Proposal: Edmonton - Philadelphia

[Maurice of Orange]

Acquires: F Michael Raffl, rights to C Gavin Hain and a 6th round pick in 2021

For

Acquires: F Alex Chiasson and the rights to C Filip Engaras

Edmonton acquires Raffl for Edmonton’s middle 6 as he may be more useful to a team like Edmonton and saves some on cap hit at 1.6mil x 1 season and can PK.

Philadelphia acquires Chiasson for Philadelphia’s bottom 6 as well more so for the 4th line, as Chiasson could be useful to Philadelphia for his size, something the Flyers could use as evident in the series against the Islanders. Chiasson hit is 2.15mil x 1 season.

Click to read more...

 

[Larry Hanson]

Would Philly even want Chiasson?
For 2.15M they could get a pretty decent player these days, Chiasson would almost surely clear waivers.

I guess the salary difference isn't so bad with Raffl going back the other way.

 

[Bounces R Way]

Chiasson is horrible and his value is further diminished in this cap environment. He scored 13 of his 24 points on what was a historic 29% PP by having McDrai bounce pucks off him. Raffl by comparison had 1 of his 20 points come on the man advantage.

No GM should be giving up anything even remotely useful for Alex Chiasson.

 

[Flyer lurker]

The Flyers glaring need in playoff was speed not size. Chissson won't play a lick on pp. So Flyers would give up ES points, defense, better pk ability 500k in cap for size.

Yeah that is a no from me.

 

[Tripod]

yeah...that's an easy no from this Flyers fan

 

[Maurice of Orange]

The Flyers glaring need in playoff was speed not size. Chissson won't play a lick on pp. So Flyers would give up ES points, defense, better pk ability 500k in cap for size.

Yeah that is a no from me.

Does it matter how fast you run into a wall, well in this case the Islanders trap I’d say probably not but if you have the size to match a team like the Islanders you could break that wall down.

Chiasson alone wouldn’t make a difference.
I just don’t get the hate for Chiasson and I’m not even a fan of his. He has average possession numbers with not that much less offensive zone starts then Raffl. He was decent on Edmonton’s power play and the last time I checked the Flyers PP wasn’t that great, does that justify trading a PK guy for a PP guy, probably not and again might not make a difference.

There is one thing Chiasson does have, that Raffl or any Flyer for that matter doesn’t a deep playoff experience run and a Stanley Cup ring to his name. That could make a difference in the locker room or on the ice when it matters. Chiasson did play a part in that run with Washington.

Also Chiasson is only 1 season removed from a 22 goal 38 point campaign in 18-19, so there could also be some untapped scoring that everyone else finds useless, a number of factors could come into play as well, linemates, ice time, ect ect...

Sometimes when trading it’s hard to lose a player that’s been a good soldier like Raffl has been but sometimes subtle changes or tweeks to the roster may eventually get a team like Philadelphia to the top.

 

[Maurice of Orange]

yeah...that's an easy no from this Flyers fan

Oh come on dawg... Tripod don’t dismiss this without thinking about it first.
Your one of the knowledgeable ones on the boards and well respected.
Look into this proposal...video, stats, underlying numbers or issues that could easily be dismissed.

 

[DropTheGloves]

Does it matter how fast you run into a wall, well in this case the Islanders trap I’d say probably not but if you have the size to match a team like the Islanders you could break that wall down.

Chiasson alone wouldn’t make a difference.
I just don’t get the hate for Chiasson and I’m not even a fan of his. He has average possession numbers with not that much less offensive zone starts then Raffl. He was decent on Edmonton’s power play and the last time I checked the Flyers PP wasn’t that great, does that justify trading a PK guy for a PP guy, probably not and again might not make a difference.

There is one thing Chiasson does have, that Raffl or any Flyer for that matter doesn’t a deep playoff experience run and a Stanley Cup ring to his name. That could make a difference in the locker room or on the ice when it matters. Chiasson did play a part in that run with Washington.

Also Chiasson is only 1 season removed from a 22 goal 38 point campaign in 18-19, so there could also be some untapped scoring that everyone else finds useless, a number of factors could come into play as well, linemates, ice time, ect ect...

Sometimes when trading it’s hard to lose a player that’s been a good soldier like Raffl has been but sometimes subtle changes or tweeks to the roster may eventually get a team like Philadelphia to the top.

Thanks for this. I don't think any Oiler fan expects serious value back for Chiasson, but at the end of the day he's a capable third line guy with a fairly benign contract who just has no spot on our team. If he can be swapped for a LW of comparable ability he should be and I don't see why that's such a controversial or crazy idea. Worst case, he costs you $2 mill and walks at the end of the year.

 

[FameFlame069]

Easily favours Edmonton

 

[Maurice of Orange]

Thanks for this. I don't think any Oiler fan expects serious value back for Chiasson, but at the end of the day he's a capable third line guy with a fairly benign contract who just has no spot on our team. If he can be swapped for a LW of comparable ability he should be and I don't see why that's such a controversial or crazy idea.

I believe both players would be more useful to their new teams if this was a real trade.

Raffl would make an above average 4th liner when he’s been used as high as a 1st liner a few years ago with Giroux and Voracek and I believe Raffl would be very good for Edmonton in a middle 6 role with players like Yamamoto, Neal, Turris and Puljujarvi.

Philly is very deep offensively so it would undoubtedly push Chiasson to Philadelphia’s 4th line where I believe he could be very suited for with Laughton and Aube-Kubel or Bunnaman.

I can see the complaints from the Flyers side losing a player of Raffl stature and PK abilities but the Flyers are loaded with defensive forwards that can PK.

Might philly lose ES points perhaps but Philadelphia has plenty of other players that should be able to make up for Raffl’s production + whatever Chiasson might be able to bring in difference.

 

[Maurice of Orange]

Easily favours Edmonton

Maybe it does in the short term as both Chiasson and Raffl are both UFA’s after this season (20-21) but there are other parts of this deal that are unknowns as players.

We haven’t talked about Filip Engaras or Gavin Hain yet.

 

[Flyer lurker]

Does it matter how fast you run into a wall, well in this case the Islanders trap I’d say probably not but if you have the size to match a team like the Islanders you could break that wall down.

Chiasson alone wouldn’t make a difference.
I just don’t get the hate for Chiasson and I’m not even a fan of his. He has average possession numbers with not that much less offensive zone starts then Raffl. He was decent on Edmonton’s power play and the last time I checked the Flyers PP wasn’t that great, does that justify trading a PK guy for a PP guy, probably not and again might not make a difference.

There is one thing Chiasson does have, that Raffl or any Flyer for that matter doesn’t a deep playoff experience run and a Stanley Cup ring to his name. That could make a difference in the locker room or on the ice when it matters. Chiasson did play a part in that run with Washington.

Also Chiasson is only 1 season removed from a 22 goal 38 point campaign in 18-19, so there could also be some untapped scoring that everyone else finds useless, a number of factors could come into play as well, linemates, ice time, ect ect...

Sometimes when trading it’s hard to lose a player that’s been a good soldier like Raffl has been but sometimes subtle changes or tweeks to the roster may eventually get a team like Philadelphia to the top.

1) OK so whose spot will Chisson take on the pp?
1)Giroux-Voracek-JVR-Provorov-Couturier
2)Konecky-Lindblom-Hayes-Gus-Ghost(or if Ghost traded Sanheim)
I am not even including Patrick who you hope stays healthy and progresses, Farabee, Frost or a .5 ppg Laughton. There is no shot in hades Chiasson sniffs the pp. If someone offers a star (Laine, Johnny Hockey)and asks for the moon because it helps the pp, ok I get the reasoning. Chiasson is the 11th pp forward option listed above.

We are opposite sides of the fence here. The issue AV had in the playoff was he chose size and experience over skill. AV thought the size and experience of Nate Thompson would be able to control the skill and speed of Barzal and Suzuki. It was a miserable failure. Size was no where near the biggest factor in the playoffs. The fear I have as a Flyers fan is AV is looking more at 6ft 2in 215lbs over pure skill. Frost not being used is concerning right now. You have MTL throwing a poor defensive winger in Drouin and you are putting out Derek Grant to defend him. It was Christmas, Happy Birthday, Valentine's day all rolled into one for habs. If you are a habs fans and Drouin messes up, its not like Derek Grant was going to make you pay.

How much did Chiasson's stanley cup experience help EDM last year again?

HUGE factor your reply ignored. Flyers lost Pitlick, Grant, Thompson on the PK and will have to play Rafll on pk. Would you rather have an 11th f option on pp or top 4ish option on pk.

Easy easy call. Pass on Chiasson.

 

[McSuper]

As an Oiler fan Chiasson has negative value . He is an ok player but in a flat cap world you can sign a much better player for 2.15 million .

The Philadelphia Flyers pass with extreme prejudice

 

[Maurice of Orange]

1) OK so whose spot will Chisson take on the pp?
1)Giroux-Voracek-JVR-Provorov-Couturier
2)Konecky-Lindblom-Hayes-Gus-Ghost(or if Ghost traded Sanheim)
I am not even including Patrick who you hope stays healthy and progresses, Farabee, Frost or a .5 ppg Laughton. There is no shot in hades Chiasson sniffs the pp. If someone offers a star (Laine, Johnny Hockey)and asks for the moon because it helps the pp, ok I get the reasoning. Chiasson is the 11th pp forward option listed above.

We are opposite sides of the fence here. The issue AV had in the playoff was he chose size and experience over skill. AV thought the size and experience of Nate Thompson would be able to control the skill and speed of Barzal and Suzuki. It was a miserable failure. Size was no where near the biggest factor in the playoffs. The fear I have as a Flyers fan is AV is looking more at 6ft 2in 215lbs over pure skill. Frost not being used is concerning right now. You have MTL throwing a poor defensive winger in Drouin and you are putting out Derek Grant to defend him. It was Christmas, Happy Birthday, Valentine's day all rolled into one for habs. If you are a habs fans and Drouin messes up, its not like Derek Grant was going to make you pay.

How much did Chiasson's stanley cup experience help EDM last year again?

HUGE factor your reply ignored. Flyers lost Pitlick, Grant, Thompson on the PK and will have to play Rafll on pk. Would you rather have an 11th f option on pp or top 4ish option on pk.

Easy easy call. Pass on Chiasson.

Ok I see your point about the Chiasson PP talk. Forget about that I agree with what you said about that.
What I don’t agree with is the size thing you were talking about.
I watched the same games you did as a Flyers fan and wasn’t pleased at all with either series.
AV shouldn’t have been rolling 4 lines aimlessly or putting Thompson and Grant out against the opposing teams best line after the Flyers just scored.
A lot of the problems came from poor coaching decisions from top to bottom but that’s not what we are talking about here.

It’s size and shot Chiasson verse speed and skill Raffl at about a 500k difference. Raffl is a good PK player. Chiasson wont be used on PP at all.
Flyers have plenty of forwards that can PK, I’d say the only ones that can’t or won’t are Voracek, JVR and maybe Frost.

This might sound odd but I don’t want Chiasson except for ES and possession. Yea 8 goals and 20 points might be lost without Raffl but Lindblom is back Farabee will have more experience Frost should emerge and the prodigal son Patrick may return so there should be plenty of goals to go around for philly in 20-21, also it’s not goals I’m worried about it’s stopping them from being scored on Philadelphia that concerns me I don’t believe Raffl makes a difference for that matter on PK or ES.

Also Edmonton as a whole team struggled that’s why they didn’t make it, didn’t matter if Chiasson was there or not.

What kinda question was that though, I don’t want you mad at me lurker just having a friendly conversation, if it helps I am a Flyers fan just trying to come from an unbiased POV and I have nothing against Raffl as a player.
He’s been a good Rafflchopper....

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Chiasson has negative value. If the Oilers could have dumped his contract for free, they would have by now.

 

[Flyer lurker]

Ok I see your point about the Chiasson PP talk. Forget about that I agree with what you said about that.
What I don’t agree with is the size thing you were talking about.
I watched the same games you did as a Flyers fan and wasn’t pleased at all with either series.
AV shouldn’t have been rolling 4 lines aimlessly or putting Thompson and Grant out against the opposing teams best line after the Flyers just scored.
A lot of the problems came from poor coaching decisions from top to bottom but that’s not what we are talking about here.

It’s size and shot Chiasson verse speed and skill Raffl at about a 500k difference. Raffl is a good PK player. Chiasson wont be used on PP at all.
Flyers have plenty of forwards that can PK, I’d say the only ones that can’t or won’t are Voracek, JVR and maybe Frost.

This might sound odd but I don’t want Chiasson except for ES and possession. Yea 8 goals and 20 points might be lost without Raffl but Lindblom is back Farabee will have more experience Frost should emerge and the prodigal son Patrick may return so there should be plenty of goals to go around for philly in 20-21, also it’s not goals I’m worried about it’s stopping them from being scored on Philadelphia that concerns me I don’t believe Raffl makes a difference for that matter on PK or ES.

Also Edmonton as a whole team struggled that’s why they didn’t make it, didn’t matter if Chiasson was there or not.
What kinda question was that though, I don’t want you mad at me lurker just having a friendly conversation, if it helps I am a Flyers fan just trying to come from an unbiased POV and I have nothing against Raffl as a player.
He’s been a good Rafflchopper....

The Flyers do not have a lot of forward who can pk. The one player the Flyers lost in free agency who they will miss is Pitlick. He was fast, and excellent on pk. But you have to give wing time to Lindblom, Farabee, etc for their progress. Do you want to play in a likely condensed schedule Giroux and Couturier on pk1 and pp1? Patrick and Lindblom for the first 20 games I would think you are controlling their minutes and make sure they are ok.

AV's coaching was weak in playoffs at best. One goal game 3 minutes to go v Isles and Thompson and Hagg on the ice v Barzal. Wow I am shocked Barzal line scored. Same when Thompson was in against Suzuki in MTL game winner game 5.

Agreed puck possession time is an issue for Flyers and seeing Hagg/Braun in the 40% CF is annoying as ****.

 

[Maurice of Orange]

What I’m going on so far is that Edmonton takes this trade but Philadelphia doesn’t except it.

The Flyers could go out and sign an FA at Chissson’s salary but there’s no point in adding an another player to an already loaded Flyers roster.

Just proposed a player for player deal with prospects involved.

Edmonton’s prospect Filip Engaras is an interesting player and might be better then Hain and thought it might balance the value in the future part of the deal as the now part of the deal favored Edmonton with 550k off their cap.

Just trying to be fair to both teams and even though I am a Flyers fan I don’t usually make proposals involving my favorite team.

 

[Tripod]

Oh come on dawg... Tripod don’t dismiss this without thinking about it first.
Your one of the knowledgeable ones on the boards and well respected.
Look into this proposal...video, stats, underlying numbers or issues that could easily be dismissed.

Thank you for the props.

But this is bad, and you should feel bad.

Hang your head in shame.

 

[majormajor]

Chiasson actually has been a fine Edmonton Oiler. He didn't score much last year but he was one of only a couple Oilers bottom sixers that didn't get caved in / massively outscored. The reason for this fuss is that they have too many RW. If I was trying to pawn someone onto the Flyers it would be Jujhar Khaira. You want to get big and tough? Here's your guy.

 

[flyerslducks]

Does it matter how fast you run into a wall, well in this case the Islanders trap I’d say probably not but if you have the size to match a team like the Islanders you could break that wall down.

Chiasson alone wouldn’t make a difference.
I just don’t get the hate for Chiasson and I’m not even a fan of his. He has average possession numbers with not that much less offensive zone starts then Raffl. He was decent on Edmonton’s power play and the last time I checked the Flyers PP wasn’t that great, does that justify trading a PK guy for a PP guy, probably not and again might not make a difference.

There is one thing Chiasson does have, that Raffl or any Flyer for that matter doesn’t a deep playoff experience run and a Stanley Cup ring to his name. That could make a difference in the locker room or on the ice when it matters. Chiasson did play a part in that run with Washington.

Also Chiasson is only 1 season removed from a 22 goal 38 point campaign in 18-19, so there could also be some untapped scoring that everyone else finds useless, a number of factors could come into play as well, linemates, ice time, ect ect...

Sometimes when trading it’s hard to lose a player that’s been a good soldier like Raffl has been but sometimes subtle changes or tweeks to the roster may eventually get a team like Philadelphia to the top.

chiasson will never even be on the flyers pp units and our pp will be better this year with Patrick, frost, lindblom, and ghost being better.

Flyers units:
pp1: couts, giroux, voracek, jvr, ghost/provorov
pp2: 5 of hayes, tk, lindblom, farabee, frost, patrick, ghost/provorov, sanheim. No way chiasson is good enough to take these guys out lol

 

[flyerslducks]

The Flyers do not have a lot of forward who can pk. The one player the Flyers lost in free agency who they will miss is Pitlick. He was fast, and excellent on pk. But you have to give wing time to Lindblom, Farabee, etc for their progress. Do you want to play in a likely condensed schedule Giroux and Couturier on pk1 and pp1? Patrick and Lindblom for the first 20 games I would think you are controlling their minutes and make sure they are ok.

AV's coaching was weak in playoffs at best. One goal game 3 minutes to go v Isles and Thompson and Hagg on the ice v Barzal. Wow I am shocked Barzal line scored. Same when Thompson was in against Suzuki in MTL game winner game 5.

Agreed puck possession time is an issue for Flyers and seeing Hagg/Braun in the 40% CF is annoying as ****.

giroux only plays on the pk if needed due to injury. He will however, take a lot of draws but will immediately come off. Also the flyers have a ton of guys who can be on the pk: couts, hayes, laughton, raffl, lindblom, farabee, Patrick, giroux, sandin.. I can easily see lindblom and farabee being on the pk. Lindblom was on it frequently and farabee was given some looks. Looking forward to seeing him expand his game as he gets stronger. NAK can and will replace pitlicks production while farabee/lindblom/patrick/sandin/nak can fill in on the pk.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

I’d waive Chiasson to free cap. I doubt he’d be claimed. Though a league min contract in place frees up 500,000. We need to get creative if we want to have the financial ability to fill holes. LTIR Klefbom helps but we still need to sign Bear and somehow add a top 6 winger

 

[Soundwave]

I’d waive Chiasson to free cap. I doubt he’d be claimed. Though a league min contract in place frees up 500,000. We need to get creative if we want to have the financial ability to fill holes. LTIR Klefbom helps but we still need to sign Bear and somehow add a top 6 winger

The Oilers can basically do all that as is simply by utilizing paper transactions of AHL recalls on day 1 of the season and then putting Klefbom on the LTIR.

You can sign Bear and then have about $2 million to sign an additional winger.

 

[1865]

Acquires: F Michael Raffl, rights to C Gavin Hain and a 6th round pick in 2021

For

Acquires: F Alex Chiasson and the rights to C Filip Engaras

Edmonton acquires Raffl for Edmonton’s middle 6 as he may be more useful to a team like Edmonton and saves some on cap hit at 1.6mil x 1 season and can PK.

Philadelphia acquires Chiasson for Philadelphia’s bottom 6 as well more so for the 4th line, as Chiasson could be useful to Philadelphia for his size, something the Flyers could use as evident in the series against the Islanders. Chiasson hit is 2.15mil x 1 season.

I don't get it. We give up a useful middle six guy for a more expensive bottom line guy... and we throw in a pick?

 

[Jumptheshark]

Acquires: F Michael Raffl, rights to C Gavin Hain and a 6th round pick in 2021

For

Acquires: F Alex Chiasson and the rights to C Filip Engaras

Edmonton acquires Raffl for Edmonton’s middle 6 as he may be more useful to a team like Edmonton and saves some on cap hit at 1.6mil x 1 season and can PK.

Philadelphia acquires Chiasson for Philadelphia’s bottom 6 as well more so for the 4th line, as Chiasson could be useful to Philadelphia for his size, something the Flyers could use as evident in the series against the Islanders. Chiasson hit is 2.15mil x 1 season.

Easy no from flyers