GDT: Game #27: Coyotes @ Sabres - 5:00pm (AZ) - Butt Goal Anniversay Edition

[lanky]

Why?? You prove yourself wrong just about every day.

Not cool.
You're mocking Jakey for making a claim, but you're unwilling to debate the claim. You're better than this.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Not cool.
You're mocking Jakey for making a claim, but you're unwilling to debate the claim. You're better than this.

Except that making a wild statement and then saying, "Prove me wrong," is one of the laziest logical fallacies out there. It's not incumbent on the other person to do the homework - it's the theorist's job to make the proper case.

 

[lanky]

Except that making a wild statement and then saying, "Prove me wrong," is one of the laziest logical fallacies out there. It's not incumbent on the other person to do the homework - it's the theorist's job to make the proper case.

The idea was neither wild nor unsupported. I've seen Jakey support his opinion of our top line being weak 5v5, using +/- and I think also share of shots.

People shouldn't be mocked for their ideas. Ideas should be debated for their merit.

 

[samabam]

Uh-huh

 

[Vinny Boombatz]

Is Veggie a average or below back up goalie?

114 games and basically 3.50 with a .897 save pct%...Ingram should get a majority of the starts, otherwise, we won't come close to competing for the playoffs

 

[TheLegend]

The idea was neither wild nor unsupported. I've seen Jakey support his opinion of our top line being weak 5v5, using +/- and I think also share of shots.

People shouldn't be mocked for their ideas. Ideas should be debated for their merit.

Without Boyd or Keller yes (Keller, Schmaltz) they are weak.

And where are Boyd and Keller right now.??

 

[TheLegend]

Except that making a wild statement and then saying, "Prove me wrong," is one of the laziest logical fallacies out there. It's not incumbent on the other person to do the homework - it's the theorist's job to make the proper case.

See it everyday in BoH. Example..... (with paraphrasing)

Post #1: "50 years of history shows a failure of hockey in Arizona!"

Post #2: "I really don't care about histories...... or you showing me similar history in other markets I like!"

Post #3: "But history shows Arizona is a failure....."




IYKYK

 

[Jakey53]

Except that making a wild statement and then saying, "Prove me wrong," is one of the laziest logical fallacies out there. It's not incumbent on the other person to do the homework - it's the theorist's job to make the proper case.

I did. Prove me wrong. The first line possession is pretty good, but they score less than what the opposition does when they are on the ice. You can't have that. And that doesn't seem to matter who the C is.

Without Boyd or Keller yes (Keller, Schmaltz) they are weak.

And where are Boyd and Keller right now.??

Boy, you lost me on this one.

 

[TheLegend]

Boy, you lost me on this one.

You've been lost from the beginning.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Boyd 16GP +3
Hayton 16 GP -2
Schmaltz 28 GP -11
Cooley 28GP -12
Keller 28GP -14

 

[Jakey53]

Boyd 16GP +3
Hayton 16 GP -2
Schmaltz 28 GP -11
Cooley 28GP -12
Keller 28GP -14

If this the only stat you want to go by, then Boyd should center the first line. If you dig a little further you will notice that this year, with Hayton as center, Keller has 14 PPP and only 11 EVP. Schmaltz 10 and 10, but last year Keller had 10 PPP and 65 EVP, Schmaltz was 12 PPP and 45 EVP. Last year Keller was 11th EVP in the NHL, this year 173rd.. Why the big difference this year? I believe it's the regression of Hayton's play this year. Last year he at least resembled a 2C, this year, not even close. I have said all along Hayton is probably the best fit on that first line, which shows our sad state of our C talent. Keller and Schmaltz are both small and soft wingers, and with Hayton being next to useless, other teams can focus on these two. And stop with they get the tougher assignments BS. If you believe that to be true, why were they so much better last year when they had the tougher assignments? Your first line is there for production first, D second. In other words, they should be doing what they did last year.

 

[cobra427]

If this the only stat you want to go by, then Boyd should center the first line. If you dig a little further you will notice that this year, with Hayton as center, Keller has 14 PPP and only 11 EVP. Schmaltz 10 and 10, but last year Keller had 10 PPP and 65 EVP, Schmaltz was 12 PPP and 45 EVP. Last year Keller was 11th EVP in the NHL, this year 173rd.. Why the big difference this year? I believe it's the regression of Hayton's play this year. Last year he at least resembled a 2C, this year, not even close. I have said all along Hayton is probably the best fit on that first line, which shows our sad state of our C talent. Keller and Schmaltz are both small and soft wingers, and with Hayton being next to useless, other teams can focus on these two. And stop with they get the tougher assignments BS. If you believe that to be true, why were they so much better last year when they had the tougher assignments? Your first line is there for production first, D second. In other words, they should be doing what they did last year.

PP is better this year, even strength of first line is worse, its a trade off. Maybe Keller and Schmaltz have regressed, you are blaming Hayton for that, maybe unfairly. Our problem is on the defensive side, and its team D, Hayton is our best defensive C. It will help our team when he returns, you way under estimate his value, the part that isn't based on stats.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

If this the only stat you want to go by, then Boyd should center the first line. If you dig a little further you will notice that this year, with Hayton as center, Keller has 14 PPP and only 11 EVP. Schmaltz 10 and 10, but last year Keller had 10 PPP and 65 EVP, Schmaltz was 12 PPP and 45 EVP. Last year Keller was 11th EVP in the NHL, this year 173rd.. Why the big difference this year? I believe it's the regression of Hayton's play this year. Last year he at least resembled a 2C, this year, not even close. I have said all along Hayton is probably the best fit on that first line, which shows our sad state of our C talent. Keller and Schmaltz are both small and soft wingers, and with Hayton being next to useless, other teams can focus on these two. And stop with they get the tougher assignments BS. If you believe that to be true, why were they so much better last year when they had the tougher assignments? Your first line is there for production first, D second. In other words, they should be doing what they did last year.

Don't throw your tougher assignments crap at me Jakey, I didn't ever say such. The reason they are not producing as well (Keller/Schmaltz) is born from the insistence on O-zone possession time. I don't know if that's a coaching mandate, or if the two are (for whatever reason) less apt to shoot, but it's fairly obvious to anyone who watches the games.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Don't throw your tougher assignments crap at me Jakey, I didn't ever say such. The reason they are not producing as well (Keller/Schmaltz) is born from the insistence on O-zone possession time. I don't know if that's a coaching mandate, or if the two are (for whatever reason) less apt to shoot, but it's fairly obvious to anyone who watches the games.

I'm not sure about that. What I see on the first line is a lack of a puck possession forward who can dish it to Keller or Schmaltz when they're in a position to do something with the puck. I don't think either Keller or Schmaltz are world class in creating their own opportunities to shoot when they have to manage the puck in areas not conducive to taking a shot.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

I'm not sure about that. What I see on the first line is a lack of a puck possession forward who can dish it to Keller or Schmaltz when they're in a position to do something with the puck. I don't think either Keller or Schmaltz are world class in creating their own opportunities to shoot when they have to manage the puck in areas not conducive to taking a shot.

I don't agree. Cooley would have fit that bill, he has other issues, but dishing the puck is not a problem for him.

Keller/Schmaltz, high cycle, some low cycling and rim arounds are predominantly played within themselves. They don't even get in shooting position that often because they seem more concerned with puck possession. They do a great job of it, it looks fabulous, but it hasn't been contributing point totals.

 

[Jakey53]

I don't agree. Cooley would have fit that bill, he has other issues, but dishing the puck is not a problem for him.

Keller/Schmaltz, high cycle, some low cycling and rim arounds are predominantly played within themselves. They don't even get in shooting position that often because they seem more concerned with puck possession. They do a great job of it, it looks fabulous, but it hasn't been contributing point totals.

Exactly, and why hasn't it being producing points? They did the same last year. I say it's the third cog on that line. Other teams are letting Keller and Schmaltz circle and circle and circle until they are exhausted and time for a line change. Hayton scares no one. Keller and Schmaltz hardly pass to Hayton in the offensive zone.

Don't throw your tougher assignments crap at me Jakey, I didn't ever say such. The reason they are not producing as well (Keller/Schmaltz) is born from the insistence on O-zone possession time. I don't know if that's a coaching mandate, or if the two are (for whatever reason) less apt to shoot, but it's fairly obvious to anyone who watches the games.

That tougher assignment was thrown at Cobra, but you two are joined at the hip anyway.

 

[Jakey53]

I'm not sure about that. What I see on the first line is a lack of a puck possession forward who can dish it to Keller or Schmaltz when they're in a position to do something with the puck. I don't think either Keller or Schmaltz are world class in creating their own opportunities to shoot when they have to manage the puck in areas not conducive to taking a shot.

Their puck possession is pretty good, but skating around the perimeter passing to each other doesn't create scoring chances.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Exactly, and why hasn't it being producing points? They did the same last year. I say it's the third cog on that line. Other teams are letting Keller and Schmaltz circle and circle and circle until they are exhausted and time for a line change. Hayton scares no one. Keller and Schmaltz hardly pass to Hayton in the offensive zone.

We all know what you think Jakey, therefore we all know it's incorrect.
Seriously, how many different centers can we throw out there with the same result before you get off your Hate'n?

Their puck possession is pretty good, but skating around the perimeter passing to each other doesn't create scoring chances.

You can definitely score off the cycle, at some point someone has to get in a shooting lane and shoot though. Wish I could draw you some options on that..... Maybe try "Hockey for Dummies?"

 

[Jakey53]

We all know what you think Jakey, therefore we all know it's incorrect.
Seriously, how many different centers can we throw out there with the same result before you get off your Hate'n?


You can definitely score off the cycle, at some point someone has to get in a shooting lane and shoot though. Wish I could draw you some options on that..... Maybe try "Hockey for Dummies?"

That's the problem. We don't have a C capable of being a 1C, and with Hate'n (good name) playing like he doesn't want to be in that position sure doesn't help. You better send Bear the options as they so far haven't figured it out.

 

[Schemp]

That's the problem. We don't have a C capable of being a 1C, and with Hate'n (good name) playing like he doesn't want to be in that position sure doesn't help. You better send Bear the options as they so far haven't figured it out.

It sure would be nice if we could acquire Elias Lindholm. Solid 2 way center that would fit great between Keller and Schmaltz. He would look good centering between Maccelli and Crouse or even playing RW for Cooley.

 

[LittlePipes]

I really liked what AT said to Todd Walsh when Walsh tried to give the excuse of too many key players out. paraphrasing - “I just told you, if you cant make a play it doesnt matter who is in there”.
I think he was annoyed with Walsh ( surprising huh?) and didnt want to make excuses and have the healthy guys assume they weren’t at fault, could be victims, etc.
In reality I guess, with better players you can make better plays, but if you fail to execute, then “it dont mattuh” .

 

[LittlePipes]

I was at 3 of the 5 game winning streak games. In the Av game , it seemed to me, the Coyotes played very well, including of course Ingram. A really good game by both sides.
The blues game: Ingram was great and their goalie wasnt very good.
The Caps game was a strange one as the Coyotes didnt look real good at 1st, but Kuemps went sieve and boom 5-0 after 1. The caps gave up.
So, one great team effort, and some bad goaltending we took advantage of.
My point is… despite 5 in a row, which I loved, they didnt play that great.

 

[Jakey53]

I really liked what AT said to Todd Walsh when Walsh tried to give the excuse of too many key players out. paraphrasing - “I just told you, if you cant make a play it doesnt matter who is in there”.
I think he was annoyed with Walsh ( surprising huh?) and didnt want to make excuses and have the healthy guys assume they weren’t at fault, could be victims, etc.
In reality I guess, with better players you can make better plays, but if you fail to execute, then “it dont mattuh” .

Bear has snapped at Walsh and Morgan a few times when they ask stupid questions.

 

[Jakey53]

It sure would be nice if we could acquire Elias Lindholm. Solid 2 way center that would fit great between Keller and Schmaltz. He would look good centering between Maccelli and Crouse or even playing RW for Cooley.

Lindholm is a very good player, but is 29 and will want the moon on his next contract. Not sure what BA is going to do going forward, but with no 1C or 1D it will be hard to get into the playoffs.