Speculation: Fantasy GM and Rumor Roundup Thread | "Trader Jim" gearing up for TDL
- Thread starter Mr. Canucklehead
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I actually think they can as long as they have enough cap space to cause it not to roll over. The bigger issue is there's no good reason for Halak to waive to go to Arizona unless he wants to get an early start on golf times.
- Jan 23, 2010
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It's been reported for this type of bonus that the team can pay it anytime after it is hit, which it now has been.
Melvin
21/12/05
I've seen a lot of people talk about this but nobody cares about PAYING the bonus. What matters is the salary cap calculation, and money paid vs money counted towards the cap are not always 1:1.
I have not seen a single person talk about the implications of salary cap overage cushion of the post-season performance bonus calculation in cases where the player is traded before the conclusion of the season. Like sure, you can hand him the money whenever you want, that is neither here nor there.
Our current management team probably shaking their heads so much @ Benning when talks open up about Halaks bonus and NMC
Peen
Rejoicing in a Benning-free world
- Oct 6, 2013
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Part of me thinks that this whole “players hate their names being in discussions after being a .500 team in their 7th year of not being in the top half of league” thing will further push JR towards making moves sooner just to shake things up. Drance made the point in yesterday’s pod about how Edler, Burrows, Hamhuis, Hansen etc. stood up like gentlemen for long stretches about repeated questions on their futures and handled it.
Just weird. It’s also sad because I’m thinking about who would handle these rumors most professionally in terms of understanding that this is a frustrated market and its part of the business and none of our big money guys give me that impression.
Like, Pearson, Motte, Schenn, rest of the Motte line probably as well are the only guys who would be like meh whatever.
I honestly have no idea how these guys can expect anything else.
Melvin
21/12/05
Relevant section (emphasis mine):
Again, I've seen a lot of people say you can "trade the bonus," but not a single person has reported reliably that you can trade the cap hit, and the above paragraph is not super clear to me what happens (regarding the cap hit) if you trade a player after he earns his bonus.
Again, I've seen a lot of people say you can "trade the bonus," but not a single person has reported reliably that you can trade the cap hit, and the above paragraph is not super clear to me what happens (regarding the cap hit) if you trade a player after he earns his bonus.
- Jan 23, 2010
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I haven't seen anything to confirm that the Canucks couldn't involve a 3rd team to retain the bonus. There have been many confusing elements of this bonus structure/application from the beginning, though.
Sure, but most situations you are talking about are ELC contracts. How many veterans with performance bonuses have even been traded?
That said, to clarify my point was not about who is actually paying the money but who is actually absorbing the hit. I haven't seen anything to suggest the Coyotes couldn't absorb the bonus and then ship Halak, similar to how you have seen in countless retained salary trades.
rypper
21-12-05 it's finally over.
- Dec 22, 2006
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I do believe as far as the social media stuff goes canucks twitter as a whole is good, intense at times but altogether good. I'm not really a fan of the term but I do think it's a "lunatic fringe."
I actually just listened to Spittin' Chiclets interview with Thatcher Demko and he said in the past after a bad game he's had DMs saying they hope his dog dies or his mom gets cancer etc. There's no way to prove it was actually canucks fans sending it but Mike Matheson did get the same kind of response on his social media after the Pettersson injury.
If you're a canuck the way to do social media here has been laid out by Luongo. Strombone1 101 the course to follow. If it was me I'd probably just block and DMs and ignore most messages or pay someone to handle that side.
I actually just listened to Spittin' Chiclets interview with Thatcher Demko and he said in the past after a bad game he's had DMs saying they hope his dog dies or his mom gets cancer etc. There's no way to prove it was actually canucks fans sending it but Mike Matheson did get the same kind of response on his social media after the Pettersson injury.
If you're a canuck the way to do social media here has been laid out by Luongo. Strombone1 101 the course to follow. If it was me I'd probably just block and DMs and ignore most messages or pay someone to handle that side.
Melvin
21/12/05
That's the problem, yes. It hasn't really come up. But none of the reporting I've seen has accurately answered the question about how the cap hit calculation works in such a scenario (possibly because nobody knows, because it hasn't come up!) They just blather about teams having to pay for it, which is not what's important.
It's entirely plausible that in such a scenario Arizona pays the bonus but Vancouver absorbs the cap hit (because it was earned while on Vancouver's roster.) Or, Arizona pays the bonus but whichever team has him at the end of the season absorbs the cap hit. I don't know. Nobody seems to be answering that specific question.
Shannon is such a joke, he is worse at this job then he was at managing.
Well they probably would have wanted more than McCaan…
- Jan 23, 2010
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I was pretty sure there was a specific report a few weeks back that stated the bonus/cap hit can still be traded after it is hit, but I can't find it anywhere. Besides, the reporting on this has been wrong continuously so I wouldn't believe it anyway.
Definitely a unique situation. I guess, as you would expect when you give performances bonuses and a NMC to a backup goalie which is pretty unique itself.
rypper
21-12-05 it's finally over.
- Dec 22, 2006
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I mean even a Ashton Sautner for future considerations trade would lead to pages upon pages of discussion here, tweet-storms, podcasts etc. Come on JR&PA feed the sharks.
There's been three separate minor league goalie for future consideration trades by Canadian teams in the last several weeks and the Canucks haven't even been a part of any of them!
% agree, but this was a unique situation where Benning’s interests didn’t necessarily align with the Canucks’ interests in that Benning needed to make the playoffs this year to save his job and getting rid of Eriksson, Beagle and Roussel was essential to that. Arizona absolutely knew this. And they knew that while OEL’s contract was terrible, he provided much better value in the very short term than Eriksson, Beagle and Roussel. I’m sure that Arizona also knew this was an extremely unique situation for Benning’s to try to save his job. So they bent him over a barrel on the terms if the trade. And Benning agreed because he had like no other options to try to save his job, so taking this Hail Mary.
It's pretty awesome that Benning spent $750MM of Aquillini's money to keep his job for 8 years.
Spend money to make money.
trading Boeser first is obvious the right move, high QO and floats.
Management seems to be doing the right things - although a lot should be quite obvious:
1. patient
2. identified the 3 core pieces to build around demko/hughes/petey
3. identified that boeser is the passenger
4. identified Myers as the dman that needs to go if possible
5. identified trading Halak - he's got a good track record, and I believe hes a good goalie just canucks suck defensively, he should have value.
6. taking time with Miller/garland - Personally I wouldn't move Garland and only move Miller if we get a lot back.
would also trade Horvat as his value will likely decline in the future and he can't make a pass to save his life.
Management seems to be doing the right things - although a lot should be quite obvious:
1. patient
2. identified the 3 core pieces to build around demko/hughes/petey
3. identified that boeser is the passenger
4. identified Myers as the dman that needs to go if possible
5. identified trading Halak - he's got a good track record, and I believe hes a good goalie just canucks suck defensively, he should have value.
6. taking time with Miller/garland - Personally I wouldn't move Garland and only move Miller if we get a lot back.
would also trade Horvat as his value will likely decline in the future and he can't make a pass to save his life.
I get that everyone wants to see trades, but I’m fine waiting. I think it’s generally accepted that selling teams get the most value at the deadline, so waiting until then seems like a no brainer.
The fact we are waiting is a good sign as it would seem we are selling rather than making a dreaded “hockey trade”.
The fact we are waiting is a good sign as it would seem we are selling rather than making a dreaded “hockey trade”.
sting101
Registered User
- Feb 8, 2012
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BenningHurtsMySoul
Unfair Huggy Bear
What a colossal f***up that OEL trade was.
So now it's potentially Boeser, Miller and Garland that could be moved within the next few weeks.
Miller - should be getting an excellent haul, and if you don't, don't move him. 1st, A prospect, contributing NHLer under 25.
Boeser - 1st + B prospect + additional pick.
Garland - 1st + A prospect. Although I'd rather just have Dylan f***ing Guenther and no OEL.
So now it's potentially Boeser, Miller and Garland that could be moved within the next few weeks.
Miller - should be getting an excellent haul, and if you don't, don't move him. 1st, A prospect, contributing NHLer under 25.
Boeser - 1st + B prospect + additional pick.
Garland - 1st + A prospect. Although I'd rather just have Dylan f***ing Guenther and no OEL.
It was from Drance in an Athletic article:
I'm guessing he hasn't pointed to a specific rule in there? IIRC he was either on Donnie and Dhali or replied to a tweet and said "the canucks think they can trade the cap hit" so I'm wondering if they consulted with the league office about it.
Just A Bit Outside
Playoffs??!
- Mar 6, 2010
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Benning and Green should never have come back.
Then he proceeded to make one of the worst deals in history to save his ass.
Doing f*** all would have out this team in much better spot for new mgmt to move forward.
Its Aqua’s fault the team is in the shit position it’s in, purely because he didn’t get rid of Benning fast enough.
Melvin
21/12/05
Not to be a dick, but this is the same Drance who incorrectly reported all year that Halak's bonus was based on games played rather than games started. I don't take him as a CBA expert.
It all seems pretty murky.
In any case, I don't expect Halak to waive so it's probably moot.
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