GDT: Giroux watch 2023/24

[Philly Fanatik]

The Cups are of course team achievements, so Giroux being the only one of them without winning a Cup really means nothing. To be clear; I honestly don't see the tie-in between your post and the current thread here.

I made any observation on the 7 players individual career points totals and with winning the Stanley Cup is the highest possible accomplishment resulting from their hardwork coupled with teamwork!
I would’ve love nothing better that G winning the Cup with the Senators this 2023/24 season.
And ya never know…he might get traded to a contender around the trade dead line and win.
That would make it 15 Cups for that group of 7.

 

[Sawdalite]

I made any observation on the 7 players individual career points totals and with winning the Stanley Cup is the highest possible accomplishment resulting from their hardwork coupled with teamwork!
I would’ve love nothing better that G winning the Cup with the Senators this 2023/24 season.
And ya never know…he might get traded to a contender around the trade dead line and win.
That would make it 15 Cups for that group of 7.

So, if I post 7 players with less impressive stats... but 14 or more Cups between them... it would mean exactly what?

Listen, I hear you... not exactly sure what to make of it though... but okay... I suppose.

 

[Appleyard]

 

[DancingPanther]

Why tag the Flyers? They clearly don't care, as illustrated by lack of congratulations after career pt #1000

 

[gertbfrobe16]

Reminds them of how they fkd up.

 

[Striiker]

 

[Ironmanrulez]

G hasn’t forgot what he did to the Flyers PP

i love that he is killing provorov! He deserve it !

I´ve ordered one Jersey from the United States my whole life (42 years!). And its a Giroux original Jersey! I know why!

 

[Appleyard]

 

[Young Sandwich]

Classic G

 

[Appleyard]

 

[zizbuka]

So, is Giroux a HOF lock or not?

 

[Striiker]

Should be.

If not, remove all former Flyers in the HoF.

 

[Appleyard]

So, is Giroux a HOF lock or not?

He should be, and would be if a lot of his prime had not fell in the lowest scoring continual era since the 1950s...

but I mean, barring injury ending his career early? He is very likely going to hit 1200 career points. Only 139 points off and from what I know I doubt he is going to retire until father time actually catches up with him.

Roenick (1216), Nicholls (1209) and Damphousse (1205) are the only guys who have ever hit 1200 and are not/likely wont make the HHoF. And all played career across higher scoring eras as a whole... between all three of them they have worse Hart (3, 4, 4, 16 vs 5, 10, 11 and Point finishes (2, 3, 3, 10 vs 4, 5, 6, 7) than Giroux. You can combine their peaks and primes and they did not reach Giroux...

So I would say, as things stand, he is probably up to a ~85% chance.

 

[PALE PWNR]

f*** Chuck Fletcher

 

[Sawdalite]

He should be, and would be if a lot of his prime had not fell in the lowest scoring continual era since the 1950s...

but I mean, barring injury ending his career early? He is very likely going to hit 1200 career points. Only 139 points off and from what I know I doubt he is going to retire until father time actually catches up with him.

Roenick (1216), Nicholls (1209) and Damphousse (1205) are the only guys who have ever hit 1200 and are not/likely wont make the HHoF. And all played career across higher scoring eras as a whole... between all three of them they have worse Hart (3, 4, 4, 16 vs 5, 10, 11 and Point finishes (2, 3, 3, 10 vs 4, 5, 6, 7) than Giroux. You can combine their peaks and primes and they did not reach Giroux...

So I would say, as things stand, he is probably up to a ~85% chance.

Roenick certainly should've been installed in the HHOF... it is argued that had he not been an American, he'd have be elected to the Hall... also going against him is his outgoing, and vocal personality that speaks his piece, as he sees fit. IMO JR was good for the NHL, in an era where the NHL/Sport needed such a personality... He was a good ambassador for the game, and gave his all on the ice... and to get back on the ice when off -- his waiving to the MSG opposing fans while being taken out on a stretcher will forever be embedded in my memory -- JR miraculously was able to return to the Flyers for the playoffs IIRC, after his jaw was shattered, and he appeared to be dead on the MSG ice... and that was far from an isolated example of Roenick's dedication to his team... and the sport. But I digress; it just irks me when I remember that JR is not in the HHOF, being one of the very best American hockey players of all time. [//Rant]

 

[Appleyard]

Roenick certainly should've been installed in the HHOF... it is argued that had he not been an American, he'd have be elected to the Hall... also going against him is his outgoing, and vocal personality that speaks his piece, as he sees fit. IMO JR was good for the NHL, in an era where the NHL/Sport needed such a personality... He was a good ambassador for the game, and gave his all on the ice... and to get back on the ice when off -- his waiving to the MSG opposing fans while being taken out on a stretcher will forever be embedded in my memory -- JR miraculously was able to return to the Flyers for the playoffs IIRC, after his jaw was shattered, and he appeared to be dead on the MSG ice... and that was far from an isolated example of Roenick's dedication to his team... and the sport. But I digress; it just irks me when I remember that JR is not in the HHOF, being one of the very best American hockey players of all time. [//Rant]

Him and Paul Thompson probably have the best peaks and primes of any forward who played pre-2000 and are not in...

Turgeon was the bench-mark for that most probably, and now he is in.

 

[Rebels57]

Roenick certainly should've been installed in the HHOF... it is argued that had he not been an American, he'd have be elected to the Hall... also going against him is his outgoing, and vocal personality that speaks his piece, as he sees fit. IMO JR was good for the NHL, in an era where the NHL/Sport needed such a personality... He was a good ambassador for the game, and gave his all on the ice... and to get back on the ice when off -- his waiving to the MSG opposing fans while being taken out on a stretcher will forever be embedded in my memory -- JR miraculously was able to return to the Flyers for the playoffs IIRC, after his jaw was shattered, and he appeared to be dead on the MSG ice... and that was far from an isolated example of Roenick's dedication to his team... and the sport. But I digress; it just irks me when I remember that JR is not in the HHOF, being one of the very best American hockey players of all time. [//Rant]

Definitely baffling to me that a player with over 500 goals, over 1200 points in the regular season and another 53 goals and 122 Playoff points is not in yet. I have to think he gets in soon. I hope he's not getting blacklisted because he told Kathryn Tappen that he and his wife wanted to have a 3some with her.

 

[Sawdalite]

Definitely baffling to me that a player with over 500 goals, over 1200 points in the regular season and another 53 goals and 122 Playoff points is not in yet. I have to think he gets in soon. I hope he's not getting blacklisted because he told Kathryn Tappen that he and his wife wanted to have a 3some with her.

I see Keven Hayes fingerprints all over this... I'd bet everything I own that Hayes is behind his exclusion.

 

[eramosat]

So, is Giroux a HOF lock or not?

He should be, and would be if a lot of his prime had not fell in the lowest scoring continual era since the 1950s...

but I mean, barring injury ending his career early? He is very likely going to hit 1200 career points. Only 139 points off and from what I know I doubt he is going to retire until father time actually catches up with him.

Roenick (1216), Nicholls (1209) and Damphousse (1205) are the only guys who have ever hit 1200 and are not/likely wont make the HHoF. And all played career across higher scoring eras as a whole... between all three of them they have worse Hart (3, 4, 4, 16 vs 5, 10, 11 and Point finishes (2, 3, 3, 10 vs 4, 5, 6, 7) than Giroux. You can combine their peaks and primes and they did not reach Giroux...

So I would say, as things stand, he is probably up to a ~85% chance.

one of the few times I look at HoF voting and hope that what I think is a possible maybe candidate could get in. 85% chance is way more chance than I think he has (I would say more like 10%) but I sincerely hope I am wrong. He just doesn't have anything that big to get voters interested in his candidacy. And his career stats are just not enough to do the job.

A few posts before, watching his slapper shoot-out win replay? The guy is still hockey smart to a massive degree, as we all know. So sad his Ottawa tenure has turned so south, for the team that is, I hoped he could raise his profile with them, but he's under a bushel basket up there.

 

[Appleyard]

one of the few times I look at HoF voting and hope that what I think is a possible maybe candidate could get in. 85% chance is way more chance than I think he has (I would say more like 10%) but I sincerely hope I am wrong. He just doesn't have anything that big to get voters interested in his candidacy. And his career stats are just not enough to do the job.

A few posts before, watching his slapper shoot-out win replay? The guy is still hockey smart to a massive degree, as we all know. So sad his Ottawa tenure has turned so south, for the team that is, I hoped he could raise his profile with them, but he's under a bushel basket up there.

With his Hart voting, point finishes and the sheer number of points he has despite being in a low scoring era?

He is starting to get into very close to lock territory just based on the numbers... come 2030 there will be close to no guys with ~1000 points who are not in given how low scoring the ~2010-2017 period was. Unless they start inducting the Ray Whitney's of the world.

as they are running out of guys to induct with 3+ men getting in every year.

By the end of this season he will be 12th in NHL scoring over the last 25 years... when he retires he will probably be ~8th in NHL scoring in the 21st century.

 

[Appleyard]

I mean:

2024: Datsyuk, Weber... then 2 of Zetterberg, Mogilny, Roenick, Joseph, Marleau, Brind'Amour, Elias and Gonchar
2025: Thornton, Chara, Keith, Price... (Getzlaf, Subban, Spezza, Rask other guys who become eligible)
2026: Toews, Bergeron, Getzlaf... and 1 of the previous who did not get in (Staal the other new guy)
2027: Maybe Jagr, Fleury, Backstrom... and 1 of Zetterberg, Subban, Rask, Mogilny, Roenick, Joseph, Marleau, Brind'Amour, Elias, Spezza, Staal and Gonchar

At that point only ~8 of Zetterberg, Subban, Rask, Mogilny, Roenick, Joseph, Marleau, Brind'Amour, Elias, Spezza, Staal and Gonchar are left. And tbh Giroux is likely ahead of Spezza, Staal and Brind'Amour at least, likely Roenick and Joseph too.

2028-2029... guys who will likely retire this year or next? Burns, Pavelski, Suter, Giordano, Carter, Perry, Wheeler... only Burns has a better resume than Giroux. And that will likely take 6-7 guys off the list over 2028-29... to the point the best players not in will be ~Pavelski, Staal, Spezza, Subban, Brind'Amour, Damphousse, Nicholls etc.

then in 2030-2031 or so? Those are the years likely get Crosby, Ovechkin, Kopitar, Giroux, Letang, Marchand, Kane, Benn, Doughty, Stamkos, Karlsson, Stamkos.

Giroux wont be first ballot... but he will very likely get in because of his peak and prime and because there are going to be some years in the mid-2030s where if he is not inducted? Jason Spezza and Joe Pavelski are going in.

Because the 2009-2012 drafts? ONLY have Tavares, Hedman, Kucherov, Gaudreau and Schiefele with a chance in hell... and Giroux will have a better career than 2/5 for sure, likely 3/5.

 

[Magua]

as they are running out of guys to induct with 3+ men getting in every year

And yet they won’t induct the slew of non-NHLers, likely better than many HoFers. Maltsev, Firsov, Petrov, Mikhailov, Vasiliev, etc. Just a total blindspot they won't correct. Watching tape of them was fun. Makarov, who actually played in the NHL, was inducted in 2016! It's embarrassing, especially with what a low bar the HHoF sets.

 

[eramosat]

With his Hart voting, point finishes and the sheer number of points he has despite being in a low scoring era?

He is starting to get into very close to lock territory just based on the numbers... come 2030 there will be close to no guys with ~1000 points who are not in given how low scoring the ~2010-2017 period was. Unless they start inducting the Ray Whitney's of the world.

as they are running out of guys to induct with 3+ men getting in every year.

By the end of this season he will be 12th in NHL scoring over the last 25 years... when he retires he will probably be ~8th in NHL scoring in the 21st century.

I sincerely hope you are right. I have little feel for 3+ inductees per year vibe, plus the timing, and how it might play out. I just more so look at the overall H0F voting history, and think that a player like Giroux is simply far from a lock.

I love Giroux the player, but he hasn't gotten any serious non-Philly love his entire careeer...no Olympic selections...lost his best chance at a Hart to a one-season mirage...and ultimately had little success leading an ok NHL team for a decade or more. His best playoff result came too early in his career, on a team he was great for but not nearly the leader, and he never came close after that Cup Final loss. The team results just don't add anything to his case, and that's a pretty big box to leave unchecked, where any other player with a sub-par career but a Cup Win (or Finals appearances) can surpass him..

Looking at your in-detail prediction for the next 5-6 classes makes me feel better about it.

 

[Appleyard]

 

[Striiker]

And all this with only being on a decent-or-better team for like 3 years of his career.

Imagine if he had help and competence around him.