HOH Top-50 Non-NHL Europeans Project - Preliminary & General Discussion Thread

[VMBM]

Top Czech players vs. USSR

So, some top Czech players' statistics in the major tournaments against the Soviet Union. Since poster CZechSenator had already done most of them, I unshamedly used them here also, but changed some stats a little bit here and there (for Martinec, Hlinka & Lala). For example, according to a reliable contemporary source (the Swedish Ã…rets ishockey 1971) Martinec assisted on Bohuslav Stastny's goal in the 2nd game vs. the Soviets at the 1971 WHC, which Czech Wikipedia had missed - I edited also the Wikipedia page.

I also compiled Jiri Holik's stats vs. USSR; fairly OK! ... considering that he was also noted for his two-way play.

None of the CSSR players' statistics are mindblowing (except maybe Martinec in his prime 1972-77), but it should be taken into consideration that Czechoslovakia usually had 3 equally strong lines, rather than one undisputed super top line. And, of course, the Soviets were a pretty tough opponent, especially from 1978/9 on... I don't think e.g. Lala's stats can be directly compared to those of the 1970s Czech stars.

Jan Suchý - 11GP - 2+2 - 0.36 PPG

Tournament|Age|GP|G|A|PTS
WC 1965|21|1|0|0|0
WC 1966|22|1|0|0|0
WC 1967|23|1|0|0|0
OG 1968|24|1|0|1|1
WC 1969|25|1|1|1|2
WC 1970|26|2|0|0|0
WC 1971|27|2|1|0|1
WC 1974|30|2|0|0|0

Jiří Holík - 26 GP - 5+9 - 0.54 PPG

Tournament|Age|GP|G|A|PTS

OG 1964|19|1|0|1|1
WC 1965|20|1|0|0|0
WC 1966|21|1|0|0|0
WC 1967|22|1|0|0|0
OG 1968 |23|1|0|0|0
WC 1969 |24|2|1|2|3
WC 1970|25|2|0|1|1
WC 1971|26|2|0|2|2
OG 1972|27|1|0|0|0
WC 1972|27|2|0|0|0
WC 1973|28|2|1|1|2
WC 1974|29|2|1|0|1
WC 1975|30|2|1|0|1
OG 1976|31|1|0|0|0
WC 1976|31|2|0|2|2
CC 1976|32|1|0|0|0
WC 1977|32|2|1|0|1

Václav Nedomanský - 17GP - 7+1 - 0.47 PPG

Tournament|Age|GP|G|A|PTS
WC 1965|21|1|0|0|0
WC 1966|22|1|0|0|0
WC 1967|23|1|0|0|0
OG 1968|24|1|0|0|0
WC 1969|25|1|1|0|1
WC 1970|26|2|0|0|0
WC 1971|27|2|2|0|2
OG 1972|28|1|0|0|0
WC 1972|28|2|1|0|1
WC 1973|29|2|2|0|2
WC 1974|30|2|1|1|2

Vladimír Martinec - 24GP - 7+8 - 0.625 PPG

Tournament|Age|GP|G|A|PTS
WC 1970|20|1|0|0|0
WC 1971|21|2|0|1|1
OG 1972|22|1|1|0|1
WC 1972|22|2|0|2|2
WC 1973|23|2|0|0|0
WC 1974|24|2|2|1|3
WC 1975|25|2|0|0|0
OG 1976|26|1|0|0|0
WC 1976|26|2|1|2|3
CC 1976|26|1|1|1|2
WC 1977|27|2|2|1|3
WC 1978|28|2|0|0|0
WC 1979|29|2|0|0|0
WC 1981|31|2|0|0|0

In years 1972-77 14 points in 15 matches.

Ivan Hlinka - 20GP - 8+4 - 0.6 PPG

Tournament|Age|GP|G|A|PTS
WC 1971|21|2|0|0|0
OG 1972|22|1|0|1|1
WC 1972|22|1|0|0|0
WC 1973|23|1|0|0|0
WC 1974|24|2|2|0|2
WC 1975|25|1|0|0|0
OG 1976|26|1|1|0|1
WC 1976|26|2|2|0|2
CC 1976|26|1|0|0|0
WC 1977|27|2|0|2|2
WC 1978|28|2|2|0|2
WC 1979|29|2|1|0|1
WC 1981|31|2|0|1|1

Milan Nový - 15GP - 5+5 - 0.67 PPG

Tournament|Age|GP|G|A|PTS
WC 1975|24|2|0|0|0
OG 1976|25|1|1|0|1
WC 1976|25|2|0|1|1
CC 1976|25|1|2|1|3
WC 1977|26|2|1|1|2
WC 1978|27|1|0|1|1
WC 1979|28|1|0|1|1
WC 1981|30|1|0|0|0
CC 1981|30|2|1|0|1
WC 1982|30|2|0|0|0

Jiří Lála - 14 GP - 5+1 - 0.43 PPG

Tournament|Age|GP|G|A|PTS
WC 1981|22|2|1|1|2
CC 1981|22|2|1|0|1
WC 1982|23|2|1|0|1
WC 1983|24|2|0|0|0
OG 1984|25|1|0|0|0
CC 1984|25|1|0|0|0
WC 1985|26|2|1|0|1
WC 1986|27|1|0|0|0
OG 1988|29|1|1|0|1

 

[VMBM]

Please, also note that the stats can differ from other sources.
If they do, someone will have to break them down tournament by tournament (game by game in some cases). I will then adjust the stats if necessary.

Yep, they often do.

I think that Milan Novy, for example, might have played a little more games and scored a little more points than 80 and 90, respectively. I have no time & energy to get more deeply into that now, but maybe tomorrow. I'm pretty sure your stats are 'in the right ballpark', so to speak (based on a quick glance).

 

[Theokritos]

any reason you don't want to submit a top-100? or 200?

Because this project admin right here is having none of that.

 

[Robert Gordon Orr]

I will post shortly stats of some top Czechoslovak players vs. USSR too.

Thanks for the breakdown. It's always interesting to see how the players did against top quality opposition. It also will add some weight to the ranking when comparing players.

I think that Milan Novy, for example, might have played a little more games and scored a little more points than 80 and 90, respectively. I have no time & energy to get more deeply into that now, but maybe tomorrow. I'm pretty sure your stats are 'in the right ballpark', so to speak (based on a quick glance).

You are absolutely right. I adjusted the stats accordingly. I left out Nový's 1981 Canada Cup stats. Now it's fixed and should be correct.
Thanks for pointing that out.

 

[DN28]

I know that the first official league season was not played until 1936/37, but the championship was held before then with an irregular format.
Below are stats from my research years ago that was very thorough. In this case between 1930 and 1940.
I am aware that some of the goal totals differ from what can be found online and in old books.

Yes, since 1930 championships in Czechoslovakia were held every year. But my sources are just history books and internet and there are no statistics about players (before 1936), only which teams played and won. Where did you find those stats? Some old newspaper? If so, is it by any chance available online?

 

[Robert Gordon Orr]

Yes, since 1930 championships in Czechoslovakia were held every year. But my sources are just history books and internet and there are no statistics about players (before 1936), only which teams played and won. Where did you find those stats? Some old newspaper? If so, is it by any chance available online?

This research was done at the Národní Knihovna in Prague where I went through every available newspaper that had any sports coverage. It took me several visits to Prague in order to get it done, in a span of about five years.

 

[Theokritos]

Mike Buckna - they certainly didn´t like each other. They had disputes about tactics and especially for Buckna nominating some older players instead of some young ones (Zabrodsky´s brother for example). LTC played some exhibition in Switzerland in 1947 or 1948 and according to Zabrodsky, Buckna (who was playing) wanted to show that he is better than him and Konopasek so Buckna was playing tough and hit their linemate Vladimir Muller 2 times. He died few hours later as his spleen was damaged. This was before that plane crasch..

Now that is a wild and tragic story if I have ever heard one. Provided it is actually true. So I decided to look into it and here's what I can come up with for the time being:

-The player's name was actually Vladislav (not Vladimir) Müller.
-According to this site, he died on March 15th 1947 at the age of 22.
-According to this note he died of injuries suffered on March 5th 1947 during a match against an American army team.
-More details on this site: Müller was injured during a game in Munich when he crashed into the boards after a collision with the goalkeeper. No serious issues apparent in the immediate aftermath, but the next day he had to be taken to the hospital where they found his kidney was torn and he was suffering severe internal bleeding. On March 15th he passed away.
-And finally, a paper from the Charles University in Prague (click here to download as PDF file) confirms (footnote 65, see p.25-26 of the file) that Müller crashed into the boards after colliding with the goaltender in an international match in Munich on March 5th 1947. He finished the match, but by the evening of the same day he was feeling sick. The next day his condition had deteriorated so much that he was rushed to the hospital. He underwent surgery, but died of his internal injuries on March 15th.

Sad and tragic indeed, but not as sensational and infamous as the version Zábrodský seems to offer. Surely does not reflect well on Zábrodský to paint the coach he didn't get along with in such a malicious light contrary to the (alleged) facts.

 

[DN28]

Now that is a wild and tragic story if I have ever heard one. Provided it is actually true. So I decided to look into it and here's what I can come up with for the time being:

-The player's name was actually Vladislav (not Vladimir) Müller.
-According to this site, he died on March 15th 1947 at the age of 22.
-According to this note he died of injuries suffered on March 5th 1947 during a match against an American army team.
-More details on this site: Müller was injured during a game in Munich when he crashed into the boards after a collision with the goalkeeper. No serious issues apparent in the immediate aftermath, but the next day he had to be taken to the hospital where they found his kidney was torn and he was suffering severe internal bleeding. On March 15th he passed away.
-And finally, a paper from the Charles University in Prague (click here to download as PDF file) confirms (footnote 65, see p.25-26 of the file) that Müller crashed into the boards after colliding with the goaltender in an international match in Munich on March 5th 1947. He finished the match, but by the evening of the same day he was feeling sick. The next day his condition had deteriorated so much that he was rushed to the hospital. He underwent surgery, but died of his internal injuries on March 15th.

Sad and tragic indeed, but not as sensational and infamous as the version Zábrodský seems to offer. Surely does not reflect well on Zábrodský to paint the coach he didn't get along with in such a malicious light contrary to the (alleged) facts.

Yes, it was Vladislav Muller not Vladimir. It wasn´t match against american team, there were two LTC teams playing against with addition of some american soldiers. One team was lead by Zabrodsky, other team was lead by Buckna. Zabrodsky did not mention any collision with goaltender.
Here´s my translation:

Vladimír Zábrodský, p. 132-133: "In this game Vláďa Muller was tragically injured. In newspapers was written that he crashed into the boards. But it isn´t the whole truth, he was hit on that boards by Mike Buckna. He hit him twice. Maybe Vláďa was hurt after first collision already but he kept playing. Buckna then hit him one more time and it is quite possible that by this hit Muller was getting worse. Of course, I can´t say on hundred percent that Vláďa´s troubles were created just in battles with Buckna but he had no more tough fights in that game. Mike went to the game very aggressively, he wanted to show me and Konopásek that he is still better than us.

This research was done at the Národnà Knihovna in Prague where I went through every available newspaper that had any sports coverage. It took me several visits to Prague in order to get it done, in a span of about five years.

That´s awesome!

 

[VMBM]

Player | Country | Years | Games | Goals | Assists | Points
10.Vladimir Martinec |Czechoslovakia|1970-1981| 123 |68| 67|

135​

|

I struggle to find 123 WC, OG & CC Games Played for Vladimir Martinec. I can only get to 119 at best, and even then I count the first round games in the 1972 & 1976 Olympics (1 + 1 games, respectively), which all sources do not count.

Here is my tournament by tournament breakdown:
Martinec at the World Championships, Olympics, Canada Cup

Tournament|Games Played
WC 1970|6*
WC 1971|10
OG 1972|6
WC 1972|10
WC 1973|8
WC 1974|10
WC 1975|9
OG 1976|6
WC 1976|10
CC 1976|7
WC 1977|10
WC 1978|10
WC 1979|7
OG 1980|2
WC 1981|8
TOTAL|119

* Though according to the Czech Wikipedia he actually played only 5 games at the 1970 World Championships

Of course we can't get every stat for every player exactly right, so maybe this is becoming a bit too pedantic? Sorry about that...

 

[Robert Gordon Orr]

I struggle to find 123 WC, OG & CC Games Played for Vladimir Martinec. I can only get to 119 at best, and even then I count the first round games in the 1972 & 1976 Olympics (1 + 1 games, respectively), which all sources do not count.

Here is my tournament by tournament breakdown:...


* Though according to the Czech Wikipedia he actually played only 5 games at the 1970 World Championships

Of course we can't get every stat for every player exactly right, so maybe this is becoming a bit too pedantic? Sorry about that...

Thanks for that. I checked Martinec stats and I agree that the correct number should be 118 games in total (he only dressed for 5 games in 1970).
So I made the adjustment in the table. That's great, we should always strive for accuracy, so if you have any more guys that don't add up then please let me know.

 

[Batis]

Player | Country | Years | Games | Goals | Assists | Points
13.Anatoli Firsov |Soviet Union|1964-1972| 66|64| 51|

115​

|
15.Veniamin Aleksandrov |Soviet Union|1957-1964| 72|65| 47|

112​

|

If we are inluding the qualification game in 72 and 76 we should also include the qualification game in 64. And Firsovs stats from that game is missing here. Including that game where Firsov scored 2 goals his total should be 67 gp, 66 g, 51 a, 117 pts.

Alexandrovs international career was between 1957 and 1968 and by my count he played 76 games in major international tournaments (If we include the qualification game in 64).

 

[Robert Gordon Orr]

If we are inluding the qualification game in 72 and 76 we should also include the qualification game in 64. And Firsovs stats from that game is missing here. Including that game where Firsov scored 2 goals his total should be 67 gp, 66 g, 51 a, 117 pts.

Alexandrovs international career was between 1957 and 1968 and by my count he played 76 games in major international tournaments (If we include the qualification game in 64).

You are absolutely right. I am working on updating the top scoring list. I will add all the Olympic qualification games.

 

[Robert Gordon Orr]

Here is an updated list.

- World Championships
- European Championships
- Wintersportwoche (Unofficial European Championships in 1940 and 1941)
- Olympics (including qualification games in 1964, 1972 and 1976)
- Canada Cup
- World Cup

Player | Country | Years | Games | Goals | Assists | Points
1.Aleksander Maltsev |Soviet Union|1969-1983| 137|98| 95|

193​

|
2.Valeri Kharlamov |Soviet Union|1969-1980| 123|89| 102|

191​

|
3.Sergei Makarov |Soviet Union|1978-1991| 145|82| 100|

182​

|
4.Boris Mikhailov |Soviet Union|1969-1980| 120|108| 72|

180​

|
5.Vladimir Petrov |Soviet Union|1969-1981| 117|82| 85|

167​

|
6.Josef Maleček |Czechoslovakia|1922-1940| 80|97| 62|

159​

|
7.Sven ‘Tumba’ Johansson |Sweden|1952-1966| 97|86| 56|

142​

|
8.Vyacheslav Fetisov |Soviet Union/Russia|1977-1996| 139|51| 93|

144​

|
9.Vladimir Krutov |Soviet Union|1980-1989| 112|74| 64|

138​

|
10.Vladimir Martinec |Czechoslovakia|1970-1981| 118|68| 67|

135​

|
11.Vladimir Zábrodský |Czechoslovakia|1947-1956| 44|78| 44|

132​

|
12.Anatoli Firsov |Soviet Union|1964-1972| 67|66| 51|

117​

|
13.Jiři Holik |Czechoslovakia|1964-1977|142|59| 58|

117​

|
14.Veniamin Aleksandrov |Soviet Union|1957-1968| 76|68| 48|

116​

|
15.Riccardo ’Bibi’ Torriani |Switzerland|1928-1948| 69|62| 52|

114​

|
16.Václav Nedomanský |Czechoslovakia|1965-1974| 93|78| 32|

110​

|
17.Ville Peltonen |Finland|1994-2010| 145|46| 62|

108​

|
18.Vlastimil Bubnik |Czechoslovakia|1952-1964| 63|60| 45|

105​

|
19.Erich Kühnhackl |West Germany|1972-1985| 90|55| 50|

105​

|
20.Ivan Hlinka|Czechoslovakia|1970-1981| 108|53| 52|

105​

|
21.Uli Poltéra |Switzerland|1947-1954| 54|72| 31|

103​

|
22.Aleksander Yakushev |Soviet Union|1967-1979| 93|63| 40|

103​

|
23.Sergei Kapustin |Soviet Union|1974-1983| 97|63| 40|

103​

|
24.Teemu Selänne |Finland|1991-2014| 96|54| 48|

102​

|
25.Jaromir Jágr |Czechosl./Czech R.|1990-| 121|47| 55|

102​

|
26.Vladimir Vikulov |Soviet Union|1966-1976| 79|55| 46|

101​

|
27.Ronald ‘Sura Pelle’ Pettersson |Sweden|1955-1967| 87|52| 49|

99​

|
28.Vyacheslav Bykov |Soviet Union/Russia|1983-1995| 108|47| 50|

97​

|
29.Andrei Khomutov |Soviet Union/Russia|1981-1995| 122|45| 52|

97​

|
30.Ilya Kovalchuk |Russia|2002-| 111|44| 52|

96​

|
31.Vyacheslav Starshinov |Soviet Union|1961-1971| 79|64| 31|

95​

|
32.Mats Sundin |Sweden|1990-2006| 79|43| 51|

94​

|
33.Saku Koivu |Finland|1993-2010| 89|30| 64|

94​

|
34.Milan Nový |Czechoslovakia|1975-1982| 86|53| 40|

93​

|
35.Aleksei Kasatonov |Soviet Union|1980-1991| 125|28| 65|

93​

|
36.Nisse Nilsson |Sweden|1956-1967| 63|58| 34|

92​

|
37.Gerd Truntschka |W. Germany/Germany|1979-1993| 108|31| 59|

90​

|
38.Miroslav Šatan |Slovakia|1994-2014| 117|47| 42|

89​

|
39.Raimo Helminen|Finland|1984-2002| 140|18| 70|

88​

|
40.Konstantin Loktev |Soviet Union|1957-1966| 55|50| 36|

86​

|
41.Ulf Sterner |Sweden|1960-1973| 87|47| 39|

86​

|
42.Dieter Hegen |W. Germany/Germany|1982-1998| 147|55| 29|

84​

|
43.Vladimir Shadrin |Soviet Union|1970-1977| 71|41| 43|

84​

|
44.Igor Larionov |Soviet Union/Russia|1982-2002| 98|36| 47|

83​

|
45.Wayne Gretzky |Canada|1981-1998| 55|26| 56|

82​

|
46.Ferdinand ‘Pic’ Cattini |Switzerland|1933-1949| 60|53| 28|

81​

|
47.Tord Lundström |Sweden|1965-1976| 92|46| 34|

80​

|
48.Viktor Zhluktov |Soviet Union|1976-1983| 88|36| 44|

80​

|
49.Daniel Alfredsson|Sweden|1995-2014| 92|32| 47|

79​

|
50.Evgeny Malkin|Russia|2005-| 69|37| 40|

77​

|

Let me know if you see any errors.

 

[VMBM]

I ran into this Swedish 'hockey yearbook' called Ã…rets ishockey 1971, and it basically includes all the happenings in the hockey world during the 1970-71 season, obviously mostly from the Swedish perspective. A very detailed book! The play in Sweden/Swedish leagues take about two thirds of the book, and it almost seems that it has information on games played in some guys' backyard even, hah!

My interest has obviously centered around the international content, of which the 1971 World Championships are naturally the most covered. There is some interesting stuff there:

- Tord Lundström was apparently the 'only Swedish star' in the tournament

- The general feeling at the time was that even though the Soviets won the world championship, Czechoslovakia was the 'moral winner' of the tournament, since they tied & beat (3-3 and 5-2, respectively) the Soviets and won the European championship (=only the results in the games between the European teams were counted). Their inexplicable 5-1 loss to poor USA prevented them winning the whole tournament. Jiri Holecek and Jan Suchy are named the biggest culprits to the loss, but they were apparently also the biggest heroes in the games vs. USSR et co. It seems that Holecek's 'NA phobia' started around this time - manifesting itself later e.g. at the 1972 Olympics (again, 5-1 loss vs. USA) and 1976 Canada Cup (CSSR had to settle for 4-4 tie vs. USA in the round-robin).

- Czechoslovakia is also considered the best (European) team of the 1970-71 season; they won the 1970 Izvestia tournament ('mini-WHC') in December and won most of their games vs. USSR, and were actually considered the gold medal favourites in the 1971 World Championships. Even though it didn't happen, it is already (correctly) predicted in the book that CSSR will likely win the world championship in 1972 in Prague. All in all, quite a different tone to the often heard North American beliefs that "the Soviets didn't have any competition" or that "they were just beating college kids at the Olympics". Oh the ignorance!

- As far as the Soviets go, there is quite a 'concern' about the fact that 8 players on the Soviet WHC team were already 30 or over. Could they succesfully rejuvenate the team? The history shows that they could (in 1973-75, they were very succesful), but they were hardly considered unbeatable around this time & unforeseeable future.

- A very interesting piece of information for me is that even though Kharlamov, Petrov and Mikhailov were #2, # 4 and # 5 scorers in the tournament, respectively, Anatoli Tarasov was disappointed in their play (sans Petrov). According to some other sources, though, the MPK line was the best line at the 1971 WHC, but for some reason, Tarasov was not happy. So, as we know, Tarasov decided to break up the line in the following season and as a result, Kharlamov played with Firsov and Vikulov plus Ragulin and Tsygankov in defense in 1971-72; Mikhailov and Petrov played with Yuri Blinov. This would also have its consequences in the 1972 Summit Series, since Kharlamov played mostly with Vikulov and Maltsev in the Series, and the MPK line was reassembled - with great success - only after that.


The book also has overviews on the domestic play in all of the most notable hockey countries of the world.
In the Soviet league, Moscow Dynamo was having a great season and were the best team during the first half; especially the play of Maltsev and Tjitjurin and Bjelonozjkin (Swedish spelling) is complimented. However, CSKA - when Tarasov had returned to coach the team - rallied and won the league championship, although it is noted that injuries to some important Dynamo players might have also played a big part in that. Here it is also mentioned that many of the key players on CSKA were over 30. Other cases of concern (in Soviet hockey in general) are the lack of really good defensemen, especially the offensive dmen who could support the attack, like Jan Suchy for the Czechs. Yuri Lyapkin (Khimik) is mentioned, but it is said that Tarasov and Chernyshev preferred defencemen just to pass the puck directly to the forwards rather than to carry the puck/join the attack themselves, and so Lyapkin hasn't gotten much ice-time on the national team. The lack of many really good centers is also seen as a great weakness; Maltsev gets a seal of approval, but Petrov did not have a great season (domestically, at least), and Starshinov is already too old & slow to be effective both on offense and defence. Interestingly, there is no mention of Vladimir Shadrin yet. Maybe this is also one of the reasons why Tarasov made Firsov a center for the 1971-72 season; after all, he was clearly a versatile player.

 

[VMBM]

- A very interesting piece of information for me is that even though Kharlamov, Petrov and Mikhailov were #2, # 4 and # 5 scorers in the tournament, respectively, Anatoli Tarasov was disappointed in their play (sans Petrov).

Oops, I was a little inaccurate; the book actually doesn't quote Tarasov, so maybe it's just the writer's (Bobby Byström) view, i.e. Tarasov probably was or should've been disappointed in their play...

 

[Sentinel]

Here is an updated list.

- World Championships
- European Championships
- Wintersportwoche (Unofficial European Championships in 1940 and 1941)
- Olympics (including qualification games in 1964, 1972 and 1976)
- Canada Cup
- World Cup

GPG and PPG would probably come in handy.

 

[Theokritos]

Question to the board: how many of you intend to be voters and have a top 70 list in the works?

 

[seventieslord]

GPG and PPG would probably come in handy.

you could easily copy that chart into a spreadsheet and add whatever columns you want to add.

 

[Robert Gordon Orr]

GPG and PPG would probably come in handy.

Ok, here you go with the GPG and PPG averages.
Unfortunately I don't have the time to break down how the players did against "quality opponents".

- World Championships
- European Championships
- Wintersportwoche (Unofficial European Championships in 1940 and 1941)
- Olympics (including qualification games in 1964, 1972 and 1976)
- Canada Cup
- World Cup

Player | Country | Years | Games | Goals | Assists | Points | GPG | PPG
1.Aleksander Maltsev |Soviet Union|1969-1983| 137|98| 95|

193​

|

0.715​

|

1.408​

|
2.Valeri Kharlamov |Soviet Union|1969-1980| 122|89| 102|

191​

|

0.729​

|

1.565​

|
3.Sergei Makarov |Soviet Union|1978-1991| 145|82| 100|

182​

|

0.565​

|

1.255​

|
4.Boris Mikhailov |Soviet Union|1969-1980| 120|108| 72|

180​

|

0.900​

|

1.500​

|
5.Vladimir Petrov |Soviet Union|1969-1981| 117|82| 85|

167​

|

0.700​

|

1.427​

|
6.Josef Maleček |Czechoslovakia|1922-1940| 80|97| 64|

161​

|

1.212​

|

2.012​

|
7.Vyacheslav Fetisov |Soviet Union/Russia|1977-1996| 143|51| 95|

146​

|

0.356​

|

1.020​

|
8.Sven ‘Tumba’ Johansson |Sweden|1952-1966| 97|86| 56|

142​

|

0.886​

|

1.463​

|
9.Vladimir Krutov |Soviet Union|1980-1989| 112|74| 64|

138​

|

0.660​

|

1.232​

|
10.Vladimir Martinec |Czechoslovakia|1970-1981| 118|68| 67|

135​

|

0.576​

|

1.144​

|
11.Vladimir Zábrodský |Czechoslovakia|1947-1956| 44|78| 44|

132​

|

1.772​

|

3.000​

|
12.Anatoli Firsov |Soviet Union|1964-1972| 67|66| 51|

117​

|

0.985​

|

1.746​

|
13.Jiři Holik |Czechoslovakia|1964-1977|142|59| 58|

117​

|

0.415​

|

0.823​

|
14.Veniamin Aleksandrov |Soviet Union|1957-1968| 76|68| 48|

116​

|

0.894​

|

1.526​

|
15.Riccardo ’Bibi’ Torriani |Switzerland|1928-1948| 69|62| 52|

114​

|

0.898​

|

1.652​

|
16.Václav Nedomanský |Czechoslovakia|1965-1974| 93|78| 32|

110​

|

0.838​

|

1.182​

|
17.Ville Peltonen |Finland|1994-2010| 145|46| 62|

108​

|

0.317​

|

0.744​

|
18.Vlastimil Bubnik |Czechoslovakia|1952-1964| 63|60| 45|

105​

|

0.952​

|

1.666​

|
19.Erich Kühnhackl |West Germany|1972-1985| 90|55| 50|

105​

|

0.611​

|

1.166​

|
20.Ivan Hlinka|Czechoslovakia|1970-1981| 108|53| 52|

105​

|

0.490​

|

0.972​

|
21.Uli Poltéra |Switzerland|1947-1954| 54|72| 31|

103​

|

1.333​

|

1.907​

|
22.Aleksander Yakushev |Soviet Union|1967-1979| 93|63| 40|

103​

|

0.677​

|

1.107​

|
23.Sergei Kapustin |Soviet Union|1974-1983| 97|63| 40|

103​

|

0.649​

|

1.061​

|
24.Teemu Selänne |Finland|1991-2014| 96|54| 48|

102​

|

0.562​

|

1.062​

|
25.Jaromir Jágr |Czechosl./Czech R.|1990-| 121|47| 55|

102​

|

0.388​

|

0.842​

|
26.Vladimir Vikulov |Soviet Union|1966-1976| 79|55| 46|

101​

|

0.696​

|

1.278​

|
27.Ronald ‘Sura Pelle’ Pettersson |Sweden|1955-1967| 87|52| 49|

99​

|

0.597​

|

1.137​

|
28.Vyacheslav Bykov |Soviet Union/Russia|1983-1995| 108|47| 50|

97​

|

0.435​

|

0.898​

|
29.Andrei Khomutov |Soviet Union/Russia|1981-1995| 122|45| 52|

97​

|

0.368​

|

0.795​

|
30.Ilya Kovalchuk |Russia|2002-| 111|44| 52|

96​

|

0.396​

|

0.864​

|
31.Vyacheslav Starshinov |Soviet Union|1961-1971| 79|64| 31|

95​

|

0.810​

|

1.202​

|
32.Mats Sundin |Sweden|1990-2006| 79|43| 51|

94​

|

0.544​

|

1.189​

|
33.Saku Koivu |Finland|1993-2010| 89|30| 64|

94​

|

0.337​

|

1.056​

|
34.Milan Nový |Czechoslovakia|1975-1982| 86|53| 40|

93​

|

0.616​

|

1.081​

|
35.Aleksei Kasatonov |Soviet Union|1980-1991| 125|28| 65|

93​

|

0.224​

|

0.744​

|
36.Nisse Nilsson |Sweden|1956-1967| 63|58| 34|

92​

|

0.920​

|

1.460​

|
37.Gerd Truntschka |W. Germany/Germany|1979-1993| 108|31| 59|

90​

|

0.287​

|

0.833​

|
38.Miroslav Šatan |Slovakia|1994-2014| 117|47| 42|

89​

|

0.401​

|

0.760​

|
39.Raimo Helminen|Finland|1984-2002| 140|18| 70|

88​

|

0.128​

|

0.628​

|
40.Igor Larionov |Soviet Union/Russia|1982-2002| 103|36| 51|

87​

|

0.349​

|

0.844​

|
41.Konstantin Loktev |Soviet Union|1957-1966| 55|50| 36|

86​

|

0.909​

|

1.563​

|
42.Ulf Sterner |Sweden|1960-1973| 87|47| 39|

86​

|

0.540​

|

0.988​

|
43.Dieter Hegen |W. Germany/Germany|1982-1998| 147|55| 29|

84​

|

0.374​

|

0.571​

|
44.Vladimir Shadrin |Soviet Union|1970-1977| 71|41| 43|

84​

|

0.577​

|

1.183​

|
45.Ferdinand ‘Pic’ Cattini |Switzerland|1933-1949| 60|53| 29|

82​

|

0.883​

|

1.366​

|
46.Viktor Zhluktov |Soviet Union|1976-1983| 90|35| 47|

82​

|

0.388​

|

0.911​

|
47.Wayne Gretzky |Canada|1981-1998| 55|26| 56|

82​

|

0.472​

|

1.490​

|
48.Tord Lundström |Sweden|1965-1976| 92|46| 34|

80​

|

0.500​

|

0.869​

|
49.Daniel Alfredsson|Sweden|1995-2014| 92|32| 47|

79​

|

0.347​

|

0.858​

|
50.Evgeny Malkin|Russia|2005-| 69|37| 40|

77​

|

0.536​

|

1.115​

||

 

[Theokritos]

I ran into this Swedish 'hockey yearbook' called Ã…rets ishockey 1971, and it basically includes all the happenings in the hockey world during the 1970-71 season, obviously mostly from the Swedish perspective...

Superb information. Quite some food for thought and causes to look into.

My interest has obviously centered around the international content, of which the 1971 World Championships are naturally the most covered. There is some interesting stuff there:

- Tord Lundström was apparently the 'only Swedish star' in the tournament

Lundström won the "Golden Skate" for the Best Swedish Player at the World Championship that year, but if you look at the World Championship All-star voting the point totals don't exactly make him look like a standout versus Christer Abrahamsson, Lennart Svedberg, Arne Carlsson and Ulf Sterner. However, in combination with the Golden Skate award (handed out by the Swedish hockey federation or the management of the national team), the highlighting of Lundström in that Swedish book pretty much tells us that he was considered the clear-cut best player on his team by a notable margin, at least in the eye of this compatriots (who obviously the Swedish team closer and knew it better than most international observers).

According to some other sources, though, the MPK line was the best line at the 1971 WHC, but for some reason, Tarasov was not happy.

Interesting, will try to look a bit into this.

In the Soviet league, Moscow Dynamo was having a great season and were the best team during the first half; especially the play of Maltsev and Tjitjurin and Bjelonozjkin (Swedish spelling) is complimented.

The two players mentioned beside Maltsev here were his regular linemates at Dinamo: Yury Chichurin (RW) and Anatoly Belonozhkin (LW). Chichurin was named among the "top 34 Soviet players" in 1970-1971, Belonozhkin wasn't (which would at least put him behind Kharlamov, Firsov, Yakushev, Aleksandr Syrtsov, Yury Glazov and Anatoly Kartayev at LW).

 

[VMBM]

Question to the board: how many of you intend to be voters and have a top 70 list in the works?

That's what I'd like to know too. Hopefully there will be at least 20 or so.

I will certainly make a list and send it (and it is 'in the works' ) - unless it turns out that there are only 5 others.

Superb information. Quite some food for thought and causes to look into.

Sometimes one can't just believe his luck; you just go into a library and - bang - there is a Swedish hockey book from 1971 in the recycle bin (or rather 'shelf'). I've found oh so many other treasures (hockey-related & others) this way too.

Interesting, will try to look a bit into this.

Although I might have misinterpreted somewhat what is said in the book (see post 240), I reckon that it is safe to assume that Tarasov was not all happy about their performance(s), and this, as well as maybe some other reasons, led to his decision to break up the line, even though on surface they didn't seem to play very badly; like said, all of them were top 5 scorers in the tournament and, looking at the box-scores, they scored against the 'good opponents' too.

A Finnish sports book (Talviurheilun sankarit) says something like, 'even though 'Troika Petrova' was the best line both in the 1970 and 1971 World Championships, Tarasov still broke up the line', i.e. rather hinting that there were no particular reasons for it. On the other hand, in his book Kharlamov himself is very critical of their play at the 1970 WHC, although he doesn't say anything about the 1971 tournament. He also discusses in detail about the break up of the MPK line and playing in the new unit with Firsov, Vikulov, Ragulin and Tsygankov, but doesn't name any particular reason for the change. Rather you just get the impression that Tarasov 'wanted to try something new'. In any case, it was a rather succesful experiment (or whatever you want to call it); for example, in the 1972 Olympics and in the Soviet league, Kharlamov & the unit were in a class of their own, whereas Mikhailov and Petrov (playing with Blinov) seemed to have quite a mediocre season.

All in all, it's obvious that even though Mikhailov, Petrov and Kharlamov already gained a lot of attention in their first World Championship in 1969, they weren't the clear-cut top line in 1969-71 yet; that happened only in 1972-73, when they reunited after the 1972 Series vs. the NHL.

 

[Sentinel]

Question to the board: how many of you intend to be voters and have a top 70 list in the works?

I wish I could, but I don't feel competent in the CSSR, Sweden, and Finland players. And Kuchnachl

 

[seventieslord]

Question to the board: how many of you intend to be voters and have a top 70 list in the works?

I intend to be a voter, and I have a rough top-100 list in my head, from which my 70 will be drawn. I haven't put anything to paper though.

 

[VMBM]

The lack of many really good centers is also seen as a great weakness; Maltsev gets a seal of approval, but Petrov did not have a great season (domestically, at least), and Starshinov is already too old & slow to be effective both on offense and defence. Interestingly, there is no mention of Vladimir Shadrin yet.

Heh, I failed to notice/mention that the writer*, for some reason, does not actually considered Maltsev a centre. So, even though Maltsev's play, like said, is complimented and the writer says nice things about the Chichurin-Maltsev-Belonochkin line in the piece, Maltsev is actually called ytterforward, which basically means a winger. I have trouble understanding the logic there. Is it that in Russia, Maltsev was still seen as a winger who just happened to play at centre around this time, both on his club team and on the ntl team (centering Firsov and Vikulov on Team USSR); i.e. he wasn't a centre in the 'traditional sense'? Which could also mean that he played 'too offensively' to be a true centre in the Russian view, no matter how good a player he was. I do not know. The centre position is indeed called "responsible" in the article, and the thing that is said about Starshinov suggests that defensive responsibilities were seen obvious for a centre in the Soviet Union.

* the writer has a Russian name, but I can't find any information anywhere, whether the piece has been translated into Swedish or not; I would think so, but who knows...

Also one thing I forgot to mention concerning the 1971 WHC

- Canada was greatly missed! And this despite the fact that Canadian teams hadn't really been true gold medal contenders in the World Championships/Olympics for quite some time - and actually, even the last silver medal was from 1962, when the Soviet Union and Czechoslovakia did not participate. But the feeling clearly was that the value of the World Championships had dropped, since Canada - any Canada - was not participating. I can somewhat relate to that, but I'd still argue that at least the Soviets, CSSR, Sweden and Finland had all of their best players until 1974 (minus Börje Salming & Inge Hammarström); the true bottom in quality was in 1975-76, when, of the big countries, only USSR and Czechoslovakia had their best or near-best playing at the World Championships.

 

[VMBM]

Wow, such enthusiasm, eh?