Has the Oilers pro-scouting department finally turned the corner?

[AddyTheWrath]

Over the decade of darkness, one of the Oilers key organizational weaknesses had always been their ability to identify and acquire the right talent for the team. From signing Mark Fayne because of his performance beside Andy Greene & Andrew Ference for his "cup winning leadership", to handing Nikita Nikitin a $4.5M AAV contract, there are countless examples of how the Oilers management group made the team worse by overpaying for fringe players. This continued in the Chiarelli era: Eberle for Strome for Spooner, Hall for Larsson, the list goes on and on. Let's spare ourselves the details and the pain that comes with it.

Finally, we come to the Holland years. They haven't been perfect - there have been a few misses, some of which were exacerbated by the pandemic (Athanasiou, Green), but there has been a signficant uptick in quality NHL players coming into the organization:

• Zach Hyman, a versatile player who was let go by his former team, has become a key cog in our top 6 and was a major contributor in our WCF appearance
• Cody Ceci, an oft ridiculed defenseman by media/fans alike, has become a stabilizing force in our top 4 and was our steadiest d-man last year on a bargain contract
• Brett Kulak, a smooth skating defenseman who is just entering his prime, formed a respectable partnership with high-event Barrie on the bottom pair last season and looks to push into the top 4 next year
• Evander Kane, a rugged top 6 power forward, who, apart from Draisaitl (and arguably Maroon), formed the best fit on McDavid's wing and led the post-season last year in goals scored
• Jack Campbell, one of the top goaltending free agents available, chose to sign in Edmonton after breaking out with the Toronto Maple Leafs

Now these players aren't as sexy, and they might have been overpaid at the time, but you can't argue that they didn't provide value to the team despite their age:

• Duncan Keith, who became a key mentor & veteran presence for Bouchard and the rest of the team last season and into the playoffs
• Mike Smith, who delivered quality goaltending at a bargain price for 3 years and formed a decent, if not solid, tandem with Koskinen during his time in Edmonton

From rumors, we also can surmise that the Oilers have / had at one point looked into the following players:

• Jacob Markstrom
• Darcy Kuemper
• Patrick Kane
• Connor Brown

All that being said, how do you feel about the Oilers pro-scouting finally turning over a new leaf? Are the recent high profile moves made by Holland & co enough to assuage your fears or are you still skeptical that our management group has what it takes to build a contender?

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[FlameChampion]

I think its better than it was for sure (been rock bottom in the past). But the only way to go was up.

I think they have done fairly well recently picking up established players. They have also paid these established players well. Least they havent completely missed on established players.

I still think theres levels for them to get to though. They have to start finding players who are on the cusp of making it (for cheap) if they want to improve their depth. To give Holland some credit, his patient approach on the amateur side has helped balance getting cheap players (ELC's) that the pro scouts havent really figured out yet.

 

[Satire]

League average scouting now I think. Big improvement, but I wouldn't say they've done enough to make me feel totally confident in them. This is one the few areas (along with the farm team) that I felt really improved during Chia's reign.

 

[TheNumber4]

I like what I’m hearing from Holland Jr. His words inspire confidence.

I don’t like the fact that we had/have like 2-3 pro scouts on staff. How did it get to this point? That’s a failure on management.

So all in all, to be determined.

 

[ManofSteel55]

It isn't hard to be better than Chiarelli. I mean, the guy turned Eberle into Strome (could've been a wash), who he turned into Ryan Spooner, who they couldn't even play. I mean, come on.

 

[Beerfish]

Need more time to evaluate Hyman and Kulak. Hyman was nothing at all special n the reg season, he played well in the playoffs. We as a fan base are famous for anointing some players when they have a bit of success but if they have to payer harder minutes they can fail so let wait with kulak.

We still have stinkers such as Foegle, and of course brassard, guys who do not help at all and cost resources.

I for sure would not at all say we have tuned the corner re pro scouting.

 

[PositiveCashFlow]

I feel like McD is telling management what players to get and retain.

 

[Oilhawks]

Still work to be done, but am ‘very confident’ that Brad Holland will be building a very good team with this 3 additions

 

[Tarus]

Bit early to assess anything. They just hired a new guy who is in the process of building his own staff.

In recent history once you get past the high profile guys(hyman, kane, keith) - Ceci/Kulak were decent under the radar pickups that panned out, but the bottom six has still been a revolving door of useless and ineffective. Foegele was an expensive bomb his first year, the Brassard trade was a complete waste of time and everyone should have known it, and a revolving door of underwhelming players and failed bets is still the norm.

Hopefully it'll change, because the Oiler's top 6 is gridlocked going forward. Effective value players in the bottom six is a main priority of the team's recruitment right now.

 

[Soundwave]

Feel like mostly we're just taking player from the Leafs, lol.

When the Oilers have a half decent bottom 6 then I'll give the pro scouting props, the bottom 6 was still terrible in the playoffs, not one guy made an impact.

Evander Kane, everyone knows he's a good player (30-range goal, attach that to McDavid and it goes higher) we took the risk on him because we were staring down missing the playoffs.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Markstrom and the oilers were 500k apart on a contract. It was more about the oilers not going able to higher

 

[Donner]

Ceci and Kulak are really the only "diamond in the rough finds"

Hyman was a hot commodty and we just paid the most for him. Kane was always good, we just didnt mind the off ice stuff

Campbell is tbd

 

[Oilhawks]

Ceci and Kulak are really the only "diamond in the rough finds"

Hyman was a hot commodty and we just paid the most for him. Kane was always good, we just didnt mind the off ice stuff

Campbell is tbd

Wrong. Hyman turned down more elsewhere.

 

[The Panther]

Need more time to evaluate Hyman and Kulak. Hyman was nothing at all special n the reg season, he played well in the playoffs.

I would say Hyman was very special indeed in the regular season. 27 goals (and 54 points) on second-line duty is very, very good. Here's the complete list of Oilers -- aside from Connor and Leon -- who have scored 27 goals in a season since the Cup run in 2006:
34 - Eberle (10 years ago)
32 - Penner (12 years ago)
31 - Smyth (15 years ago)
28 - Nuge (3 years ago) and Eberle & Perron (8 years ago)
27 - Hyman, Hall (8 years ago), Hall (10 years ago), and Maroon (5 years ago)

So, he just scored as many goals as Taylor Hall ever did in a season for the Oilers (with far less PP time), in his first year, while getting bounced around from the second to third to first to third lines all season, and your evaluation is "nothing at all special"? Consider how many intangibles Hyman brings that Eberle and Hall don't.

What I also love about this player is his positive attitude and general likability.

 

[Mack a doodle doo]

The pro scouts need to identify when players like Turris, Keith and Smith have been passed by by the game. Yes Keith and Smith provided value but I’d argue it wasn’t good value except for a few hot streaks from Smith.I think we have pretty average pro scouts overall or slightly below still, But definitely a few hits in recent years have impressed(Cicci a big one)

 

[Beerfish]

I would say Hyman was very special indeed in the regular season. 27 goals (and 54 points) on second-line duty is very, very good. Here's the complete list of Oilers -- aside from Connor and Leon -- who have scored 27 goals in a season since the Cup run in 2006:
34 - Eberle (10 years ago)
32 - Penner (12 years ago)
31 - Smyth (15 years ago)
28 - Nuge (3 years ago) and Eberle & Perron (8 years ago)
27 - Hyman, Hall (8 years ago), Hall (10 years ago), and Maroon (5 years ago)

So, he just scored as many goals as Taylor Hall ever did in a season for the Oilers (with far less PP time), in his first year, while getting bounced around from the second to third to first to third lines all season, and your evaluation is "nothing at all special"? Consider how many intangibles Hyman brings that Eberle and Hall don't.

What I also love about this player is his positive attitude and general likability.

Hyman was a whopping -9 on the year in the reg season. (Tied for team worst)

27 goals playing with mcdavid or drai all year is nothing. Friggin pat marron scored 27 with them.

Alex chaisson scored 22.

He was good in the playoffs mediocre in the reg season.

 

[Nostradumbass]

It isn't hard to be better than Chiarelli. I mean, the guy turned Eberle into Strome (could've been a wash), who he turned into Ryan Spooner, who they couldn't even play. I mean, come on.

The Oilers traded Sam Gagner in 2014 to Tampa Bay for Teddy Purcell instead of buying Gagner out. Jordan Eberle was 2nd on the team in scoring with ~68 points (28 goals). Jordan Eberle ended up being traded in a series of 1-for-1 deals for Sam Gagner.

 

[brentashton]

Need more time to evaluate Hyman and Kulak. Hyman was nothing at all special n the reg season, he played well in the playoffs. We as a fan base are famous for anointing some players when they have a bit of success but if they have to payer harder minutes they can fail so let wait with kulak.

We still have stinkers such as Foegle, and of course brassard, guys who do not help at all and cost resources.

I for sure would not at all say we have tuned the corner re pro scouting.

Lol

 

[Sweetpotato]

Need more time to evaluate Hyman and Kulak. Hyman was nothing at all special n the reg season, he played well in the playoffs. We as a fan base are famous for anointing some players when they have a bit of success but if they have to payer harder minutes they can fail so let wait with kulak.

We still have stinkers such as Foegle, and of course brassard, guys who do not help at all and cost resources.

I for sure would not at all say we have tuned the corner re pro scouting.

Haha complete forgot about Brassard. So tempted to bumped the Brassard trade thread where I said I hated the trade and everyone here jumped down my throat.

 

[Oilhawks]

Haha complete forgot about Brassard. So tempted to bumped the Brassard trade thread where I said I hated the trade and everyone here jumped down my throat.

#Stunning #brave

 

[The Panther]

Hyman was a whopping -9 on the year in the reg season. (Tied for team worst)

27 goals playing with mcdavid or drai all year is nothing. Friggin pat marron scored 27 with them.

Alex chaisson scored 22.

He was good in the playoffs mediocre in the reg season.

As detailed in my preceding post, excluding Connor and Leon, a grand total of THREE Oilers in sixteen years have scored significantly more goals in a season than Hyman did last season.

Fine if you want to call that mediocre, as long as Connor and Leon are your standard for "above mediocre'. It was also a career high for Hyman.

Also (again, aside from Connor & Leon), Hyman's RS + playoff total of 38 goals is the most in a combined season by any Oiler since Smyth's 43 in 2006.

The Hyman addition is a major win, at least in the short term.

 

[Soundwave]

Hyman was a whopping -9 on the year in the reg season. (Tied for team worst)

27 goals playing with mcdavid or drai all year is nothing. Friggin pat marron scored 27 with them.

Alex chaisson scored 22.

He was good in the playoffs mediocre in the reg season.

Tippett played an awful system 5-on-5 for half the year that tanked a lot of players' +/- so I don't read that much into that.

27 goals in 76 games (almost a 30 goal pace) is exactly what Hyman was signed to do, he then went above and beyond that in the playoffs.

If 29-30 goal pace is easy peasy with Connor McDavid, apparently someone forgot to tell Jesse Puljujarvi and Kailer Yamamoto that.

 

[Rengorlex]

Hyman had a bad PDO which tanked his +/-, he was good all year long.

 

[Whyme]

Hyman was a whopping -9 on the year in the reg season. (Tied for team worst)

27 goals playing with mcdavid or drai all year is nothing. Friggin pat marron scored 27 with them.

Alex chaisson scored 22.

He was good in the playoffs mediocre in the reg season.

Hyman scored a lot of goals so he deserves credit for that. But I think fans make a bigger difference between him and JP than they should.

Hyman got much more PP time, but his points/60 was almost identical with JP's (2.190 vs 2.048). Like you said Hyman was -9, while JP +22.

Hyman was a good addition, but while I know some get annoyed by me bringing Pulju's stats I'm not sure there's a huge difference between the players statistically in the regular season.

 

[nabob]

Need more time to evaluate Hyman and Kulak. Hyman was nothing at all special n the reg season, he played well in the playoffs. We as a fan base are famous for anointing some players when they have a bit of success but if they have to payer harder minutes they can fail so let wait with kulak.

We still have stinkers such as Foegle, and of course brassard, guys who do not help at all and cost resources.

I for sure would not at all say we have tuned the corner re pro scouting.

If you need more time to evaluate Hyman you need to pay more attention.

Hyman scored a lot of goals so he deserves credit for that. But I think fans make a bigger difference between him and JP than they should.

Hyman got much more PP time, but his points/60 was almost identical with JP's (2.190 vs 2.048). Like you said Hyman was -9, while JP +22.

Hyman was a good addition, but while I know some get annoyed by me bringing Pulju's stats I'm not sure there's a huge difference between the players statistically in the regular season.

Going by P/60 or goals/60 Pulju has always been really good.