GDT: Honoring Greatness: Your New Jersey Devils (38-15-5) vs. Philadelphia Flyers (23-27-10), 7 PM, MSGSN

[JimEIV]

That's how arbitration works. It is in fact, one of the fairest contracts in the league.

They didn't go to arbitration. He should have.

 

[Its Always Sundstrom]

 

[JimEIV]

Mercer

 

[Whaddagoal]

I think we can be fairly certain that Bratt wasn't offered fair value based solely on the fact that he has a one year deal worth 5.4M.

Bratt is making just about the same as Tatar is this year in actual dollars. That's not right.

Slightly under, maybe I would have given him 6 or 6.5 max for 1 year show me.

Perhaps Fitz and NJD really dont like his agent/negotiation practices. Perhaps there is more behind the curtain we dont see where it shows he isnt committed to the team long term. (Purely Speculation of course)

 

[Triumph]

They didn't go to arbitration. He should have.

No shit. They split the difference of their asks in arbitration, which is what the arbitrator generally does anyway. Everyone knows what's involved there.

 

[Devs3cups]

nvm

I think either they sign Mercer long-term soon, or they'll have to give him fair market value after 3-4 years, which I'm not all that worried about assuming the cap finally starts to inch back upward by then.

I could see Fitz being willing to give more money quicker to Mercer given he has had a better start to his career than Bratt. He also drafted him, etc. I’m not worried about that in the slightest.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

I could see Fitz being willing to give more money, more quickly to Mercer given he has had a better start to his career than Bratt.

That wouldn't make sense, Bratt's gonna be barely shy of PPG at the worst for 2 years in a row. You don't pay guys for how their careers start lol

 

[Whaddagoal]

Amazing they replicated that on a cup anniversay celebration day (albeit the earlier cup)...

Literally to the T.

 

[JimEIV]

No shit. They split the difference of their asks in arbitration, which is what the arbitrator generally does anyway. Everyone knows what's involved there.

You think the arbiter would have split the difference between 4.1 and 6.5? Coming off a 73 point season?

Regardless look at those two numbers. One looks much more good faith to me than the other all things considered.

 

[Devs3cups]

That wouldn't make sense, Bratt's gonna be barely shy of PPG at the worst for 2 years in a row. You don't pay guys for how their careers start lol

I meant to say that I could see Fitz giving a big contract to Mercer as soon as this summer given his career start and arc.

Of course I wasn’t talking about right now. I’d pay Bratt now.

You think the arbiter would have split the difference between 4.1 and 6.5?

Regardless look at those two numbers. One looks much more good faith to me than the other all things considered.

It was reported that Fitz offered Bratt over Nico’s number and slightly under Hughes’ number and that negotiations were cut off by Bratt’s camp right then and there.

 

[Triumph]

You think the arbiter would have split the difference between 4.1 and 6.5?

Regardless look at those two numbers. One looks much more good faith to me than the other all things considered.

There isn't any good faith in arbitration. You ask for the biggest or smallest number you can think of based on comaprables and go from there. What ends up making it reasonably good faith is that splitting the difference is where it 'should' end up.

Very few players sign RFA only deals, those that do are generally bad or their teams are cap-strapped. The comparables are tough to find. This has warped everyone's perception of what RFA years are worth. Bratt's deal is bringing a dose of reality to the whole thing.

 

[JimEIV]

It was reported that Fitz offered Bratt over Nico’s number and slightly under Hughes’ number and that negotiations were cut off by Bratt’s camp right then and there.

That may have been reported, but it doesn't seem to at all jive with his 6.5 ask heading towards arbitration?

 

[Devs3cups]

That may have been reported, but it doesn't seem to at all jive with his 6.5 ask heading towards arbitration?

I mean, Fitz probably didn’t offer him about 4 mil either, so it’s most likely 2 camps going low to avoid arb. Wouldn’t be surprised if Fitz offered Bratt about 7.85 mil and Bratt just shut down.

 

[Omar Little]

That may have been reported, but it doesn't seem to at all jive with his 6.5 ask heading towards arbitration?

One year vs multi year

 

[JimEIV]

I mean, Fitz probably didn’t offer him about 4 mil either, so it’s most likely 2 camps going low to avoid arb. Wouldn’t be surprised if Fitz offered Bratt about 7.85 mil and Bratt just shut down.

For 8 years maybe.... I'd shut it down too.

Fitz was trying to get extra UFA years low cost. Nico and Jack contracts expire at 28....and they want to take Bratt into his 30's at a "fair price" in today's dollars. I'd shut that down too.

Now if you said 4 years at 7.8, I guarantee you Bratt would be signed to that deal in a second.

 

[Devs3cups]

For 8 years maybe.... I'd shut it down too.

Fitz was trying to get extra UFA years low cost. Nico and Jack contracts expire at 28....and they want to take Bratt into his 30's at a "fair price" in today's dollars. I'd shut that down too.

Now if you said 4 years at 7.8, I guarantee you Bratt would be signed to that deal in a second.

You would’ve shut down the first offer slightly under 8 with no counter offer or negotiations? More power to you I guess.

 

[JimEIV]

You would’ve shut down the first offer slightly under 8 with no counter offer or negotiations? More power to you I guess.

Yup. I wouldn't negotiate those later years at a "fair price"

 

[devilsblood]

I meant to say that I could see Fitz giving a big contract to Mercer as soon as this summer given his career start and arc.

Of course I wasn’t talking about right now. I’d pay Bratt now.

Bratt vs Mercer early career comparison is pretty interesting. Both started their NHL careers in their +2. Edit: though Mercer was nearly a full year older.

Bratt Rookie year: 13-22-35 in 74 gp.
Bratt 2nd year. 8-25-33 in 51 gp.

Totals 21-47-68 in 125 gp.

Mercer Rookie year 17-25-42 in 82 gp
Mercer 2nd year 19-20- 39 in 59 gp(thus far).

Totals 36-45-81 in 141.

Need to factor in Mercer is playing on a more talented team, but he has produced at a better rate, scores goals at a much better rate, has played every game and has maintained a consistent level of play, while Bratt came out of the box on fire in his rookie year before fading badly, and then missed a bunch of games in his rookie year.

On the other hand, and maybe I'm allowing Bratt's more recent play influence my view, but I did think Bratt showed more potential in those early years, especially his initial burst as a rookie, but needed to prove he could maintain a high level of play without fatiguing, and prove he could stay on the ice in general.

 

[JimEIV]

Bratt vs Mercer early career comparison is pretty interesting. Both started their NHL careers in their +2. Edit: though Mercer was nearly a full year older.

Bratt Rookie year: 13-22-35 in 74 gp.
Bratt 2nd year. 8-25-33 in 51 gp.

Totals 21-47-68 in 125 gp.

Mercer Rookie year 17-25-42 in 82 gp
Mercer 2nd year 19-20- 39 in 59 gp(thus far).

Totals 36-45-81 in 141.

Need to factor in Mercer is playing on a more talented team, but he has produced at a better rate

Those rates are nearly identical?

81 in 141 is .57 PPG

68 in 125 is .54 PPG

 

[swiiscompos]

Those rates are nearly identical?

81 in 141 is .57 PPG

68 in 125 is .54 PPG

Yes, and one is a better rate than the other.

 

[devilsblood]

Those rates are nearly identical?

81 in 141 is .57 PPG

68 in 125 is .54 PPG

Yes, and one is a better rate than the other.

Ya, and one is much more goal heavy as well.

 

[JimEIV]

Yes, and one is a better rate than the other.

Yeah 2 points over 82 games better...lol.

 

[Bleedred]

Got done watching the full game and ceremony, is it just me or does Rafalski look almost exactly like he did 20 years ago? Everybody else looks 20 years older (especially Niedermayer but he's been gray since he was still playing). Langenbrunner looks pretty rough too, but he's been a cranky old man since like 2010.

Yeah, he has a bit of belly (probably only noticeable due to tucked in shirt) but yeah, his face hasn’t aged. Someone else commented on that. And I’m pretty sure he hardly had any hair 15-20 years ago or it was that really thin blonde hair that a lot of blonde guys have.

I thought Langs looked like hell when I first saw him, but then after looking at him a bit more, he didn’t look so bad to me. He’s just really full in the face and significantly gray on the sides of his head. I guess I just remember him looking pretty young still the last he played.

Sarge still looks really good.

The only two guys that stick out as particularly looking like they could get out there on the ice today are Elias and Stevens. Elias is probably one of the youngest guys of that group and Stevens might be the oldest.

It’s not that Nieds looks like he can’t play anymore, he just looks like a skinny middle aged school teacher or office nerd haha. Nieds also looks like he’s holding onto the last bit of his hair. I had to look up pics of him while he was still a player, as I didn’t remember him having thinning/receding hair, but I guess he kind of did then too.

I’m surprised Gomer has stayed thin in his post playing days, as he was lambasted for his conditioning and weight all throughout his career and has always referred to himself as chubby.

Marty’s constantly fluctuated with his weight since he retired. I remember him looking even bigger at his number retirement ceremony than he did last night, but I’ve also seen him thinner in his post playing days too. They’ve shown him sitting down fairly recently and his thighs didn’t even look all that thick.

I’m not sure if Stevens still works out frequently to retain his shape or not, but he’s still got a good set of shoulders and he doesn’t have a gut or anything.

 

[JimEIV]

I'm a couple of years older than most of the 2003 team and look much better

 

[Its Always Sundstrom]

I would say Bastian goal was the ‘03 tribute. Tipped in the slot by a big guy, similar to Rupp’s if not as exact.