Mac n Gs
Gorton plz
- Jan 17, 2014
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Pittsburgh won because they could roll four lines with relentless speed, back pressure, cycling, and puck control. They didn't need to be physical when they could just blow right by you with numbers.
Player Discussion Henrik Lundqvist part IV
- Thread starter Megustaelhockey
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Pittsburgh won because they could roll four lines with relentless speed, back pressure, cycling, and puck control. They didn't need to be physical when they could just blow right by you with numbers.
Hockey is not like cloth @Siddi with trend - colour & fashion.
My point is that the game has not changed much - if you compare Pengs to Rangers they will certainly out muscle us by a far margin last season and we had an early exit.
And look at the Colombus blue jackets now with 3 games less than NY and 38 pts. in the standing. Hockey is a physical team sport, and Jackets won 6-2 against the Islanders last night with coach Torts - I think it was a mistake to fire him earlier.
https://www.nhl.com/bluejackets/video/postgame-john-tortorella/t-277518916/c-47263403
Anyone like to bet that he will win another stanley cup with physical hockey - Torts playing the right way in my opinion.
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Inferno
Registered User
Hockey is not about speed, physicality, etc.
Generally it's about which team wins among these different metrics...
Health
Goaltending
Luck
Skill
I'm sure there are others...but different styles win every year..generally they are more skilled, more healthy, and more lucky.
Generally it's about which team wins among these different metrics...
Health
Goaltending
Luck
Skill
I'm sure there are others...but different styles win every year..generally they are more skilled, more healthy, and more lucky.
Yup. Possession, positioning, passing, cycling, shot selection, physicality, grit, goaltending you can go on and on. That's why the adv stats are so numerous and the analysis around them is so varied and subjective. Even when you look at one causative factor, there's a million others for every individual, group (F v D), line or the whole team.
Leetch66
Registered User
I think every team has the Kunitz /Hornqvist type guys that battle tooth and nail every shift and go to the slot like it had their last meal awaiting them . I don't think any Cup the last few years was won on ALL SPEED and SKILL .
Henrik is at that age where he is wearing down....the extra games he has played in the post season along with the reg season heavy schedule and the amount of shots he has had to face behind some porous Ranger clubs along with the Olympic and World games all add up. Personally I want him to forget about the games outside the NHL....he did his run at them....time to look after himself and the team that is signing his checks ....that is long overdue for what they are paying him . Even Patrick Roy said no .
Hockey is not like cloth @Siddi with trend - colour & fashion.
My point is that the game has not changed much - if you compare Pengs to Rangers they will certainly out muscle us by a far margin last season and we had an early exit.
And look at the Colombus blue jackets now with 3 games less than NY and 38 pts. in the standing. Hockey is a physical team sport, and Jackets won 6-2 against the Islanders last night with coach Torts - I think it was a mistake to fire him earlier.
https://www.nhl.com/bluejackets/video/postgame-john-tortorella/t-277518916/c-47263403
Anyone like to bet that he will win another stanley cup with physical hockey - Torts playing the right way in my opinion.
The game has actually changed quite a bit over the last decade and the Jackets are winning despite playing Torts hockey not because of it. They are getting goaltending this season, Bob is basicaly doing what Hank did under Torts.
ReggieDunlop68
hey hanrahan!
The King
Unfortunately, the riddle of the sphinx applies to the King as well, but I've been saying that he should have explored other options before signing the last contract because many fans and the media will throw him out like old garbage once he isn't the best anymore.
Unfortunately, the riddle of the sphinx applies to the King as well, but I've been saying that he should have explored other options before signing the last contract because many fans and the media will throw him out like old garbage once he isn't the best anymore.
Open Mind
Registered User
- Nov 14, 2014
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Megustaelhockey
"I like hockey" in Spanish
- Apr 29, 2011
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Guys, I continue to be baffled about why this is so difficult...
Talk about Lundqvist, not about each other.
Talk about Lundqvist, not about each other.
Inferno
Registered User
Hunter Gathers
The Crown
At this point, I don't think he has any real ability to comment. His play has been too poor for him to complain. And he's never been one to talk at length about his game.
Pavel Buchnevich
Drury and Laviolette Must Go
When I calculated it a week ago, Lundqvist had between a .909 and .910 for the past year. Thats really bad, like not even NHL starter caliber.
I don't think there's any goalie controversy yet. At some point, they will go back to Hank, unless Raanta has a Vezina type season. Unless Raanta proves to be that good, its Hank's team. Even though I think Raanta might be a starter in the NHL, I don't think he'll get that chance with the Rangers, regardless of whether Hank's on the team or not.
The real controversy will come in a few years. Raanta is not a big enough fish to cause any problems for Lundqvist. He's a journeyman who might carve out a starter career, but only a top prospect will be able to dent Lundqvist's playing time for more than a few games. Talbot wasn't able to dent Lundqvist either, and he's probably the better goalie a few years after the team traded him for nothing.
How will a 1-2 punch of Lundqvist and Shestyorkin work? Who's 1 and who's 2? Assuming this team is still good, are they really going to be able to make the hall of famer the back up for important games or is he going to start over a likely better goalie in a few years because of his career instead of his current play? Even right now, over the last year, Hank has been the second best goalie on his hockey team. The kid over in St. Petersburg is the best goalie in the second best league in the world, a league that has yielded tons of NHL players. He might already be the best goalie in the system, depending on whether you think Lundqvist is still a top 10 NHL goalie or whether you question whether he's a starter level goalie anymore, like the stats would indicate.
For now, there's little disagreement on the solution. Raanta plays until he starts losing games, then its back to Hank's team. There's no goalie controversy. Unfortunately, and it really is unfortunate because Gorton has made some really nice changes to make this team a Cup Contender or close to it, the controversy is coming in a few years, and while I hope I am wrong about Lundqvists decline and Lundqvist wins this team the Stanley Cup, I figure the decline is already here, and he's starting to become one of the biggest problems with this team, especially when you consider the contract he has, and the position he plays.
I don't think there's any goalie controversy yet. At some point, they will go back to Hank, unless Raanta has a Vezina type season. Unless Raanta proves to be that good, its Hank's team. Even though I think Raanta might be a starter in the NHL, I don't think he'll get that chance with the Rangers, regardless of whether Hank's on the team or not.
The real controversy will come in a few years. Raanta is not a big enough fish to cause any problems for Lundqvist. He's a journeyman who might carve out a starter career, but only a top prospect will be able to dent Lundqvist's playing time for more than a few games. Talbot wasn't able to dent Lundqvist either, and he's probably the better goalie a few years after the team traded him for nothing.
How will a 1-2 punch of Lundqvist and Shestyorkin work? Who's 1 and who's 2? Assuming this team is still good, are they really going to be able to make the hall of famer the back up for important games or is he going to start over a likely better goalie in a few years because of his career instead of his current play? Even right now, over the last year, Hank has been the second best goalie on his hockey team. The kid over in St. Petersburg is the best goalie in the second best league in the world, a league that has yielded tons of NHL players. He might already be the best goalie in the system, depending on whether you think Lundqvist is still a top 10 NHL goalie or whether you question whether he's a starter level goalie anymore, like the stats would indicate.
For now, there's little disagreement on the solution. Raanta plays until he starts losing games, then its back to Hank's team. There's no goalie controversy. Unfortunately, and it really is unfortunate because Gorton has made some really nice changes to make this team a Cup Contender or close to it, the controversy is coming in a few years, and while I hope I am wrong about Lundqvists decline and Lundqvist wins this team the Stanley Cup, I figure the decline is already here, and he's starting to become one of the biggest problems with this team, especially when you consider the contract he has, and the position he plays.
Good for him to get some practice time and rethink the game a bit.
I'm confident he'll come back to normal. The defense will adjust to Hank a bit more.
I could see a long 8-10 week streak of the old Hank. Ideally the Rangers get that kind of goaltending in the playoffs.
I'm confident he'll come back to normal. The defense will adjust to Hank a bit more.
I could see a long 8-10 week streak of the old Hank. Ideally the Rangers get that kind of goaltending in the playoffs.
CHGoalie27
Don't blame the goalie!
JJ
I mean I know you watch this game. You have to be aware of all the times he wss the only one worth a damn on too many nights?? Did he refuse to sign for you or something??
I mean is Mike Richter not great if Lafayette hits the net off the post then Bure gets the OT winner? Cuz Mike Richter was great cup or no cup with 14 hall of famers in front of him.
Greatness of a goalie is objective...like growing up I thought Irbe was the most underrated product of garbage no help...a GREAT goalie. I expect some here to look at some numbers and tell me other wise when they probably never saw more than 11 seconds worth of highlight reel. Or they saw a game where he didnt get a shutout lol
Either way this guy we have is the bar, if you dont play in net you simply don't have the correct point of view. There's no way you can.
LMAO....i mean we were told not to attack the person projecting their point of view, but can we also not paint a big fat target on ourselves and taunt by posting stuff like this?
I mean I know you watch this game. You have to be aware of all the times he wss the only one worth a damn on too many nights?? Did he refuse to sign for you or something??
I mean is Mike Richter not great if Lafayette hits the net off the post then Bure gets the OT winner? Cuz Mike Richter was great cup or no cup with 14 hall of famers in front of him.
Greatness of a goalie is objective...like growing up I thought Irbe was the most underrated product of garbage no help...a GREAT goalie. I expect some here to look at some numbers and tell me other wise when they probably never saw more than 11 seconds worth of highlight reel. Or they saw a game where he didnt get a shutout lol
Either way this guy we have is the bar, if you dont play in net you simply don't have the correct point of view. There's no way you can.
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Post game qoute from Hank after the Devils game.
"forward or goalie, you still have to earn your ice time."
http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/hockey/internationellt/nhl/article24082721.ab
If so Zuci should have been benched in november month - I think he struggle with the schedule at the moment related to top speed and two ways plays. So he has not played top quality hockey until last night.
Personally, I dont really care who is in the net as long we get to the playoffs, but it will be difficult due to our crazy division. Henrik will soon be back for sure - the whole Henrik sit thing is kind of blown up in the media. It`s an non issue in my opinion as long he is healthy and ready to stay in goal on short notice.
Irishguy42
Mr. Preachy
silverfish
got perma'd
A better analysis here would be to use the last three seasons, not the last three games. Last three games have been against Winnipeg, an injury depleted Chicago, and the ever-non-shooting NJD.
Also, we can look at xGA by game this season. Here is where Raanta's games rank in terms of "easiness" (1 being the easiest game of the year), for all situations xGA...
12/8 - 4
12/9 - 10
12/11 - 9
I don't know about anyone else, but I thought the fact that the team uses Hank as a bailout policy has been head-smackingly obvious for years now. 
If they're not relying heavily on Lundqvist to make the big saves, then they aren't using him properly.
If they're not relying heavily on Lundqvist to make the big saves, then they aren't using him properly.
- May 30, 2013
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I don't know about anyone else, but I thought the fact that the team uses Hank as a bailout policy has been head-smackingly obvious for years now.
If they're not relying heavily on Lundqvist to make the big saves, then they aren't using him properly.
Which is why I sincerely hope we never have our franchise player be a goalie again.
Riche16
McCready guitar god
I don't know about anyone else, but I thought the fact that the team uses Hank as a bailout policy has been head-smackingly obvious for years now.
If they're not relying heavily on Lundqvist to make the big saves, then they aren't using him properly.
Completely agree.
Raanta, Talbot, whoever... the team plays differently for the backups than they do w Hank back there. They are enablers. But they don't change when he isn't up for the job of walking in water.
Yes true, but it`s not easy to decide who will be the next franchise player - unique generation talents are usually drafted like A. Matthews at the Leafs. But Rangers have a habit to draft goalies the recent years it seems.
I have no problem with a franchise goalie. I just want them to build a better team around him than they did with Hank in his prime. Ya know, before they give him a retirement contract. The Habs are going to be us in a couple years when Price needs a new deal, and I'd be shocked if he didn't get $10M. That'll essentially close their window.
I mean it's been an okay strategy for the last however many years. It's only really a problem now that Hank is showing a few chinks in his armor.
Megustaelhockey
"I like hockey" in Spanish
- Apr 29, 2011
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Since we feel that the discussion about goaltenders in both player discussion threads has merged, please continue here: http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2161929
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