Post-Game Talk: Habs forget that there was a game tonight. Lose 5-0 to the Sharks

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

The horrible start is not the problem. This team is better than what we're seeing now and they'll bounce back one way or another.

Missing the playoffs is not the problem either.

The problem is lack of direction. Bergevin has loaded up and capped us out to the point that we're going to have to clear salary next off-season just to fill out the roster nevermind improving it.

He doesn't seem to have noticed that with Weber, Danault and Kotkaniemi gone, his retool plan is over. It has resulted in a great playoff run, but also clearly demonstrated it's limits when we were completely outclassed in the Final. We won't get anything more from this core after it's been weakened.

In order to build a new core around Suzuki/Caufield we need assets and cap flexibility. This means accepting that making the playoffs in the next couple of years is of secondary importance and that we don't need two top 6 wingers playing non the 3rd line and two 3rd liners playing on the 4th.

It also means ensuring that Arizona gets Carolina's pick for Dvorak, instead of ours.

We also should be able to be making developmental decisions with an eye to the future, like, for example, not taking off Suzuki and Caufield of the first PP once they struggle, just because we need to grind out the points.

But no, we absolutely have to have a playoff team this year.

That's Molson

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

We already overpaid 2 wwingers on the third line and people here want Danault at 5.5m on the thirdline.
He literally left because he wanted top 6 and PP time which he didnt got in game 2 already with the Kings.
Says it all.
Good defensively or not , he was on the team in the last 3 years when we didnt score and were in the bottom of the league. Danault is not a game changer
The problem in this org is deeper than letting a 3rd center go play to L.A.

Get over it. This team would be 0-4-0 with KK and Danault right now anyways. When you play shit like this you dont win.

 

[Archijerej]

That's Molson

Well, then we are definitely f***ed and no GM will make a difference.

 

[dcyhabs]

We already overpaid 2 wwingers on the third line and people here want Danault at 5.5m on the thirdline.
He literally left because he wanted top 6 and PP time which he didnt got in game 2 already with the Kings.
Says it all.
Good defensively or not , he was on the team in the last 3 years when we didnt score and were in the bottom of the league. Danault is not a game changer
The problem in this org is deeper than letting a 3rd center go play to L.A.

Get over it. This team would be 0-4-0 with KK and Danault right now anyways. When you play shit like this you dont win.

Probably be better with playoff Weber and Price, though. The team really doesn't get it together without Price. They rely on his direction and puckhandling, in addition to his puckstopping.

 

[Kriss E]

The series vs Tampa showed that we were not a real contender. We did well in the initial 3 rounds no doubt. However as soon as a team with real playoff experience and talent came into the picture , it was obvious we weren't going to make it competitive.

I'd argue that our "success" did more harm than any of the good of playoff experience for Suzuki/Caufield and company. Remains to be seen I suppose but we need more young elite talent especially on the backend and usually only get those with a solid draft pick.

Wouldn't say it did more harm, and Vegas is a serious contender we got through.
Our team still changed a lot since then...No Price, Weber, Edmundson, Danault, Byron, KK.
Dvorak is a good two way center a la Danault but he hasn't been here for years, doesn't have the same chemistry built up.
Eddy is a good staple on a mid pair with Petry, so that's gotten weaker.
We are playing guys like Kulak on the top pair, and have scrubs like Wideman in.
We have decent depth up front on wings but nobody is really good at creating offense for themselves outside Suzuki/Drouin.
Suzuki/Caufield are still youngsters and I'm not sure they're ready for the roles given to them.
Team is a mess man.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Probably be better with playoff Weber and Price, though. The team really doesn't get it together without Price. They rely on his direction and puckhandling, in addition to his puckstopping.

Price was the sole reason in the we made it that far in the playoffs

 

[BLONG7]

Price was the sole reason in the we made it that far in the playoffs

Absolutely true..........we do not get by the leafs if not for Price.......and it carried forward.
The team got better with confidence as we moved forward...but make no mistake, this is on Price.
And...................................we're back to the MB Rinse and Repeat era.
Carry on...

 

[CristianoRonaldo]

We already overpaid 2 wwingers on the third line and people here want Danault at 5.5m on the thirdline.
He literally left because he wanted top 6 and PP time which he didnt got in game 2 already with the Kings.
Says it all.
Good defensively or not , he was on the team in the last 3 years when we didnt score and were in the bottom of the league. Danault is not a game changer
The problem in this org is deeper than letting a 3rd center go play to L.A.

Get over it. This team would be 0-4-0 with KK and Danault right now anyways. When you play shit like this you dont win.

On the Kings board, many are already calling him a #3C...

We can't score a goal, Price is not in the net to make this team look way better than it really is, but Danault is apparently the saviour...

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Welcome Shane

Next thing you know, Wright is aware of the shitshow in Montreal and pulls a Lindros.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Well, then we are definitely f***ed and no GM will make a difference.

Well, it's both. Molson asks "playoffs at all costs" and Bergevin says "yes, sir" even though he's in over his head.

Pretty sure there's someone out there better at the balancing act of the middle road plan.

 

[26Mats]

On the Kings board, many are already calling him a #3C...

We can't score a goal, Price is not in the net to make this team look way better than it really is, but Danault is apparently the saviour...

He's not the savior; he's an important piece we lost without replacing. Evans isn't a 3c. Evans is a 3rd line winger or a 4c. Danault is an elite 3c, who often plays the most minutes because his job is to shutdown the opposition's top lines.

You can't lose an important piece like that and not have repurcussions. The reality is Dvorak is a short term at least upgrade over KK. Having Danault with Evans and Gallagher on his wing is not comparable to Just Evans and then Paquette at 4c.

Price or no Price, that's a step back.

 

[hohosaregood]

Sorry to intrude. I'm not here to pile on, just wanted to provide another POV. I see you guys are complaining about your forwards but to me, it seemed like your defense group was booty.

 

[BLONG7]

Well, it's both. Molson asks "playoffs at all costs" and Bergevin says "yes, sir" even though he's in over his head.

Pretty sure there's someone out there better at the balancing act of the middle road plan.

Could that be the discussions already being had by St Patrick and Money Bag$ Mol$on as we speak...?
No matter who gets the gig, as MB leaves, the new guy has to have vision and a plan.....plugging holes does not work....when your foundation is cracked.

 

[dcyhabs]

On the Kings board, many are already calling him a #3C...

We can't score a goal, Price is not in the net to make this team look way better than it really is, but Danault is apparently the saviour...

With Weber and Edmundson missing they are down their top D pairing. That's a lot of key players missing.

 

[Archijerej]

Well, it's both. Molson asks "playoffs at all costs" and Bergevin says "yes, sir" even though he's in over his head.

Pretty sure there's someone out there better at the balancing act of the middle road plan.

So, you're basically endorsing the strategy that was adopted in 2018, but you think some other guy could execute it better?

Yeah, perhaps.

Problem is, I was ok with that strategy, but I think it's no longer valid with a huge part of previous core gone. I think two top-10 picks in the next couple of drafts is pretty much a no-brainer at this point. Otherwise we risk pissing away another core.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

With Weber and Edmundson missing they are down their top D pairing. That's a lot of key players missing.

Weber is not coming back ever. They knew that. It was a question of time until he was hitting LITR
Edmundson is a 4th def , let's not think that his return will change the face of this defense .

Bergevin failed to build a defense for several years. Savard is another Alzner mistake in progress.
The fact Kulak plays with Petry is just a complete joke.
We have the team with the biggest salary cap in the league and yet we have the worst defense of the league and the weakest center line of the league.

Carey Price made this team look so much better than we all think. You can tell Price is mostly all this team when in the last 2 years (last year , and the year covid hit) Price had terrible regular season stats and it showed hard on both times. Luckily our canadian division was pretty bad and we still somehow managed to make playoffs.
Then Price went back to his 2015 form during that run.

Carey Price has been the face of this franchise for a longtime , now he's aging and starting to decline and now all the problems this team has is getting completely exposed by his absence.

Bergevin has absolutely no idea what to do and he's signing players here and here and hope it works.
Now we are in cap hell due to panic and a fluke run.

This is why the bell center had empty seats , people are not dumb.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

So, you're basically endorsing the strategy that was adopted in 2018, but you think some other guy could execute it better?

Yeah, perhaps.

Problem is, I was ok with that strategy, but I think it's no longer valid with a huge part of previous core gone. I think two top-10 picks in the next couple of drafts is pretty much a no-brainer at this point. Otherwise we risk pissing away another core.

I'm not endorsing anything, just being realist to silver spoon's ambitions or lackthereof.

I've been saying for two years that thry'd be forced to rebuilt despite themselves. I was right.

 

[Archijerej]

Sorry to intrude. I'm not here to pile on, just wanted to provide another POV. I see you guys are complaining about your forwards but to me, it seemed like your defense group was booty.

Our forwards are the definition of redundancy. It's like putting a roof over a house with no walls.

 

[Whitesnake]

It's the Habs without Danault, Price, Weber, Edmundson, and Perry.

We were, during our few good moments over the last while a team that succeeded based on depth. We lost a ton of it this offseason. I think Danault and Perry could have been brought back with the right offers and that Weber could have been replaced.

But, like when we didn't re-sign Markov and Radulov, probably better in the long run to have botched the offseason and get a lotter pick anyways. I'm ready for new management when it's time to make the pick, but I actually have faith in this management to make the right pick - as long as they don't draft for need. A big problem with this management group. One among many.

Price and Weber it's not the team's fault. Danault, it's a choice they made. Perry? We don't know a mix of Habs not giving too much or Perry wanting to leave. And Edmundson will be back. But he is still Edmundson.

Thing is...this is not, today, an analysis of a whole year. This is after 4 games. How about the Pens after 4 games without Crosby and Malkin? Buffalo without Eichel? And the Habs aren't about in the net right now. We don't score. And there's NOBODY missing up front that we did decide to keep aside from Byron.

 

[Whitesnake]

It’s true for Price…he’s THAT good.

It’s not true for Danault.

Didn't you just say yourself that what he did was mask our flaws? Is it true or not?

 

[417]

Didn't you just say yourself that what he did was mask our flaws? Is it true or not?

Masking flaws...doesn't mean fixing or resolving them.

It just means "masking" them, which ultimately means that they'll eventually bubble up to the surface.

I maintain what I said then and reiterate it once more.

Its just different for a high level goalie like Price...I mean, his job is to erase mistakes. When he's on his Ps & Qs, few are better.

 

[JianYang]

Sorry to intrude. I'm not here to pile on, just wanted to provide another POV. I see you guys are complaining about your forwards but to me, it seemed like your defense group was booty.

Center and defense were the troublesome points going into the season. You lose Weber, danault and KK, replaced with savard, and Dvorak. That won't quite cut it.

Wings and goaltending were the strengths. Goaltending dimension changed with price checking into assistance through. It went from price and Allen, to Allen and montembault.

 

[Hostile Offer]

Our forwards are the definition of redundancy. It's like putting a roof over a house with no walls.

I honestly don't mind this forward group. With proper coaching and a defense capable of, well, playing NHL level defense, I think they could be a real force. But alas, we don't have that, so the forward group is like you said, the definition of redundancy.

 

[26Mats]

Price and Weber it's not the team's fault. Danault, it's a choice they made. Perry? We don't know a mix of Habs not giving too much or Perry wanting to leave. And Edmundson will be back. But he is still Edmundson.

Thing is...this is not, today, an analysis of a whole year. This is after 4 games. How about the Pens after 4 games without Crosby and Malkin? Buffalo without Eichel? And the Habs aren't about in the net right now. We don't score. And there's NOBODY missing up front that we did decide to keep aside from Byron.

Danault helps the offense in a few ways. First he's usually a 40 point plus player. 2nd him handling the big defense responsibilities leaves more energy for the other centers (what would be Suzuki and KK's replacement Dvorak) on offense. 3rd, that he's been on the better two way lines it self means there's more offensive pressure on the opposition, which helps with wearing them down and creating momentum.

Who knows, Maybe we'd be 2-2, 1-3, or 0-4 with Danault. But any way I'd see us as being a much better team in the short term and when the injured return.

 

[Andy]

The series vs Tampa showed that we were not a real contender. We did well in the initial 3 rounds no doubt. However as soon as a team with real playoff experience and talent came into the picture , it was obvious we weren't going to make it competitive.

I'd argue that our "success" did more harm than any of the good of playoff experience for Suzuki/Caufield and company. Remains to be seen I suppose but we need more young elite talent especially on the backend and usually only get those with a solid draft pick.

I still maintain the only game the habs looked good in during the leafs series was game 7. It was all Price that series. I rewatched those games and the habs had no business winning, especially the OT in game 6.

They had strong starts to games 5-10 minutes, but were outchanced constantly.

They deserved those wins vs the Jets and Vegas. That there is no doubt.