From watching the QMJHL game last night (not a Crosby Thread!)

[jacklours]

I don't think we develop poor defenceman, I just think that most of the kids play on forward for some reason. I know when I ref minor hockey, or watch it I notice how most of the talented players all play on forward. Many times you see kids that are told to go play on D if they want to play AA or BB. I really can't explain why, but kids do play on forwards when they are gifted. It starts as early as novice where most of the defenceman are those kids that aren't fast enough to play on forward or are usually the bigger ones (read here overweight). It's like if coaches mentality is to put their players on offence and not defence. Score as many goals as you can and not allow as less as possible.

Anyways, I don't know if that's how it is in the whole prevince, but it sure is in the Eastern Townships

 

[Campino]

Who do you guys think are the top 10 dman in the QMJHL? Based on overall play.

 

[Emerald City Bruin]

Top 10 Mosaik MasterCard LCH – Week No 5
Rg Équipe SD SC
1 Knights de London (17-0-1-0) 1 5
2 Tigers de Medicine Hat (13-2-1-0) 2 5
3 Wildcats de Moncton (15-5-1-0) 3 5
4 Saguenéens de Chicoutimi (13-5-3-2) 4 4
5 Blades de Saskatoon (12-4-1-0) 5 3
6 Thunderbirds de Seattle (12-4-0-0) 6 3
7 Remparts de Québec (13-5-3-1) 10 2
8 Battalion de Brampton (10-6-2-1) 7 4
9 Olympiques de Gatineau (11-7-2-2) 8 5
10 Rangers de Kitchener (10-5-2-0) NR 1

*******

4 QMJHL teams in the CHL Top 10!

And most Quebec blueliners would not make the OHL and the CHL?

Come on boys.

You're going to use the rankings to show that the Q defenceman are good? All that shows is that they can beat up on themselves. There's no interleague play so trying to draw a corrolation between number of teams ranked and defensive ability won't work.

 

[mazmin]

I don't think we develop poor defenceman, I just think that most of the kids play on forward for some reason. I know when I ref minor hockey, or watch it I notice how most of the talented players all play on forward. Many times you see kids that are told to go play on D if they want to play AA or BB. I really can't explain why, but kids do play on forwards when they are gifted. It starts as early as novice where most of the defenceman are those kids that aren't fast enough to play on forward or are usually the bigger ones (read here overweight). It's like if coaches mentality is to put their players on offence and not defence. Score as many goals as you can and not allow as less as possible.

Anyways, I don't know if that's how it is in the whole prevince, but it sure is in the Eastern Townships

This could make for an interesting sociological study. I know my first years of hockey my coach put me on the blue line based on my height and reach despite the fact that I was more developped in my skills as I learned to skate before most kids. If I was living in Quebec (not Manitoba) would I have been a forward? Interesting...

 

[LaLaLaprise]

Who do you guys think are the top 10 dman in the QMJHL? Based on overall play.

Ill do a rough top 10 taking into account play at both ends.

1. Nicolas Marcotte - Chicoutimi - 19
2. Jonathan Paiment - Lewiston - 19
3. Alexandre Picard - Halifax - 19
4. Mario Scalzo - Victoriaville - 20
5. Sam Roberts - Gatineau - 20
6. Nathan Saunders - Moncton - 19
7. Luc Bourdon - Val D'or - 17
8. Jean-Michel Bolduc - Rimouski - 19
9. Jean-Phillipe Paquet - Shawinigan - 17
10. Patrick Columbe - Rimouski - 19


I have a feeling Rimouski fans will jump all over me for putting Columbe 10th but i dont care. Campino asked for ALL-AROUND play. Not 2nd assist totals.

 

[billabong55]

I have to agree that a defence-first strategy is not something the QMJHL has followed over the years. While it has been noticeable over the past few seasons that they are starting to focus a bit more on defense (especially the Maritime teams) I don't see that transition being made for a while.

Of course with the way the NHL has such a focus on defense, the Q may have no choice, if they want to produce quality NHLers that grasp the defense-first attitude.

But I really can't complain. I enjoy being able to watch exciting hockey when the skilled forwards are dekeing out both d-men, or the goalies are making flashy glove saves.

That aside, it is too hard to compare the 3 leagues. They all follow different philosophies, so it is very difficult to say that one is better than the other. They all give us a different taste of hockey. For those who enjoy great defense, they will always love the WHL, but for those that enjoy the offensive side, the will probably watch the Q.

About goalies for the WJC, why is Martin Houle getting no mention of being invited to the camp? I understand most people think Julien-Ellis (sp??) is the most likely goalie prospect from the Q, but after watching Houle for the past three seasons, he seems capable. It really is too bad he probably won't get the chance.

 

[jacklours]

This could make for an interesting sociological study. I know my first years of hockey my coach put me on the blue line based on my height and reach despite the fact that I was more developped in my skills as I learned to skate before most kids. If I was living in Quebec (not Manitoba) would I have been a forward? Interesting...

Well, actually based on past experiences and observation most likely. Something that could probably explain that is the fact kids who develop better when they are 5-6-7 years old (pre-novice with the half ice), tend to carry the puck a lot more then fellow players so when is the time to determine actual positions in novice coaches (usually parents who have been following the kid since their own son has been playing) probably all see them as forward since that's what those kids have been looking like for the previous years.

Though that wouldn't explain why Quebec develops more forward then defenceman, since it is pretty much the same hockey structure everywhere in Canada. Unless of course you don't have such things as pre-novice (or however you call it)

 

[jacklours]

Actually I just thought of something else, the fact that Quebec players start hitting only bantam elite. While everywhere else in Canada it starts as soon as Atom which would explain that you need strong, big defenceman. I'm positive that hitting stuff has some consequences in what we've been debating so far (yeah I know I live in a province of *****, Quebec always has to be the province that hates contact. Same goes for Lacrosse, where you can only crosscheck players in the 24 feet doted line, can't ever slashcheck an opponent who has the ball and can't hit, slashcheck or crosscheck to get looseballs)

 

[LaLaLaprise]

About goalies for the WJC, why is Martin Houle getting no mention of being invited to the camp? I understand most people think Julien-Ellis (sp??) is the most likely goalie prospect from the Q, but after watching Houle for the past three seasons, he seems capable. It really is too bad he probably won't get the chance.

Houle is 5'10, he doesnt get respect because of it.

 

[Ticallion961]

Houle is 5'10, he doesnt get respect because of it.

Pretty sad too, never gets any of the limelight, weather it be because of Fleury, or as you mentioned his height. The guy brings it every night and is one of the only reasons that CB is a half respectable team this season.

 

[billabong55]

Houle is 5'10, he doesnt get respect because of it.

That really is too bad, because he's a very good goalie.

 

[Flames Draft Watcher]

That really is too bad, because he's a very good goalie.

He may not look as good on the international stage where the average player is much better than the average QMJHL player and where players are more likely to be able to exploit his lack of size by going topshelf.

 

[thestonedkoala]

So, if I am guessing right, the Q defensemen are subpar, so does that mean there is likely a chance that JM Bolduc won't make it?

 

[LaLaLaprise]

Bolduc is probably the 5th best guy from the Q on defense. I don think anyone from the Q has a shot at this team.

 

[Drake1588]

In DC, woeful Caps' #3 defenseman and Q graduate Jason Doig is considered the team's secret weapon en route to another pretty high draft pick, sadly enough, depending on your perspective and patience with a rebuild. He's game, and he hits anything, but he just doesn't have much of a defensive game, whether due to coaching or innate talent or some combination thereof. At any rate, the Q certainly doesn't produce a lot of strong NHL defensemen. That, at least, is quantifiable.

 

[MikeC44]

Ill do a rough top 10 taking into account play at both ends.

1. Nicolas Marcotte - Chicoutimi - 19
2. Jonathan Paiment - Lewiston - 19
3. Alexandre Picard - Halifax - 19
4. Mario Scalzo - Victoriaville - 20
5. Sam Roberts - Gatineau - 20
6. Nathan Saunders - Moncton - 19
7. Luc Bourdon - Val D'or - 17
8. Jean-Michel Bolduc - Rimouski - 19
9. Jean-Phillipe Paquet - Shawinigan - 17
10. Patrick Columbe - Rimouski - 19


I have a feeling Rimouski fans will jump all over me for putting Columbe 10th but i dont care. Campino asked for ALL-AROUND play. Not 2nd assist totals.

Marcotte is 20.
I would add:
Sersen - Rimouski - 19
Sharrow - Halifax - 19
Pardy - Cape Breton - 20

I don't think Bourdon or Paquet are there just yet.

 

[Blackshad]

Viennau for shawinigan is pretty good too..
He gets so nasty when someone is in front of his net.

 

[Sweeney]

Ill do a rough top 10 taking into account play at both ends.

1. Nicolas Marcotte - Chicoutimi - 19
2. Jonathan Paiment - Lewiston - 19
3. Alexandre Picard - Halifax - 19
4. Mario Scalzo - Victoriaville - 20
5. Sam Roberts - Gatineau - 20
6. Nathan Saunders - Moncton - 19
7. Luc Bourdon - Val D'or - 17
8. Jean-Michel Bolduc - Rimouski - 19
9. Jean-Phillipe Paquet - Shawinigan - 17
10. Patrick Columbe - Rimouski - 19


I have a feeling Rimouski fans will jump all over me for putting Columbe 10th but i dont care. Campino asked for ALL-AROUND play. Not 2nd assist totals.

the only thing i dont like is Roberts ahead of Rimouski d-man.. Paiement is better than Marcotte for me and Sarsen is also a good shot... but good top 10

 

[LaLaLaprise]

Marcotte is 20.
I would add:
Sersen - Rimouski - 19
Sharrow - Halifax - 19
Pardy - Cape Breton - 20

I don't think Bourdon or Paquet are there just yet.

Sharrow makes too many mistakes, as does Sersen. Pardy is good but not top 10.

 

[Anksun]

Different mentality i guess.

Players in Quebec are growing as Forward mostly.

Even in my "friends" league, defensemen are hard to find. For now the 4 who have come in the club last are the d-men because we have no other choice. It seems like everyone want to play offense.

At a younger age, it's usually more fun to play offense and go putting this little puck into the net than preventing it from going into his own net. It's the mentality in Quebec and I dont think it's gonna changed soon.

Play for fun is what should be the most important thing. And i'm about sure, would you ask to kids in Quebec (i dont know mentality in the west...) where they like to play the most, 95% (maybe more) would said FORWARD.
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Returning to your main point about Points been less valuable in the Q. Even if you think the Def is weaker, why would a point worth less in the Q than in the OHL if the goals per game are about the same???

If the Q would never bring good forwards either to the NHL, than we could used the D-men "fact" to justify what is been said here. But since years after years, the top points are on par points wise with other league and are going to the NHL as the ohl and whl are, i think a point is a point.
_______________________________

Just a last quick note. Someone said the d-men are not up to par and that taking the best best in the Q (and in the top10 of CHL) are not a good example of the league in general while another note have been about how the goalies in the Q are not really better this year and the main point of this was because the top3 goalies are not in the Q this year... ??? So the top teams in the Q are not a good indications of how the def (and main play) goes in the Q BUT the top 5 goalies in Canada is a good indication that Quebec is not a better goalie league this year. Something doesnt work there.