GDT: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 3

[DrEasy]

Seriously? Are you suggesting morality starts and ends with criminal charges? I haven't seen the NHL's investigation, without that Im not about to start speculating

He's probably asking about this specific case.

 

[Micklebot]

I'm not making a judgement either way on what did or didn't happen, but the fact there was a civil suit and criminal investigation will be grounds to suspend. The player conduct policy is purposely written in a very broad manner so as to give the commissioner unilateral power to suspend for anything that makes the league look bad. I think we're past the point of wondering whether suspensions are coming.

The fact that the civil suit had enough to it for Hockey Canada to settle suggests that whatever happened was significant enough that they didn't want it made fully public, which to me suggests that while criminal acts may or may not have occurred, what ever did was potentially damaging to, and I'm going to quote here, "the best interest of the Club, the League or professional hockey generally".

 

[JD1]

Hockey Canada was hoping to shut the whole thing down. They paid out without the implicated ever having a chance to say anything about it

We don't know what happened and we may never know.

Certainly the league has the ability to take action against the players. I just don't think they will without charges having been laid.

 

[Sun God Nika]

Hockey Canada was hoping to shut the whole thing down. They paid out without the implicated ever having a chance to say anything about it

We don't know what happened and we may never know.

Certainly the league has the ability to take action against the players. I just don't think they will without charges having been laid.

I agree, I think once the thought of legal recourse came in the league realized it is better to just wait for the London Police to release their charges first before the NHL drops their suspensions.

This might draw out this process even longer.

 

[OD99]

QOC is a bit of an oddball stat, for one, there's no indication of what metric they are using to determine the QOC, is CF? xGF%? TOI%?

Zone starts is funny too, because in his ~313 mins with Hamonic, JBD, Zub and Zaitsev, it's actually fairly low at around 47%, it's his ~220 mins with Chabot, Chychrun, and Sanderson that see it skyrocket to 60+%, then there's the ~440 mins with Holden at his average around 55-56

This makes total sense when you consider they have Brann out with our top 3 guys when they are looking to generate offensive chances.

 

[Micklebot]

For sure they are all odd stats, I'm only using statistical representations because saying "it's easy to see by watching the games that he's incredibly sheltered" wouldn't go over well or be a very strong backing argument

I mean, most third pairs are sheltered. I'd say given his usage in a "we're down and need more offense, maybe Brannstrom with Chabot will do it" situation makes him even more sheltered.

Is the sheltering a typical 3rd pair gets going to guarantee a good +/-, i don't think so, lots of third pairings have poor +/-. Is brannstrom's sheltering particularly egregious? idk, maybe.

 

[Masked]

The fact that the civil suit had enough to it for Hockey Canada to settle suggests that whatever happened was significant enough that they didn't want it made fully public, which to me suggests that while criminal acts may or may not have occurred, what ever did was potentially damaging to, and I'm going to quote here, "the best interest of the Club, the League or professional hockey generally".

The civil suit never named players. Without knowing the financial details of the settlement, we can't ascertain if HC was legitimately concerned about the situation or just felt that a settlement was cheaper than the cost of fighting it.

Assen na yo!

 

[Micklebot]

The civil suit never named players. Without knowing the financial details of the settlement, we can't ascertain if HC was legitimately concerned about the situation or just felt that a settlement was cheaper than the cost of fighting it.

Assen na yo!

I susepect that if the London police found enough evidence to suggest they could potentially charge 5, hockey canada probably saw enough in the civil suit that was brought to see this as more than a nuisance, but you're free to believe whatever you like.

 

[BondraTime]

I mean, most third pairs are sheltered. I'd say given his usage in a "we're down and need more offense, maybe Brannstrom with Chabot will do it" situation makes him even more sheltered.

Is the sheltering a typical 3rd pair gets going to guarantee a good +/-, i don't think so, lots of third pairings have poor +/-. Is brannstrom's sheltering particularly egregious? idk, maybe.

Like I said, most/all 3rd pairings are sheltered, but Brannstrom has very clearly been sheltered much more than our other bottom pairing D.

We can argue until the cows come home about why that was, but the fact remains he was

 

[BrawlFan]

Flame away boys. I think I’ve been had. Apologies for saying things that I heard without sitting on it.

@Relapsing you may now let me have it.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Flame away boys. I think I’ve been had. Apologies for saying things that I heard without sitting on it.

@Relapsing you may now let me have it.

Wow, I can't believe it!! None of us can believe it man. This is crazy!(#*#

 

[Senscore]

Flame away boys. I think I’ve been had. Apologies for saying things that I heard without sitting on it.

@Relapsing you may now let me have it.

 

[JD1]

I susepect that if the London police found enough evidence to suggest they could potentially charge 5, hockey canada probably saw enough in the civil suit that was brought to see this as more than a nuisance, but you're free to believe whatever you like.

if the London police found enough evidence to suggest they could potentially charge 5

If, could, potentially

Here's what's known about the situation at this time: the London police haven't charged anyone with anything. Why? I have my own thoughts on why, but I'm curious how you'll spin it.

 

[JD1]

O zone and D zone stats don't mean that much to me and I'm not hugely convinced they're very indicative of sheltering.

Brannstrom's never been used as a shut down guy so he's not going to have significant time against high end offensive talent if the coaches get the match ups they want.

 

[BigRig4]

The civil suit never named players. Without knowing the financial details of the settlement, we can't ascertain if HC was legitimately concerned about the situation or just felt that a settlement was cheaper than the cost of fighting it.

Assen na yo!

The civil suit named eight players, along with Hockey Canada and the CHL. The version that was publicly disclosed redacts their names to protect the identity of the victim.

if the London police found enough evidence to suggest they could potentially charge 5

If, could, potentially

Here's what's known about the situation at this time: the London police haven't charged anyone with anything. Why? I have my own thoughts on why, but I'm curious how you'll spin it.

The London Police were granted an ITO less than 6 months ago. It can take years to go through the evidence collected. There's nothing irregular about the investigation being incomplete as of yet.

 

[BondraTime]

O zone and D zone stats don't mean that much to me and I'm not hugely convinced they're very indicative of sheltering.

Brannstrom's never been used as a shut down guy so he's not going to have significant time against high end offensive talent if the coaches get the match ups they want.

Thats the definition of sheltering, to be fair.

 

[Relapsing]

Flame away boys. I think I’ve been had. Apologies for saying things that I heard without sitting on it.

@Relapsing you may now let me have it.

Nah.

You've owned it, and no one likes feeling like they've been had, lied to, or given bad info, do they?

 

[BondraTime]

When guys come up and are getting sheltered; like Kleven, Guenette, Thomson, JBD, etc. you are almost always, without exception, going to see more Ozone starts that Dzone starts. That’s just how it works, the coaching staff is going to put guys that aren’t as relied on or as trusted out in the better situations. Sometimes they’re better offensively, sometimes they just aren’t guys you want out there to start in the defensive end.

Brannstrom gets that type of deployment. Bottom pair is always going to be a sheltered role, but if there is a defensive zone start, more often than not we aren’t putting Brannstrom out there, with less minutes comes higher variance, and Brannstrom’s obviously leans towards the offensive zone with less trust.

 

[OD99]

The civil suit named eight players, along with Hockey Canada and the CHL. The version that was publicly disclosed redacts their names to protect the identity of the victim.


The London Police were granted an ITO less than 6 months ago. It can take years to go through the evidence collected. There's nothing irregular about the investigation being incomplete as of yet.

LPD also investigated when the incident occurred and didn't come away with any charges. It wasn't until this came up again that they re-engaged and there was talk of, "some charges to some people".

That, to me, is one of the most curious aspects of this terrible ordeal. Why were they so quick to stop the investigation initially yet now they put resources towards it but most important - how often does that happen?

 

[BondraTime]

LPD also investigated when the incident occurred and didn't come away with any charges. It wasn't until this came up again that they re-engaged and there was talk of, "some charges to some people".

That, to me, is one of the most curious aspects of this terrible ordeal. Why were they so quick to stop the investigation initially yet now they put resources towards it but most important - how often does that happen?

Because the pressure from Government after it reached social media and nationwide attention is impossible to ignore.

 

[Beech]

LPD also investigated when the incident occurred and didn't come away with any charges. It wasn't until this came up again that they re-engaged and there was talk of, "some charges to some people".

That, to me, is one of the most curious aspects of this terrible ordeal. Why were they so quick to stop the investigation initially yet now they put resources towards it but most important - how often does that happen?

What would you do if you are a constable investigating this?

The players tell their side, she tells hers. Then the police go around to her friends and associates and others who may know her. And the testimony is not flattering!!!

So, you have a She said/They said... a character test that maybe she fails... Now how do you continue?

I had a wonderful 1 hour visit with 2 constables in February. There was a domestic violence incident at my neighbor. I called 911.. Junior next door gets wind, He came over and threatened me.. Anyway, there are the constables.

And what a fascinating hour.. They were very honest... Good luck in asserting guilt/innocence. Who did what?

I said he threatened to burn my house down.. Their advice; MOVE. I said, I fear retribution. They said, get a camera.. I say; he threatened me; they said, do you have it recorded?

Do you sort of see? In todays society, unless you have overwhelming evidence, the Police are handcuffed.

It gets better.. I called teh city 2 years ago.. Asking about a fence and gate between me and my neighbor (Same trouble maker).. They could not tell me anything about the fence and said, I needed to see a lawyer.. I said why? what is teh law concerning it? What will a lawyer tell me, yes or no based upon laws that do not exist.

The Police are in similar situation. Half the time, they have no idea of what a judge will rule. Because half the time, there is no law.

 

[Micklebot]

if the London police found enough evidence to suggest they could potentially charge 5

If, could, potentially

Here's what's known about the situation at this time: the London police haven't charged anyone with anything. Why? I have my own thoughts on why, but I'm curious how you'll spin it.

Lol how I'll spin it, ok there JD1.

You're right, I misremembered the details, it was they had enough to get a production order and to seek search warrants, reasonable grounds to believe a crime was committed, point was this wasn't nothing and there was ample reason for hockey Canada to be worried about it, not just a case of a settlement because successful litigation would cost more.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Seriously? Are you suggesting morality starts and ends with criminal charges? I haven't seen the NHL's investigation, without that Im not about to start speculating

Seriously… is this entire last 10 pages in the thread speculation about shit that is off topic?

 

[Dan Patrick]

Seriously… is this entire last 10 pages in the thread speculation about shit that is off topic?

It’s august what else are we supposed to talk about.

 

[Cosmix]

Hockey Canada was hoping to shut the whole thing down. They paid out without the implicated ever having a chance to say anything about it

We don't know what happened and we may never know.

Certainly the league has the ability to take action against the players. I just don't think they will without charges having been laid.

I think there is a possibility that the NHL league could issue discipline to some of the players if the NHL investigation finds that the players' conduct was against the league's policy.