Flyers Regular Season Discussion Thread V

[flyersfan187]

If Streit doesn't at least bring a 2nd rounder back I would be surprised.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Then again...retaining actual salary isn't actually giving another team cash.

 

[hatcher]

And some of you doubt our demi-God GM!

After Hextall moved Vinnie and L Schenn for Weal and a 3rd rd pick, and pulled off the Kimmo and Coburn trades, I'm convinced he walks on water.

Vinny agreed to retire or no trade. Hexy had nothing to do with it.

 

[deadhead]

Vinny agreed to retire or no trade. Hexy had nothing to do with it.

Huh? Hextall made it clear he'd spend the next couple years in the press box if he didn't agree to a trade. The Kings required him to retire, which helped both teams.

The result was a win-win for all three parties, Hextall dumped a bad contract, the Kings got a low cost scorer, and Vinnie got one last shot at a playoff run before he rode off into the sunset.

 

[GKJ]

Eklund is trash.

What a ****ing hack. I don't know if he piggybacked off Dave Isaac, or if Dave trolled him or what was going on, but that was an unabashed attempted to stir up **** and take credit just in case something crazy was happening on his part. I'm kind of convinced Dave did it to troll Eklund and it ruffled the feathers of some followers because all he did was tweet about something he saw.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Lebrun has an ESPN article suggesting more of the Streit to Montreal and Del Zotto to anywhere else.

http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/...y-defensemen-demand-trade-deadline-approaches

 

[Curufinwe]

That's encouraging.

 

[Curufinwe]

I believe it's only cap? They removed actual cash as a trade chip long ago. Maybe they put it back in with controls, but I'd be rather surprised if they did so.

One would think the NHLPA and Fehr would've leaped all over that as proof that greater revenue sharing needs exploration as a solution rather than taking players' money.

Cap hit and salary have to be retained at the same percentage. In Streit's case his cap hit is $5.25m, but his salary is only $2m because he got a $2m signing bonus in June.

But of course everything is pro-rated and the season is almost 3/4 over.

 

[Lord Defect]

I wish we grabbed stone.

 

[tictactoe]

I wish we grabbed stone.

what for? wait 1-2 years.

 

[Lord Defect]

what for? wait 1-2 years.

Personal reasons, and that was such a low offer.

 

[phil162888]

Just watching the Leafs vs Jets game and I had to write this post. Talking of puck luck .... I watch almost every Flyer game and a decent amount of Leaf games as I live in TO. The Leafs no word of a lie seem to get 1 bad goal scored for them at least in 40-50% of the games i watch. The Flyers are lucky to get them once every 10-15 games maybe more. Its absolutely crazy with the amount of shots this team takes that it can't get any fluky goals. We joke about how we can never score against the backups .. hopefully our luck will turn but I just found it funny as the Jets goalie gave up a goal that a 3rd grader should've had

 

[Hiesenberg]

I just got into a ridiculously long twitter discussion about trading Giroux/Voracek/Schenn.

I took the anti-trade side, but I was shocked to see how many were completely for it.

I guess I look at it as if you trade those guys, this team will be bottom 5 bad for years, and we are hoping on luck to find replacements. Because those trades don't return just as good or better players. Flyers would mostly get a bunch of picks, but its not like we get a Patrik Laine out of it.

 

[Johnk0728]

I just got into a ridiculously long twitter discussion about trading Giroux/Voracek/Schenn.

I took the anti-trade side, but I was shocked to see how many were completely for it.

I guess I look at it as if you trade those guys, this team will be bottom 5 bad for years, and we are hoping on luck to find replacements. Because those trades don't return just as good or better players. Flyers would mostly get a bunch of picks, but its not like we get a Patrik Laine out of it.

The Flyers are barely a playoff team with them. But I do not think Giroux is really movable w/ that contract. Voracek is possibly movable.

 

[Flyotes]

A thing to remember about the Stone 1 year contract signed last year was that it appeared to be a prove it contract after coming off injury. He didn't prove it.

I'm still surprised they didn't wait and try to get a little more.

 

[flyersjim73]

In no way, shape, or form do I think G should be moved, but I would GLADLY take that bet.

The starting point for that trade would be a relatively high first rounder.... starting point.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

The Flyers are barely a playoff team with them. But I do not think Giroux is really movable w/ that contract. Voracek is possibly movable.

Of course he is movable. Don't been silly.

 

[YEM]

I just got into a ridiculously long twitter discussion about trading Giroux/Voracek/Schenn.

I took the anti-trade side, but I was shocked to see how many were completely for it.

the future is unavoidably tied to the development of our D younglings
and most of them aren't old enough to buy a beer

so we either hang on to 28/93 and hope against hope that they age tremendously well and their contracts don't become anchors or we deal them for younger pieces whose primes will be more in line with the younglings coming up on D

so many were completely for it because the answer seems to be a bit obvious...

 

[Appleyard]

Or we:

Hold onto the 1st line calibre forwards we have for now. Trust that history and probability repeat themselves and Giroux and Voracek at least are still 1st line calibre (60+ pts) until age ~34.

Wait and see what the defensemen become. And then if they mature quicker than expected not in situation where have no forwards to support them for a couple of years.

Keep drafting well in mean-time.

If in ~2 years seem ready to compete but have specific holes they know what the actual holes are to plug.



Part of the problem is a lot of people do not believe how young the average Dman becomes high end if he is ever going to. There is a disconnect between reality and belief for two reasons:

A. Media declaration of Dmen being 'elite' is not tied to something as specific as points like forwards. Keith was elite in his 2nd season... but no-one outside of the writers in his division knew it until 2 years later. Dman rep and general consensus appreciation takes longer to build.

B. Dmen have longer primes as their role is not half as much tied to fast-twitch muscle... that depending on person starts to decline at ~26-31. So people see a Dmen in his prime still at ~34 and forget how long he has been good.



Seriously... people talk about Chara as being the classic 'late developer' he was a #1 at age 25. And he is one of the slowest top end Dmen to ever get to that level age wise.

Most guys who are going to be #1's get there at age 22-23. Most guys who are going to be top 4 get there at age 21-22.

 

[Curufinwe]

5 of the top 6 scorers on the Sharks are 30+, but we have to trade our top scorers at a discount before they even reach 30.

 

[Appleyard]

5 of the top 6 scorers on the Sharks are 30+, but we have to trade our top scorers at a discount before they even reach 30.

Yep.

And the two oldest teams in the NHL last year competed were in the cup final.

The whole 'if you are good enough, you are old enough' works both ways.

 

[YEM]

5 of the top 6 scorers on the Sharks are 30+, but we have to trade our top scorers at a discount before they even reach 30.

who said "discount?"
you could easily have made the point you were trying to make without putting words in someone's mouth
keep em or trade em, either way is a gamble

 

[Curufinwe]

If you're trading Giroux now when he's having a poor season 5 on 5, you wouldn't get full value for him.

 

[Hiesenberg]

It seems most people who were for it, see the trading Giroux because he won't be a 60pt player moving forward, I get the sense, he'll be an 8MM dollar 35pt player.

He has declined for sure, but he went from a 90 pt guy to a 60-70pt guy. This year he has 42 and that's real bad, I don't think he has 18 pts in him for the rest of the season. So he'll finish with 50. It's tough to argue.

 

[Rebels57]

It seems most people who were for it, see the trading Giroux because he won't be a 60pt player moving forward, I get the sense, he'll be an 8MM dollar 35pt player.

He has declined for sure, but he went from a 90 pt guy to a 60-70pt guy. This year he has 42 and that's real bad, I don't think he has 18 pts in him for the rest of the season. So he'll finish with 50. It's tough to argue.

I can see Giroux having a 10 game hot streak in him as the team makes a push to make the playoffs. He has always played well down the stretch and with the season on the line.

Moving Ghost to the right on the PP might also result in a spike in points for him, as the PP should function better in the short-term.