teams are wanting to secure long term because guys like him dont come available often. He's not gonna say, hey I don't wanna sign with x team this deadline so x team says no thanks on that price tag for a rental so he can sign with Detroit in the off season. I just don't see it.

But why does a 27 y/o # 1 center need or want to sign a long term now when they can wait until July 1st and pick their spot when the highest and best contracts get offered? They know a contender will trade for a cup run so no need to commit now. And I’ll add some of the current contenders are in 1 or 2 year mode on an aging team that will be in rebuild for most of a long term contract.

 

[82Ninety42011]

Because whoever trades for him will send a much better offer to Vancouver if they can negotiate an extension. If Detroit waits til the offseason Horvat will no doubt already be locked down for eight years with a new team. You snooze you lose.

That's if he signs before. Don't think for a second Horvat hasn't told someone where he prefers to play next season. Then that person passes it on to that team to let them know. Yes I know tampering but it happens. Who knows what's going on we're all just speculating I guess. Just want this over.

 

[CheerstoBeers]

But why does a 27 y/o # 1 center need or want to sign a long term now when they can wait until July 1st and pick their spot when the highest and best contracts get offered? They know a contender will trade for a cup run so no need to commit now. And I’ll add some of the current contenders are in 1 or 2 year mode on an aging team that will be in rebuild for most of a long term contract.

Like I said a contender like the Bruins are not gonna send a massive package for Horvat without an extension in place. Why would Vancouver not want Horvat to have an extension in place so they can maximize their return. They can ask much more for an extended Horvat than a rental Horvat. I just can't see a guy like Horvat being traded as a rental this season, any team Carolina, Boston etc are on the hunt for long term commitment. I'm sure there are teams that will trade for him as a rental but they may not be as an enticing of a place as Boston who is literally having a record year and is a huge cup favorite. You think Horvat is not gonna sign an extension with Boston if that's what it takes to get a deal done if given the chance to win a cup this year.

 

[Sigurd]

That's if he signs before. Don't think for a second Horvat hasn't told someone where he prefers to play next season. Then that person passes it on to that team to let them know. Yes I know tampering but it happens. Who knows what's going on we're all just speculating I guess. Just want this over.

Me too. Regardless of what happens around the trade deadline, I just want it to pass already.

 

[KingBogo]

Like I said a contender like the Bruins are not gonna send a massive package for Horvat without an extension in place. Why would Vancouver not want Horvat to have an extension in place so they can maximize their return. They can ask much more for an extended Horvat than a rental Horvat. I just can't see a guy like Horvat being traded as a rental this season, any team Carolina, Boston etc are on the hunt for long term commitment. I'm sure there are teams that will trade for him as a rental but they may not be as an enticing of a place as Boston who is literally having a record year and is a huge cup favorite. You think Horvat is not gonna sign an extension with Boston if that's what it takes to get a deal done if given the chance to win a cup this year.

I think Horvat will let the best rental trade possible take place and do his best on whatever cup run he finds himself on. In a perfect world he is a main contributor and it ups his asking price. Then in free agency he will talk to all teams interested and pick the landing spot and contract he likes best.

 

[CheerstoBeers]

I think Horvat will let the best rental trade possible take place and do his best on whatever cup run he finds himself on. In a perfect world he is a main contributor and it ups his asking price. Then in free agency he will talk to all teams interested and pick the landing spot and contract he likes best.

I don't see it that way so we'll agree to disagree. If Horvat needs to sign an extension or a team like Carolina or Boston says no thanks to a trade for him at the deadline, I think Horvat signs that extension all day to get a deal done

 

[KingBogo]

I don't see it that way so we'll agree to disagree. If Horvat needs to sign an extension or a team like Carolina or Boston says no thanks to a trade for him at the deadline, I think Horvat signs that extension all day to get a deal done

The last thing I’ll add is you are thinking of this from the team’s perspective not the player’s perspective. Horvat will end up on a contender no matter what this season unless the Canucks can convince him to re-sign before the deadline. After the season he will be among the most sought after UFAs. He will get to choose his landing spot and most likely get a much better contract since he can make his decision with 32 teams in play at the time when teams have the most to spend and historically the highest contracts get signed.

 

[lomiller1]

The risk of singing him next year terrifies me. I don't want him even as a rental because the contract he signs will be next years version of the JT Miller and Huberdeau contracts, and getting him as a rental probably means signing him.

 

[stungun54]

why does Horvat care if he gets his money early? If a contender offers him what he thinks is fair he would be stupid not to take it now and be done with it. Ask Klinberg how his ufa summer turned out for him? its a screwy cap situation the past few years. if a team he like offers him a sign an trade he is taking it. if not he rides out the season in vancouver or joins a team for a cup run and goes ufa, but dont think teams are ponying up the same for it.

 

[CheerstoBeers]

The last thing I’ll add is you are thinking of this from the team’s perspective not the player’s perspective. Horvat will end up on a contender no matter what this season unless the Canucks can convince him to re-sign before the deadline. After the season he will be among the most sought after UFAs. He will get to choose his landing spot and most likely get a much better contract since he can make his decision with 32 teams in play at the time when teams have the most to spend and historically the highest contracts get signed.

Your looking at this like Horvat wanting to hit free agency is written in stone Maybe he's quite content to sign long term with a team like Carolina all the while knowing if he does so it facilitates a trade this season to take a run at a cup with a contender who has a real shot this spring..

 

[wintersej]

The last thing I’ll add is you are thinking of this from the team’s perspective not the player’s perspective. Horvat will end up on a contender no matter what this season unless the Canucks can convince him to re-sign before the deadline. After the season he will be among the most sought after UFAs. He will get to choose his landing spot and most likely get a much better contract since he can make his decision with 32 teams in play at the time when teams have the most to spend and historically the highest contracts get signed.

From a players perspective, Horvat would probably rather get an 8 year deal instead of a 7 year deal. It takes a lot of extra AAV to make up for that lost year.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

I’m still sticking to the feeling Boeser gets moved regardless before Horvat this deadline. Freeing up the Cap would give them so much more clarity if a Horvat extension is even possible.

Kuzmenko and Schenn also go and maybe a Goalie like Delia for depth. Myers gets moved after his bonus is paid and you asses how Miller and OEL feel under Tocchet at the end of the year. I think Garland is going to excel with his old coach and ends up being worth his contract.

 

[UrbanImpact]

I dont think Carolina is a serious contender for Horvat.

I feel like Carolina is the Oakland A's of Hockey. At times I feel they'd rather be the smartest front office team in hockey than do big major things, all in things to actually try and win it all.

They have internal rules like, dont spend on rentals, dont pay Dmen, etc....

I also dont think they are willing to go all in on Horvat because they know that the Bruins are a powerhouse this year and even adding Horvat likely wont mean they can even compete with the Bruins.

 

[puckinyourteeth]

From what I understand, the Canucks want a good guaranteed return before giving Horvats agent permission to work out an extension. I mean, it makes sense. As a Canucks fan, I think PA and JR are embarrassments to the entire organization, the way they screwed with Boudreau. Free agents are going to think twice before signing here.

 

[Stickpucker]

I just can't see Horvat not wanting to sign an extension with a contender if it means facilitating a trade for a cup run this season. Horvat isn't Copp, he's a #1 C that teams are wanting to secure long term because guys like him dont come available often. He's not gonna say, hey I don't wanna sign with x team this deadline so x team says no thanks on that price tag for a rental so he can sign with Detroit in the off season. I just don't see it.

Horvat is not a 1c on a contender.

If he was the selke caliber, rocket richard caliber 1c that Canuck fans are selling him as Vancouver would be comfortably in the playoffs with all their other offensive weapons and their coach wouldn't have been fired.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

I dont think Carolina is a serious contender for Horvat.

I feel like Carolina is the Oakland A's of Hockey. At times I feel they'd rather be the smartest front office team in hockey than do big major things, all in things to actually try and win it all.

They have internal rules like, dont spend on rentals, dont pay Dmen, etc....

I also dont think they are willing to go all in on Horvat because they know that the Bruins are a powerhouse this year and even adding Horvat likely wont mean they can even compete with the Bruins.

Again, many teams operate in a similar manner in terms of high prices for rentals at the deadline. St. Louis traded a 1st for a rental just one time (Miller+Ott). Ditto Washington (Shattenkirk), Tampa (Savard) and peak L.A. (Sekera). Pittsburgh hasn’t done it in 10 years (Iginla). Detroit fought it all the way.

The passive aggressiveness is misplaced. The only thing Don Waddell is doing differently is talking about it publicly.

 

[UrbanImpact]

Dhaliwal says keep an eye on Brandon Carlo from the Bruins.

I'd personally be very unsatisfied if Carlo is the main piece coming back for Horvat.

Cost controlled for 4 more years after this season which is nice but he has injury history and i also feel like he has hit his ceiling which is a top 4 stay at home Dman.

Even if its aa package of Carlo and Lysell i think id be underwhelmed.

It seems though that the Canucks might be pegging Carlo as the perfect Dpartner for Hughes.

He also fits that u26 player that Rutherford said they are looking for.

 

[Love]

Dhaliwal says keep an eye on Brandon Carlo from the Bruins.

I'd personally be very unsatisfied if Carlo is the main piece coming back for Horvat.

Cost controlled for 4 more years after this season which is nice but he has injury history and i also feel like he has hit his ceiling which is a top 4 stay at home Dman.

Even if its aa package of Carlo and Lysell i think id be underwhelmed.

It seems though that the Canucks might be pegging Carlo as the perfect Dpartner for Hughes.

He also fits that u26 player that Rutherford said they are looking for.

Nitpicking here but Carlo is 26 turning 27 this fall.

 

[UrbanImpact]

Nitpicking here but Carlo is 26 turning 27 this fall.

I thought he is already 26. Turned 26 in Nov

 

[Love]

I thought he is already 26. Turned 26 in Nov

Ya he’s 26 now. When you said he fits Rutherford’s U26 vision I took that as meaning players who are 25 or younger.

 

[EP to Kuzmenko]

But why does a 27 y/o # 1 center need or want to sign a long term now when they can wait until July 1st and pick their spot when the highest and best contracts get offered? They know a contender will trade for a cup run so no need to commit now. And I’ll add some of the current contenders are in 1 or 2 year mode on an aging team that will be in rebuild for most of a long term contract.

On July 1st he can sign a 7 year deal with any team that inquires about his services. Right now he can sign an 8 year deal and maximize how much he will get on his final big contract. Unless the team he wants to sign with isn't trading for him, he can facilitate the contract now and get an extra year. The team getting him can also get a smaller AAV though they are giving him more money overall.