No You don't just build by drafting. It's what you do after they're drafted that's far more important.
Our performance relative to talent, is pretty much where we finished, and how we performed. Expecting this group to overperform is silly, more than half the roster are guys who shouldn't even be playing in the league. By my account, they have overperformed, they should have finished dead last.
Whats irrational about what I said? They are easily one of the worst rosters of the cap era. EASILY!
Fair, pretty hard to fully judge a coach with an AHL roster in the NHL though. I couldn't care less if they fired him, or kept him around, its the least of the concerns on this team.
Sure, you also thought the team would become better if we just got rid of Q back in the day too.
Q's shelf life had clearly expired.
That's not the point, you were so adamant he was the problem, and the team would get so much better when he was gone, but they got worse. So excuse me if I don't trust your evaluation of coaching.
And like I said, the coaching wasn't the problem, it was the players, just like it is now. Richardson did a decent job last year as coach, he hasn't been great this year, but willing to see him out for another year, because it's going to be another lost year anyway. If they fire him, oh well, but don't expect the next guy to get any more from this garbage roster.
This.
You keep taking leaps and assumptions with my comments I never took.
Coaching doesn't matter?
I didn't take any leaps or assumptions. You actually said what I repeated.
Bruh you wanted us to trade the majority of our picks from 2022-2026 due to covid ruining those leagues lolol. You wont get shit to build on waiting for picks a decade away like you suggested the team should do.
Can't think of a single competitive team this year, that didn't build through the draft, and had multiple terrible years to do that. I guess Dallas didn't have multiple bad years, and Vegas is the exception due to their circumstance. But if we want to wait 12+ years like Dallas to be a Cup contender, then sure, lets bring in UFAs and trade assets!
so is everyone else. the disagreement is whether or not the performance we saw this season was proportional to the roster talent.
ooooo i love me some objectivity. let's pick apart these "objective" failures of the coaching staff.
does nothing to settle the question at hand. could just as well be explained by having a historically bad team.
see above
this is just blatantly subjective, both because it is based in your own subjective interpretation of the facts at hand, and also because "culture" is actually and literally a subjective phenomenon that escapes objective quantification or qualification. hence why everyone keeps saying this is a non-argument and why i wish you'd stop presenting it as though you were actually saying something of value.
and here you are just simply begging the question. the whole point at stake here is the team's performance relative to expectation. which particular player regressed or under-performed? reichel is the only example i can think of as far as blatant disappointments. korchinski had a rough year, but he's also the youngest d-man in the league. vlasic more than out-performed expectations. i think it would be hard to argue bedard had a dissapointing season, unless one was dead set on him scoring a hundred this year. kaiser and del maestro held their own particularly in their late season call-ups. who else even played significant minutes this year that actually factors in to the long term future?
none. you keep pointing at bad results as if that settles the issue, but the issue is not whether the results were bad. the issue at hand is explaining the results. my problem has never been with calling lurich a bad coach and saying that the results cannot be exaplained by poor roster quality. my problem is, with few exceptions, anytime any of you try to justify this opinion, the reasons you give are either ambiguous (in that they can be taken to support either supposition re: performance relative to quality) or outright fallacious. the ambiguity explains the months of talking in circles about this, and the fallaciousness explains why i have repeatedly bothered to insert myself into this argument about what material to use for strings on the fiddles we play while the city burns.
Last 3 deadlines? MF we didnt even have our own first rounder heading into the 2022 lol what should they have done in the 2022 offseason instead of priming the team to pick high in 2023 and actually start the rebuild?
Bruh, nuance is hard. Nobody was arguing against losing for a high end talent. Stop making stuff up as if anybody was pushing to give up top picks or to try to get in the playoffs. Late 1st and 2nd round fetishes are generally a waste of time.
Reichel-somebody got it wrong somewhere
Record setting failure is usually grounds for dismissal in any occupation. Not a hard concept.
There is no team identity. Watch a player get wrecked one night then fight over a clean hit the next. Be ready for one period and then Fu$%-off for 4. Get 16 shots in garbage time for period to close a lead and then get 1 when you're trying. Put 4 right shooters on the pp, pull the rookie for a bad drop pass. Tinordi dresses, a whole line gets benched for a period (accountability)
We're 2 years in. There's more than enough specifics in game chat. The numbers back up the eye test. There's alot we don't see other coaches do.
Boy I hope someone tells Duncan Keith, Alex Debrincat, Kiril Kaprizov, Nikita Kucherov, Nick Lidstrom, Corey Crawford, Kris Letang, Brad Marchand, Patrice Bergeron, and many other non top 10 picks they were a waste of time. Its as if the draft is a crapshoot and you have a better chance of getting a good player if you have more darts to throw at the board who could have thought such a crazy concept?
All 3 first rounders in the 2022 draft were a part of the initial start of the rebuild and in that draft we walked in not even having our own pick that was at #6. 2023 was the first real draft for KD where he wasnt walking into a complete shitshow that Bowman left for him.
Detroit drafted one whole time within the top 5 in part due to them never tearing it down. They let Datsyuk ride off into the sunset only to stay mediocre for far too long after. Perhaps this may be new information but this isnt football you cant rebuild a team off of two drafts lol it can take time. Hawks spent 6 years between getting Keith, Kane, Crawford, Big Buff, Toews, Hjalmarsson, between 2002 to 2007. They got 2 of those players through lottery luck, they got the rest through you guessed it having multiple picks in those drafts which allowed them to take some big swings on said players.
