General Discussion (Current Team/Player News) - to the golf course

[MartyOwns]

Bro he doesn't win.

The end

when do the Save Percentage Playoffs start? my cable provider had no idea what I was talking about when I asked

 

[Feed Me A Stray Cat]

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=699719

never said lundqvist isn't top 5. never hyped anything. actually I'll stop listing things I didn't say with you, as that's usually an exhausting and pointless exercise.

more and more goalies are stepping in (talbot included, jones, whoever) and putting up wins (eek! not the 'w' word!!) actually talbot stepped in and briefly, very briefly stole HLs spot this year. they dumped a very capable backup for him. laugh all you want, but check back in a few years when the rangers have transferred their goalie workload to talbot, or whatever other 6'6 butterfly goalie that happens to be available.

future doesn't mean next year. it means, in the context of this conversation, the 8 years you would like Schneider signed for.

You realize that every year there are like 5 backup goalies who put up really good numbers? And very promptly 4 of them put up pedestrian numbers the next season.

Al Montoya, man of the 2.3 GAA and .920% this season, had a sub .900% the two years prior. Brian Elliott went from a .891% to a .940% to a .907% to a .922%. Viktor Fasth went from a 2.18 GAA and .921% to a 2.82 GAA and .905%.

You're not incorrect in saying the value of a starting goalie has diminished, however the Rask, Lundqvist, Schneider and Bobrovsky crowd are worth the money and term.

 

[Brooklyndevil]

if so many butterfly goalies can do what he can, why don't more have better numbers than he does the past few years?

Lundqvist is arguably the best goalie in the league. Hes at worst top 5. Saying otherwise is stupid, sorry. Cam Talbot has played 21 NHL games and youre already hyping him as Lundqvist's replacement? thats classic.

and what do you mean "hypothetically higher future cap numbers?" the cap has already been confirmed to be $70 million next year. thats not hypothetical, thats real.

I would say Price and Rask are better. However, he's top 5.

 

[JimEIV]

Funny how Anaheim has been the best team (or second) practically all season and they use any ol cardboard cutout for a goaltender.

 

[Devils090]

Funny how Anaheim has been the best team (or second) practically all season and they use any ol cardboard cutout for a goaltender.

and they have made it out of the 1st round once since 2007

also helps they have players who can actually, you know, score.

 

[JimEIV]

and they have made it out of the 1st round once since 2007

also helps they have players who can actually, you know, score.

What does the past performance have to do with this season?

None of these current Duck goaltenders have even played in the playoffs except for Hiller...and he's played a whopping 7 playoff games in his career.

 

[MartyOwns]

You're not incorrect in saying the value of a starting goalie has diminished, however the Rask, Lundqvist, Schneider and Bobrovsky crowd are worth the money and term.

1 cup amongst that crowd, right?

I just don't believe you need that number one stud goalie to win a cup anymore. get a couple of tall butterfly goalies who are above average and you've got a shot.

it's better to have a better goalie, obviously. but when that goalie hits prime time and big $, a good team will have a jones, talbot, etc ready to step in. maybe your teams save percentage will dip from .920 to .910. the horror. it's not what determines a win, there are so many other factors that teams can focus on which produce real results.

 

[Devilsfan992]

Funny how Anaheim has been the best team (or second) practically all season and they use any ol cardboard cutout for a goaltender.

They got great young goaltenders though. Hiller will be gone next year or the year after I would think.

 

[NJDevs26]

The best shootout % for any team since inception is 38.4% (Colorado), while the worst is 26.7% (Tampa). Average is around 33.1%. When considering that the shootout is essentially a series of weighted coin flips in intervals of 3-5 attempts, over about 14 trials per season, it's easy to see how sheer randomness can steer team's records one way or another.

The other issue is that season to season repeatability of individual shootout performances is low. Patrik Elias went from a 50% conversion rate in 11-12 to a 25% rate in 12-13 rate to a 0% in 13-14. Meanwhile, Ilya Kovalchuk went from a 26% career rate prior to 11-12 to posting a ridiculous 78% rate in 11-12, followed up by 33% in 12-13.

The basic premise is that anything can ******* happen in 3 or 4 shootout attempts, in only 10-15 samples of those attempts per season.

Except when your entire TEAM is 4-45 including some guys who were above average (Elias, Clowe) coming into this season and both goalies also underperformed their career #'s in the shootout, that doesn't suggest randomness. It suggests it got in their heads.

 

[Devils090]

What does the past performance have to do with this season?

None of these current Duck goaltenders have even played in the playoffs except for Hiller...and he's played a whopping 7 playoff games in his career.

regardless, they are the highest scoring team in the league so they can get by with average goaltending in the regular season.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I like how guys like John Gibson, Fredrik Andersson, and Jonas Hiller are considered "any ol' cardboard cutout"

just because a team has multiple goalies doesn't mean that they can get by with any of them. all 3 of those guys are good goalies.

 

[AfroThunder396]

You can get by with just an average goalie if you're a mega-powerhouse like Chicago or Pittsburgh.

But if your team ISN'T flawless, then yes you need a consistently excellent goaltender to keep you in games and give you a chance to win games you normally shouldn't win.

 

[Devils090]

i just dont get this hate for Schneider, aside from carrying the puck up the ice and scoring the goals himself, there is nothing more he could have done this season.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

i just dont get this hate for Schneider, aside from carrying the puck up the ice and scoring the goals himself, there is nothing more he could have done this season.

he isn't Marty and some people just can't seem to grasp that.

 

[Cheddabombs]

I understand the argument that paying for a goalie of Schneider's caliber may be seen as a excessive use of cap space in today's NHL. But the question I have is if we decide that we don't need Schneider then what? How would we use that cap space instead? Signing free agents? That's a two-way street and just because we throw money at someone doesn't mean they'll want to play here. Do we trade Schneider for more assets? Hypothetically it could work but we should be getting a goalie in return and in that case the additional asset, along with said goalie, probably wouldn't be the biggest difference maker out there.

Lou has backed him self into a precarious situation here. From looking at our roster and our prospects it only makes sense to build from the net out. We have contracts coming off the book soon and with the cap going up I don't see why can't sign both Schneider and a good forward FA.

 

[Devils090]

yeah we should just ditch him and start Kinkaid because goalies are overrated.

at least we could get McDavid that way

 

[AfroThunder396]

Exactly. If you don't want to spend that money on Schneider, what else are you spending that money on? Are you just going to throw piles of money at forwards and pray they sign here? Are we going to offer sheet young RFA's? Certainly not as long as Lou is here.

Are we just going to become the 2002 Rangers? I want to know what forward you have in mind that is worth Schneider's estimated contract, will be a UFA, would be willing to sign here, and will provide more tangible benefits than we would get from the upgrade from Kinkaid to Schneider.

EDIT: Especially because when the time Schneider is UFA we will have the cap space to give him 6.5-7 aav AND sign a forward worth that much with breathing room.

 

[HobokenIrish]

yeah we should just ditch him and start Kinkaid because goalies are overrated.

at least we could get McDavid that way

That would be the one advantage to trading Schneider. We would be in a much better spot to be the worst team in the league

I would love to see the following done in the offseason

1) Sign Schneider long term
2) Marty retires happily rather than an awkward foray into free agency where he may only see offers as a backup on non-playoff teams
3) Sign Jagr
4) Buy out Volchenkov, Trade Sal and sign Fayne for a few years and Zid for 1
5) Sign Stastny
6) Sign Iginla to a 1 year deal

 

[JimEIV]

They got great young goaltenders though. Hiller will be gone next year or the year after I would think.

Great young goaltending? Gibson? Yes. But he had nothing todo with them getting 116 points this season.

 

[R8Devs]

Great young goaltending? Gibson? Yes. But he had nothing todo with them getting 116 points this season.

Andersen.

 

[JimEIV]

yeah we should just ditch him and start Kinkaid because goalies are overrated.

at least we could get McDavid that way

Betcha Kinkaid coulda won 16 games in 45 starts this season.

 

[Devils090]

maybe we could trade Schneider for Anaheim's forwards

 

[MartyOwns]

i just dont get this hate for Schneider, aside from carrying the puck up the ice and scoring the goals himself, there is nothing more he could have done this season.

nobody hates him. he's a great goalie. there's just no need to give him a long or expensive deal.

of course on hf, you either agree with the cool kids or you must hate the player...no surprise

 

[Devils090]

Betcha Kinkaid coulda won 16 games in 45 starts this season.

betcha he couldnt

 

[MartyOwns]

Jim- you can't see my posts, but please stop bringing up wins. it's the one stat that's irrelevant, apparently