Hockey History: Please vote for the 6 best players

[Goomba]

Gretzky, Orr, Howe and Lemieux are obvious. Last 2 spots are hard. I vote Hasek for being the best goalie ever and a homer vote for OV lol. But you can throw any of Bobby Hull, Beliveau, Crosby, Jagr, Bourque or Roy in those spots.

Patrick Roy is not a valid option if Martin Brodeur isnt as well

 

[jetsforever]

Pretty difficult to pick, but I'll vote Gretzky/Lemieux/Orr/Howe/Crosby/Hull

 

[amnesiac]

nvm

 

[amnesiac]

Patrick Roy is not a valid option if Martin Brodeur isnt as well

3 Conn Smythes (2 with teams that had no business winning the Cup)
vs
0

I love Brodeur, but hes not above Roy. I would even put MB behind Plante, Sawchuk, maybe Hall, but definitely above Dryden.

Lemaire was a big part of his success whether we want to admit it or not. Almost any half decent goalie wouldve won a Cup or 2 with that Devils team. Thats not to say he wouldnt have been a great goalie anyway, but he wouldnt have the Wins record or 3 Cups.

 

[amnesiac]

Because they played for specific teams that are popular

so all hockey experts are wrong on constantly ranking him in the top 6-7 whenever the subject comes up. Hes just a popular Hab, thats it. Its not like he was a big part of a dynasty as the 1C, yknow , having 10 CUPS to his name.

Gotcha. Maybe research a little about the player before posting such a garbage opinion.

 

[amnesiac]

Same reason Carbonneau is in the Hall of Fame.

3 Cups+3 Selkes and being one of the greatest defensive forwards of all-time while putting up a respectable 663P over 1300GP MAY have something to do with it. Whether you value that or not is your problem. Most experts had no problem with his induction.

Its not like hes just another Kevin Lowe who even though was a solid Dman, he just HAPPENED to play on the Oilers dynasty.

 

[Bronxxx]

What? No McDavid on the list! Pshaw

 

[Bronxxx]

Seriously. No really seriously. Cyclone Taylor has to be on the list. He averaged
over a goal and over 2 points a game!!! Who else has done that? Who?

 

[Goomba]

3 Conn Smythes (2 with teams that had no business winning the Cup)
vs
0

I love Brodeur, but hes not above Roy. I would even put MB behind Plante, Sawchuk, maybe Hall, but definitely above Dryden.

Lemaire was a big part of his success whether we want to admit it or not. Almost any half decent goalie wouldve won a Cup or 2 with that Devils team. Thats not to say he wouldnt have been a great goalie anyway, but he wouldnt have the Wins record or 3 Cups.

Brodeur single-handidly prevented teams from dumping and chasing, thus creating a new trapezoid rule because it screwed up scoring rates

Brodeur revolutionized the game and was extremely clutch. Hes right there or above Roy IMO; Roy didnt change the game

 

[amnesiac]

Brodeur single-handidly prevented teams from dumping and chasing, thus creating a new trapezoid rule because it screwed up scoring rates

Brodeur revolutionized the game and was extremely clutch. Hes right there or above Roy IMO; Roy didnt change the game

you couldnt be more wrong....

Patrick Roy's impact on the modern NHL

 

[Fataldogg]

are you for real? how do you claim to be hockey fan with statements like that? Honestly.

He was listed before Ovechkin, and he was never as good as Ovechkin. Someone agreed with me too, so I'm not alone, and I'd be willing to bet if you did a head to head poll between the two, it would be a close poll.

The fact that lists like these have Richard but initially omit Ovechkin is flawed in my opinion. This isn't the first time I've seen Richard on a list over Ovechkin, and if the notion is he was better than Ovechkin, I disagree and would say, yes, he is overrated. Richard has no business being placed in front of Ovechkin or in the top-6.

 

[Goomba]

you couldnt be more wrong....

Patrick Roy's impact on the modern NHL

you couldnt be more wrong....

Patrick Roy's impact on the modern NHL

It was a natural progression that was making its way towards butterfly/lower down anyway, Brodeur was a standup guy yet Sort of a butterfly hybrid as well

Roy was just the first to master it

 

[amnesiac]

He was listed before Ovechkin, and he was never as good as Ovechkin. Someone agreed with me too, so I'm not alone, and I'd be willing to bet if you did a head to head poll between the two, it would be a close poll.

The fact that lists like these have Richard but initially omit Ovechkin is flawed in my opinion. This isn't the first time I've seen Richard on a list over Ovechkin, and if the notion is he was better than Ovechkin, I disagree and would say, yes, he is overrated. Richard has no business being placed in front of Ovechkin or in the top-6.

My bad... Ovi above Richard, Im fine with that and probably agree even. But I still think Richard belongs in the top 10. I wouldnt call him "overrated" unless EVERYONE had him 5th.

 

[majormajor]

3 Cups+3 Selkes and being one of the greatest defensive forwards of all-time while putting up a respectable 663P over 1300GP MAY have something to do with it. Whether you value that or not is your problem. Most experts had no problem with his induction.

Its not like hes just another Kevin Lowe who even though was a solid Dman, he just HAPPENED to play on the Oilers dynasty.

The hockey writers thirty years ago voted for the Habs top shutdown center as the best defensive forward in the league. Three times. Okay. I suspect that decision might have involved the same biases involved in his HOF induction. I don't doubt that he was one of the best defensive players of his era but he wouldn't have made it in the Hall if he played for a different team.

 

[Zuluss]

Surprised Ovechkin doesn't have more votes, he would be in my next group with Hull, Crosby, Harvey, Bourque, etc. and probably eventually McDavid.

The reason is probably that Ovechkin and Hull are interchangeable.
Hull was always my #5 and I stuck to my guns and voted Hull and Ovechkin after the Big 4, but I admit having two players that similar in top6 at the expense of someone very different (Hasek maybe?) bugs me a bit. If the question was top10, I would probably go something like Hull-Hasek-Ovechkin-Bourque-Beliveau-Richard/Jagr just to keep it kinda balanced.

 

[Steven Toast]

I went with the big four, then Jagr and Hasek.

 

[Canadiens Ghost]

Brodeur single-handidly prevented teams from dumping and chasing, thus creating a new trapezoid rule because it screwed up scoring rates

Brodeur revolutionized the game and was extremely clutch. Hes right there or above Roy IMO; Roy didnt change the game

This board has some sweet nuggets at times.

 

[Goomba]

This board has some sweet nuggets at times.

The ice was permanently altered by Brodeur

Roy just proved the hybrid/butterfly stance was better than stand up

 

[Mrb1p]

3 Conn Smythes (2 with teams that had no business winning the Cup)
vs
0

I love Brodeur, but hes not above Roy. I would even put MB behind Plante, Sawchuk, maybe Hall, but definitely above Dryden.

Lemaire was a big part of his success whether we want to admit it or not. Almost any half decent goalie wouldve won a Cup or 2 with that Devils team. Thats not to say he wouldnt have been a great goalie anyway, but he wouldnt have the Wins record or 3 Cups.

Brodeur was the reason Lemaires team was so good. Look at the Habs play and watch how Carey compeltely negates the forecheck, that was Brodeur and even more. Lemaire gets shown love for the Devils but he won one championship with the Devils and never replicated his success anywhere else. Marty wasn't even in his prime either.

Weird argument to make IMO. Also a lot of Habs fan would have it Dryden > Roy, his rookie heroics stand tall against anyone in the league. It comes down to longevity for him.

In reality, I think none of the goaltenders have separated themselves to really call one the best out of the bunch, Hasek, Roy, Brodeur, Dryden and Plante are all good candidates. Personally, Id have them in that order, but I wouldn't fault anyone having them any other way. With that said, I don't think they have a case for top 6 ever.

Ovi, Jagr and Hull all have greater cases than the goalies.
Morenz and Shore are intriguing and I think at least, Morenz should be ahead of all of them.
Richard and Beliveau are universally ranked ahead of Patrick, Jacques and Ken, which should close the debate.
Bourque and Harvey showed more dominance than all of them
Sidney and Howe are solid at 4 and 5 imo

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

Patrick Roy is not a valid option if Martin Brodeur isnt as well

Hasek and Roy are a tier above Brodeur.

 

[Goomba]

Hasek and Roy are a tier above Brodeur.

Serious question:

what does this bring to the conversation if you dont include why you think that. Clearly Im already debating with someone who thinks Roy and Hasek are a tier above, hence I made the comment you quoted.

 

[wetcoast]

Gretzky, Howe, Orr, Lemieux, Beliveau, Jagr

Not certain between Hasek & Roy, so it was between both of them or both of Beliveau & Jagr... not easy

Surprised Ovechkin doesn't have more votes, he would be in my next group with Hull, Crosby, Harvey, Bourque, etc. and probably eventually McDavid.

I’m also surprised a bit but his case for 6th isn’t the strongest.

Frankly I'm more surprised that people are taking Beliveau over Crosby and Crosby has passed him easily by now.

 

[wetcoast]

# of scoring titles

Gretzky - 10
Howe - 6
Lemieux - 6
Jagr - 5 ("doesn't belong")
Esposito - 5 (not even a poll option)
Mikita - 4
Hull - 3
Lafleur - 3
McDavid - 3
Crosby - 2
....
Beliveau - 1



I know Sid has 3 cups and is a great two-way center but I think he might be a bit overrated here. Jagr and Esposito should be getting more serious consideration, at least compared to the forwards they outscored. Esposito scored 76 goals to shatter the previous goals in a season record (Bobby Hull's 58).

The case for Esposito being a top 20 player of all time is extremely weak.

The case for top 6 is non existent.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Lemieux
Gretzky
Orr
Crosby
Howe
Hasek

 

[Xspyrit]

Please vote for the 6 best players. You can change your vote.

Are you going to do #7-12 after that?

There's enough separation in the votes to say that Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Howe, Hasek and Crosby have been voted top-6 of all-time