Confirmed with Link: Habs Sign Cody Goloubef to a PTO (Update Oct 4: Released from PTO)

[Adam Michaels]

PTO rarely amount to anything. The last one I can remember that was somewhat notable was Joel ward a few years ago. I thought he looked fine, but ultimately, the habs didn't sign him.

They had signed Deprès to a PTO a few years ago and ended up signing him to an AHL deal after. Could be the same with Goloubef.

The last player who was signed to a PTO and ended up getting a contract and being a contributor was Fleischmann in 2016, who ended up being part of the deal that brought Danault and a 2nd the Habs used to draft Romanov.

 

[LastWordArmy]

Can anybody who knows the CBA and Salary cap explain how accrued cap space works? Right now, Weber has to to on LTIR before the season starts so we are under the cap. How does this affect the overall accrued cap space?

* Looks like we got to go with a 22 man roster with $1.475M of cap space. Does that stay and does not grow at all (because Weber is on LTIR before the season starts).
* Any ELC performance bonuses if they reach them are automatically deferred to next season. Equals a potential of $1.475M with Suzuki, Romanov, Caufield.
* Do we get any accrued cap space if Byron is moved from IR to LTIR after the season starts? What would our $1.1M of cap space look like at the deadline? Does it remain or grow if Byron is on LTIR but after the season starts?

I'm asking this cause I'm pondering something here... What do you value more? Someone on a PTO who might get a contract vs as much cap space as we can get for the trade deadline?

There is no accrued cap space from LTIR. Its a bit complicated, but here is a basic explaination LTIR lets you go above the cap by (LTIR Player cap minus how much you are currently under the cap). Then you have to clear that space again to reactivate him.

Here is the more complicated explanation

LTIR FAQ - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

 

[LastWordArmy]

PTO rarely amount to anything. The last one I can remember that was somewhat notable was Joel ward a few years ago. I thought he looked fine, but ultimately, the habs didn't sign him.

Last real one was Fleischmann. We signed him and later traded him (and Weise) to Chicago for Danault and a 2nd.

 

[Habs Halifax]

There is no accrued cap space from LTIR. Its a bit complicated, but here is a basic explaination LTIR lets you go above the cap by (LTIR Player cap minus how much you are currently under the cap). Then you have to clear that space again to reactivate him.

Here is the more complicated explanation

LTIR FAQ - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Yeah, I read that before and I will admit. Over my head. I would have to take more than 30 min's to understand it and still not 100% understand it entirely. Your not wrong, it's a bit complicated. My gut tells me Bergevin hoards as much cap space as he can from now till trade deadline. Signing someone on a PTO which the chance they chew into our $1.1M of cap space seems too risky to me.

Looks like a 22 man roster with one extra forward and one extra D.

Thanks for sharing that though. I'm going to save that link and read at night sometime

 

[LastWordArmy]

How i look at LTIR is in two parts.

1) If the player is going to be out for the entire regular season, you can use his full cap hit to replace him.

2) If the player is going to come back at some point during the season, then basically this is space for call-ups from the minors, or other such short-term replacement. You are going to have to get rid of the replacement (or someone else on the team) to create space when the injured player comes back. Whether that is trading a player or sending them to the minors, you gotta create the cap space.

So you can do a lot more with Weber's space than Byron's (even without getting into the fact that Byron makes way less than Weber).

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

So instead of signing a Vatanen or Demers actual NHL Dmen to PTOs, they sign an AHL guy.

Demers LMAO

 

[Archijerej]

He does nothing for us, except I guess to serve as the #8D and get some games with the big club if injuries pile up. Will prevent decimating Laval's defence in such case, but that's all.

 

[mouser]

Can anybody who knows the CBA and Salary cap explain how accrued cap space works? Right now, Weber has to to on LTIR before the season starts so we are under the cap. How does this affect the overall accrued cap space?

* Looks like we got to go with a 22 man roster with $1.475M of cap space. Does that stay and does not grow at all (because Weber is on LTIR before the season starts).
* Any ELC performance bonuses if they reach them are automatically deferred to next season. Equals a potential of $1.475M with Suzuki, Romanov, Caufield.
* Do we get any accrued cap space if Byron is moved from IR to LTIR after the season starts? What would our $1.1M of cap space look like at the deadline? Does it remain or grow if Byron is on LTIR but after the season starts?

I'm asking this cause I'm pondering something here... What do you value more? Someone on a PTO who might get a contract vs as much cap space as we can get for the trade deadline?

The $1.1m of remaining LTIR relief would not grow or otherwise accumulate as the season progresses.

Also, when using LTIR, acquired contracts are not pro-rated. Meaning if the team has $1.1M of remaining LTIR relief at the trade deadline then they can acquire a $1.1M AAV contract. As opposed to if the team had $1.1M in cap space, then they could acquire a ~$5M AAV contract at the trade deadline using pro-rating.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The $1.1m of remaining LTIR relief would not grow or otherwise accumulate as the season progresses.

Also, when using LTIR, acquired contracts are not pro-rated. Meaning if the team has $1.1M of remaining LTIR relief at the trade deadline then they can acquire a $1.1M AAV contract. As opposed to if the team had $1.1M in cap space, then they could acquire a ~$5M AAV contract at the trade deadline using pro-rating.

Thanks for this. It's worse than I assumed in terms of the limited options in available cap space at the deadline with Weber on LTIR before the season starts.

One more question... what happens if someone else gets hurt during the season? Does that create a situation where cap space can increase or do we still only have $1.1M? Also, If they move Byron to LTIR after the season starts, that don't matter one bit right?

 

[LastWordArmy]

Thanks for this. It's worse than I assumed in terms of the limited options in available cap space at the deadline with Weber on LTIR before the season starts.

One more question... what happens if someone else gets hurt during the season? Does that create a situation where cap space can increase or do we still only have $1.1M? Also, If they move Byron to LTIR after the season starts, that don't matter one bit right?

Yes, you can put others on LTIR to create more space. Again though when using that space, you have to consider if the injury is one that is a season ender, or something the player will come back from. It makes a big difference in how you can choose to use the space in a smart manner.

 

[BaseballCoach]

PTO rarely amount to anything. The last one I can remember that was somewhat notable was Joel ward a few years ago. I thought he looked fine, but ultimately, the habs didn't sign him.

Fleischmann?

Confirmed with Link: - Tomas Fleischmann invited to Habs camp (PTO)

 

[BaseballCoach]

Ridiculous PTO. This should be a Laval PTO. Nothing in his last few years of play says he can hit the ice for a contender in the NHL, and he is past his "prime" already.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Ridiculous PTO. This should be a Laval PTO. Nothing in his last few years of play says he can hit the ice for a contender in the NHL, and he is past his "prime" already.

Who cares if it's an NHL PTO.

 

[Adam Michaels]

So now it seems Josh Brook had surgery recently and won't be back before 2022. Which could explain the Goloubef PTO. Give him a shot to earn a spot with Laval.

 

[mouser]

Thanks for this. It's worse than I assumed in terms of the limited options in available cap space at the deadline with Weber on LTIR before the season starts.

One more question... what happens if someone else gets hurt during the season? Does that create a situation where cap space can increase or do we still only have $1.1M? Also, If they move Byron to LTIR after the season starts, that don't matter one bit right?

If any other players go on LTIR, then the $1.1M of remaining LTIR relief is increased by the injured players contract AAV. But only during the period of the injury, once a player recovers from a LTIR injury and is activated then their full contract AAV is removed from the relief pool.

It doesn't matter Byron when goes on LTIR, only that he's expected back before the end of the season. So while Byron is out on LTIR, the available remaining LTIR relief would be $3.4M + $1.1M = $4.5M. Once Byron is healthy Montreal would have to shed any of his $3.4M of relief in use. All of these numbers are absolute contract AAV values, nothing is pro-rated.

Example 1) If they added $4.5M AAV in contracts on Day 1 (or any time) of the season with LTIR then once Byron is healthy the team would have to remove $3.4M AAV of contracts.

Example 2) If they added $3M AAV on Day 1 (or any time) then they would have to remove $1.9M AAV in contracts ($3M minus the $1.1M remaining from Weber).

 

[1909]

Brook is injured and will be out for few
months. So giving a PTO to Goloubev makes sense. He is a rightie too.

 

[Habs Halifax]

If any other players go on LTIR, then the $1.1M of remaining LTIR relief is increased by the injured players contract AAV. But only during the period of the injury, once a player recovers from a LTIR injury and is activated then their full contract AAV is removed from the relief pool.

It doesn't matter Byron when goes on LTIR, only that he's expected back before the end of the season. So while Byron is out on LTIR, the available remaining LTIR relief would be $3.4M + $1.1M = $4.5M. Once Byron is healthy Montreal would have to shed any of his $3.4M of relief in use. All of these numbers are absolute contract AAV values, nothing is pro-rated.

Example 1) If they added $4.5M AAV in contracts on Day 1 (or any time) of the season with LTIR then once Byron is healthy the team would have to remove $3.4M AAV of contracts.

Example 2) If they added $3M AAV on Day 1 (or any time) then they would have to remove $1.9M AAV in contracts ($3M minus the $1.1M remaining from Weber).

Thank you! Appreciated.

 

[SakuKoivu11]

This is a waste of everyone’s time including the player himself

 

[PeteWorrell]

This is a waste of everyone’s time including the player himself

It is a "waste of time" like taking a job interview. Ridiculous take when a player is just trying to earn a living.

 

[Archijerej]

Now it makes sense with Brook's injury.

 

[Belial]

This is a waste of everyone’s time including the player himself

Brook is injured, they need a body for the AHL.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

You have to be an enormous MB hater to come on here and cry about a PTO.......truly pathetic

 

[1909]

This is a waste of everyone’s time including the player himself

No. He will be offered a AHL contract to replace Brooks who is injured and away for months.

 

[Adam Michaels]

No. He will be offered a AHL contract to replace Brooks who is injured and away for months.

Exactly. Similar to how they gave a PTO to Depres a few years ago and he was signed to an AHL deal.

We can also see what the Habs' intention is. At the main camp, Goloubef is listed with the 3rd group that is with all of the AHL guys.

So they will look to him as a possible replacement for Brook.

 

[Scintillating10]

Laval only I imagine